Justification of hell?
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17-09-2013, 03:52 AM
 
RE: Justification of hell?
(17-09-2013 03:36 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  But seriously....many Christian believe faith alone isn't enough for salvation...it must be backed up by good works. Hence the mythology of St Peter meeting you at the Pearly Gates of Heaven and comparing your good deeds to your bad.

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17-09-2013, 04:16 AM
RE: Justification of hell?
(17-09-2013 03:52 AM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  
(17-09-2013 03:36 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  But seriously....many Christian believe faith alone isn't enough for salvation...it must be backed up by good works. Hence the mythology of St Peter meeting you at the Pearly Gates of Heaven and comparing your good deeds to your bad.

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17-09-2013, 04:36 AM
RE: Justification of hell?
(17-09-2013 04:16 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(17-09-2013 03:52 AM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  [Image: 23471605.jpg]

The spiderman memes are so 2010.


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17-09-2013, 05:15 AM
RE: Justification of hell?
(16-09-2013 09:26 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(16-09-2013 09:17 PM)southernbelle Wrote:  I second this motion. I've only been on here for about a month and already PleaseJesus, Mark Dreher, absols, and one more whose name I can't remember have me wanting to bludgeon someone or something. And I'm not normally a violent person. They're doing the exact opposite of what they intent and making me hate religion and religious people more with each post I see.

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17-09-2013, 05:43 AM
 
RE: Justification of hell?
(17-09-2013 05:15 AM)Chas Wrote:  No, what we need is a forum team willing to do the work of actually moderating the place. Drinking Beverage

Chas, did you use to be a moderator in the past?
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17-09-2013, 06:30 AM
RE: Justification of hell?
(17-09-2013 05:43 AM)Philosoraptor Wrote:  
(17-09-2013 05:15 AM)Chas Wrote:  No, what we need is a forum team willing to do the work of actually moderating the place. Drinking Beverage

Chas, did you use to be a moderator in the past?

Yes.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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17-09-2013, 06:59 AM
RE: Justification of hell?
(12-09-2013 09:29 AM)DeavonReye Wrote:  I have heard a doctrine [from the denomination I was involved with] that it wasn't JUST christians who are ressurected with new bodies, but also the sinners as well "so they could feel the torment of hell". I found that to be the most repulsive doctrine and was dumbfounded that someone would STILL serve a god who would create such a mechanism . . . merely for those who didn't "believe he existed". The most absurdly heinous philosophy ever devised by man.

My grandfather was a firm believer in this philosophy. He would tell me all these "wonderful" stories about the end of days and how our bodies would be reborn, and how everyone would have beautiful, eternal bodies, and live eternally in heaven. Except those heathens, who would burn eternally in those same wonderful bodies.

Hell is still something that gives me nightmares. Thanks, grandpa. Shocking

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17-09-2013, 08:35 AM
 
RE: Justification of hell?
(17-09-2013 06:59 AM)PharaohKatt Wrote:  
(12-09-2013 09:29 AM)DeavonReye Wrote:  I have heard a doctrine [from the denomination I was involved with] that it wasn't JUST christians who are ressurected with new bodies, but also the sinners as well "so they could feel the torment of hell". I found that to be the most repulsive doctrine and was dumbfounded that someone would STILL serve a god who would create such a mechanism . . . merely for those who didn't "believe he existed". The most absurdly heinous philosophy ever devised by man.

My grandfather was a firm believer in this philosophy. He would tell me all these "wonderful" stories about the end of days and how our bodies would be reborn, and how everyone would have beautiful, eternal bodies, and live eternally in heaven. Except those heathens, who would burn eternally in those same wonderful bodies.

Hell is still something that gives me nightmares. Thanks, grandpa. Shocking

Well, as I've been saying in other threads, such a philosophy is unsupported by the Bible - Paul seemed to have believed that only the saved would live eternally (Romans 2:7, 1 Cor. 15).

Which leads us to the question - why would anyone want eternal hell to be true? I've seen or heard some Christians (who I used to admire for their "Godliness") talking about salvation, and they were literally rejoicing over how Jesus would burn all those 'heathens' in hell - "thank God for Jesus holding the keys of hell" or something like that. This is more evidence for the theory that religion dehumanizes people by making them immune to compassion towards a fellow human being, simply because he doesn't hold the same beliefs.

But infant salvation - that's another story altogether. Almost every one of those zealous Christians knows someone who lost a child to miscarriage or SIDS. Then they assure each other how their babies are now in heaven. But this poses a significant problem for theologians, because there are two mutually exclusive options:

1. Unbaptized infants are not saved - they'll burn in hell. This is unacceptable.
2. Unbaptized infants are saved - which would make abortion an act of charity, because it prevents a person from reaching an age in which (s)he can sin and end up in hell. Furthermore, if not hearing the Gospel spares one from accountability, this renders Jesus's sacrifice, and consequently evangelism, unnecessary. This is unacceptable as well.

Chew on that, fundies. Big Grin
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17-09-2013, 02:12 PM
RE: Justification of hell?
(17-09-2013 06:59 AM)PharaohKatt Wrote:  My grandfather was a firm believer in this philosophy. He would tell me all these "wonderful" stories about the end of days and how our bodies would be reborn, and how everyone would have beautiful, eternal bodies, and live eternally in heaven. Except those heathens, who would burn eternally in those same wonderful bodies.

Hell is still something that gives me nightmares. Thanks, grandpa. Shocking

The good news is, even if Hell were a real place [and it isn't], you still wouldn't go there due to one constantly overlooked verse in the bible. Only "the Devil and his angels" go to hell, . . . and for which hell was made.
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18-09-2013, 06:20 AM
RE: Justification of hell?
(17-09-2013 03:36 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(16-09-2013 04:48 AM)Hafnof Wrote:  Now your theology had diverged from standard Christian thought: Since when was entry to heaven earned? Is it by grace or works that we are saved?
But seriously....many Christian believe faith alone isn't enough for salvation...it must be backed up by good works. Hence the mythology of St Peter meeting you at the Pearly Gates of Heaven and comparing your good deeds to your bad.

Many Christians? What branch of Christianity do you follow exactly?

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
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