Jesus wins the popularity contest
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27-02-2014, 03:35 PM
RE: Jesus wins the popularity contest
(27-02-2014 02:56 PM)Paranoidsam Wrote:  
(27-02-2014 02:39 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Oh I'll have to think about that. Consider

This might help you decide...




Oh wow...Peter Green was a bit more diverse than Clapton but both have merit. I suppose it depends on my mood which one I favor.

Right now, I dismiss them both and I'm going with Jorma Kaukonen. Big Grin


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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27-02-2014, 04:11 PM
RE: Jesus wins the popularity contest
(27-02-2014 03:35 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(27-02-2014 02:56 PM)Paranoidsam Wrote:  This might help you decide...




Oh wow...Peter Green was a bit more diverse than Clapton but both have merit. I suppose it depends on my mood which one I favor.

Right now, I dismiss them both and I'm going with Jorma Kaukonen. Big Grin

I've never heard of him, so therefore as Arch Overseer of the First Church of the Green Manalishi, I declare the worship of Jorma Kaukonen to be heresy.

May the Green One have mercy on your soul... Big Grin

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27-02-2014, 04:11 PM
RE: Jesus wins the popularity contest
(27-02-2014 03:26 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  I don't think I've ever heard that argument twisted that way.

It's also very odd when you acknowledge the popularity of Mohammed, but another thing many Christians like to gloss past.
When Jesus is not the top person on the "most influential people in history" lists, it tends to be Muhammad.

"Religion has caused more misery to all of mankind in every stage of human history than any other single idea." --Madalyn Murray O'Hair
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27-02-2014, 04:58 PM
RE: Jesus wins the popularity contest
(27-02-2014 01:25 PM)donotwant Wrote:  And btw if christianity is going to lose popularity in future and another religion will come about does it mean the new religion becomes the truth all of a sudden? XD

Yes, if "truth" is taken as what your peers tell you it is, the real worry is that someone gets hold of some advanced tech that will give them tangible proof of their claims.

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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27-02-2014, 05:03 PM
RE: Jesus wins the popularity contest
(27-02-2014 04:11 PM)Impulse Wrote:  
(27-02-2014 03:26 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  I don't think I've ever heard that argument twisted that way.

It's also very odd when you acknowledge the popularity of Mohammed, but another thing many Christians like to gloss past.
When Jesus is not the top person on the "most influential people in history" lists, it tends to be Muhammad.

Tell that to the man that did more for the gospel than any man, next to Jesus of course.
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And it must be true cuz he looks good in paintings, marble, bronze and stained glass!
[Image: 063-1.gif][Image: joseph-smith-statue-5900523.jpg][Image: first-vision-stained-glass-window-tom-ho...60x240.jpg]
Just look over the fact that he had to look at rocks in a hat to write a fanfiction and that he had many wives at once without Emma's okay like the rest of his silky underwear wearing fanclub does!
Seriously though, I doubt Joe Smith really out beats Muhammad in an important people list. Especially if you look a this Times list (unless it's backwards day and #55 is better than #3). If you ask anyone in the LDS church (that lacks LSD and if there is any LSD why wasn't I informed?) he defiantly does. Sorry, just had to blurt that all out because that was my natural reaction somehow.

Anyways,in response to the actual thread topic, I think Jesus is popular (like said before) if you include all the little branches that include him into their beliefs. It seems like an awful lot of them do.

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27-02-2014, 06:46 PM
RE: Jesus wins the popularity contest
(27-02-2014 01:27 PM)Tartarus Sauce Wrote:  The most overrated and overhyped figure of all time.

Well said! So true!

The truth is the guy presented in the gospels was a zero.

A philosopher has credentials, but the character portrayed as Jesus didn’t. He was uneducated and illiterate. Galilean peasant society was insular and primitive, even by the standards of the times. Yeshua might’ve been clever and charismatic, yet he knew nothing of the philosophy and science of the Greek and Roman world. Non-Jewish law, ethics, history, art and literature were a mystery to Yeshua. So the person portrayed as Jesus wasn’t qualified to be a philosophy teacher, and it shows.

The Jesus character was a deluded dreamer who made wild promises that didn’t come true. He was judgmental, intolerant, inconsistent, egocentric and ethnocentric. He failed to give consistent or comprehensive solutions to life’s conundrums. Most of his teachings lack the detail to make them meaningful. Dogma without reasoning and explanation doesn’t cut the mustard as philosophy.

Commendable philosophers are seekers of truth and admirers of wisdom who propose answers to the mysteries of life and the universe after a reasoned analysis. They see through gloss to discover substance. They occasionally come up with profound one-liners (aphorisms) such as “E=mc squared” or “I think, therefore I am,” but these are the products of elaborate reasoning. Jesus’ numerous one-liners only proposed unsatisfactory simplistic solutions to complex problems.

Good philosophers have open minds and are genuinely interested in others’ opinions. They don’t assume or pretend they alone have all the answers. They care enough about their audience to document their ideas with precision and detail. They’re aware that one day their ideas may appear outdated. Much of what Jesus said was a dictatorial diatribe that failed to do any of this.

Truly inspiring words in great books, poetry, or speeches have a timeless coherency and consistency to them. Jesus’ teachings don’t. If they were sent to a publisher who’d never read the Bible, they’d garner a pink slip. He’d assume Jesus was a dunce.

Many people argue that everything he said was perfect because he was god. This is just blind, unreasoned faith, and it can’t rescue Jesus from a thinking, critical public. (http://www.richardcarrier.info/McFallRebuttal1.html).

Some claim it was the fact Jesus became a man that’s what matters; that his primary purpose was to save the world from its sins. Paul invented this idea, but he’d never heard Jesus’ teachings. This is why the true founder of Christianity didn’t consider Christ a philosopher, yet wrote volumes propounding his own philosophy.

Many people disagree with me. I think they too easily accept any of the thousands of books and articles that try to explain, harmonize or “contextualize” Jesus’ sayings. All this commentary is heavily manufactured; it resorts to artificial and arbitrary interpretations rather than simply taking what are said to be Jesus’ words at face value. There’s no other way to make Jesus sound authoritative and wise, yet I think it’s intellectually dishonest. (
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl...4QXOgVfY9k ).
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4bAhGHiA...qGfTSmVTss ).
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27-02-2014, 07:49 PM
RE: Jesus wins the popularity contest
(27-02-2014 01:25 PM)donotwant Wrote:  And btw if christianity is going to lose popularity in future and another religion will come about does it mean the new religion becomes the truth all of a sudden? XD

Yes, sort of like how Christianity wasn't true until it became the largest religion, somewhat recently in history. Because Christians totally believe Jesus wasn't real back when the religion was in its infancy.

This is why I hate when they use that argument.
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27-02-2014, 08:44 PM
RE: Jesus wins the popularity contest
(27-02-2014 01:04 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  I wish Christians would just up and confess that Christianity and/or the belief in Jesus is simply faith-based.

It's very refreshing to hear a Christian say that.
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28-02-2014, 02:14 AM
RE: Jesus wins the popularity contest
(27-02-2014 08:44 PM)freetoreason Wrote:  
(27-02-2014 01:04 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  I wish Christians would just up and confess that Christianity and/or the belief in Jesus is simply faith-based.

It's very refreshing to hear a Christian say that.

Yes. Then they should admit that faith is bollocks.
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03-03-2014, 05:09 AM
RE: Jesus wins the popularity contest
(27-02-2014 12:05 PM)Impulse Wrote:  Do any of you ever get this argument from Christians? They say Jesus was the most influential person in history so therefore there must be some truth to his being divine. Rolleyes I'm just curious what arguments you present against this.

A family member said this to me recently and what I replied was if no one had ever heard of Jesus, then someone else would have been the most influential and would that person then have had to be divine? Consider And I added that Jesus also has the biggest PR campaign of anyone else in history - with all the proselytizing and missionary work that Christians do - it's no wonder he has had such influence.


I'd respond that the only thing that was needed was a belief in Jesus, he didn't actually need to have existed. How would things be any different if Jesus was just a myth? Things would be identical to what we see now. Compare this to if Julius Caesar had been just a myth? History is dependent on Caesar having crossed the Rubicon and eventually defeating Pompey and setting himself up as the de facto leader and started the Roman Empire. If this had all been just a myth and had never actually happened, world history as we know it would be much different than it is now.

If they then go down the 'how do you explain the success of Christianity' line, ask them to explain the success of Mormonism, Islam, Buddhism, and Hinduism; two of which predate Judaism (let alone Christianity) itself. If merely being old and having a lot of follows is your indicator of truth, then by that logic Christianity is not the only game in town. Even if you think Christianity is authentic, then they still have to explain how all of these other false religions could also be successful; and why those reasons can't also apply to Christianity.

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