Korea
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08-08-2017, 02:52 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 02:32 PM)epronovost Wrote:  The blustering and threat of violence from both side comes from the fact that neither camp openly desire a war knowing that cost to North Korea would be defeat, but the prize of the winner would be spoiled by high casualties amongst key regional allies and by the fact that neither side has any good strategy on how to win the conflict in a non-violent way. They can only hope that one side will ''chicken away''. Its a 6th grader bully level of strategy applied to the international level.
Trump is a typical gung ho bully.

USA has thousands of ICBMs and nukes and yet cries when other countries develop the weapons.

If USA strike Korea based only on Korea's development of weapons that USA already has, my support is towards Korea. Gung ho does not cut the mustard, USA need to stop bullying other countries. USA need to get with the global warming programme and stop threatening countries with their weapons and sanctions.
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08-08-2017, 02:56 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 02:42 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  We can't wait to see if he's bluffing.
You really are an idiot.
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08-08-2017, 02:58 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 02:50 PM)Grasshopper Wrote:  
(08-08-2017 02:42 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  Well I live on the western side of the U.S.

A madman has threatened to strike the U.S. with nukes. Now it comes out that he most likely possesses the ability to do so.

We can't wait to see if he's bluffing.

So you're afraid that he might take it into his loony head to nuke us? And your solution is to take action that practically guarantees that he will nuke us? Forgive me if I don't see the logic of that.

They won't be able to nuke us. I guarantee you we will overwhelm them in a day. Stealth bombers at 2am. Followed by a wave of tomahawk missiles. And then reigning hell by countless strike aircraft on everything they have. They are seriously not prepared for what will hit them. Kim Jong Ding Dong is toast.

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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08-08-2017, 03:01 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 02:58 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  
(08-08-2017 02:50 PM)Grasshopper Wrote:  So you're afraid that he might take it into his loony head to nuke us? And your solution is to take action that practically guarantees that he will nuke us? Forgive me if I don't see the logic of that.

They won't be able to nuke us. I guarantee you we will overwhelm them in a day. Stealth bombers at 2am. Followed by a wave of tomahawk missiles. And then reigning hell by countless strike aircraft on everything they have. They are seriously not prepared for what will hit them. Kim Jong Ding Dong is toast.

I'm not as confident as you that we have the capability to do that, but even supposing we do, doing so before they do anything to us is the equivalent of shooting someone for no better reason than that you're afraid that they might shoot you. It would make us both cowards and murderers.
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08-08-2017, 03:08 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 02:58 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  
(08-08-2017 02:50 PM)Grasshopper Wrote:  So you're afraid that he might take it into his loony head to nuke us? And your solution is to take action that practically guarantees that he will nuke us? Forgive me if I don't see the logic of that.

They won't be able to nuke us. I guarantee you we will overwhelm them in a day. Stealth bombers at 2am. Followed by a wave of tomahawk missiles. And then reigning hell by countless strike aircraft on everything they have. They are seriously not prepared for what will hit them. Kim Jong Ding Dong is toast.

I think China (and Russia) noticed when Lindsay Graham said "yes, there is a military option....we take the fight there. We destroy North Korea". If we wanted to attack and not leave the ability to respond,, we could do it, but not without destroying North Korea. A combination of air and ground detonations of nuclear weapons would take out defense systems (and kill a ton of people) leaving nothing to respond with and nobody to do the responding.

That is not an option I would ever want to exercise. But it has to be an option if N Korea keeps saying it is going to nuke the US. To say war is impossible because of there being too high a cost to ourselves ignores the possibility that we utilize an annihilation strategy to attack N Korea. It is the moral cost, not loss of US military or even S Korea's capitol, that limits us from taking that step.
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08-08-2017, 03:12 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 03:01 PM)Grasshopper Wrote:  
(08-08-2017 02:58 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  They won't be able to nuke us. I guarantee you we will overwhelm them in a day. Stealth bombers at 2am. Followed by a wave of tomahawk missiles. And then reigning hell by countless strike aircraft on everything they have. They are seriously not prepared for what will hit them. Kim Jong Ding Dong is toast.

I'm not as confident as you that we have the capability to do that, but even supposing we do, doing so before they do anything to us is the equivalent of shooting someone for no better reason than that you're afraid that they might shoot you. It would make us both cowards and murderers.

I disagree. If someone points a gun at you, you don't have to wait for them to pull the trigger to shoot back at them. Hell, in most jurisdictions a threat while also displaying a weapon is enough to defend yourself. On the police force, to use deadly force in self defense the suspect had to have opportunity, capability and intent. They didn't even have to point the gun at us. If we could see the gun and they refuse to put hands up (capability), we didn't have immediate cover (opportunity) and they verbalized a threat (intent) we could shoot. I'd say the North Korean government has made it clear that they have the capability and intent. Do they have the opportunity? They could fire right now for all we know. All 3 conditions are met for self defense.

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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08-08-2017, 03:18 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 03:12 PM)Lord Dark Helmet Wrote:  
(08-08-2017 03:01 PM)Grasshopper Wrote:  I'm not as confident as you that we have the capability to do that, but even supposing we do, doing so before they do anything to us is the equivalent of shooting someone for no better reason than that you're afraid that they might shoot you. It would make us both cowards and murderers.

I disagree. If someone points a gun at you, you don't have to wait for them to pull the trigger to shoot back at them. Hell, in most jurisdictions a threat while also displaying a weapon is enough to defend yourself. On the police force, to use deadly force in self defense the suspect had to have opportunity, capability and intent. They didn't even have to point the gun at us. If we could see the gun and they refuse to put hands up (capability), we didn't have immediate cover (opportunity) and they verbalized a threat (intent) we could shoot. I'd say the North Korean government has made it clear that they have the capability and intent. Do they have the opportunity? They could fire right now for all we know. All 3 conditions are met for self defense.

They're not pointing the gun at us, only threatening to, and they have not demonstrated any "intent" -- or maybe only the intent to defend themselves. Attacking them at this point would be cowardly and murderous, unless we had clear evidence (not just paranoid suspicion) that they were about to attack us. I would be ashamed of my country (even more than I already am).
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08-08-2017, 03:22 PM
RE: Korea
Also -- if you have a way to take out Kim Jong-whatever (I have trouble keeping the names straight) and only him, I might not have such a big problem with that. But it would be criminal to kill millions of innocent North Korean citizens (who are his victims, if anything) just because we're wetting our pants in fear. We used to be better than that.
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08-08-2017, 03:32 PM
RE: Korea
Trump said almost a year ago: If we have nukes, why not use them?

https://www.cnbc.com/video/3000540110

Can't seem to import that video. It's really short...

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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08-08-2017, 03:45 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 03:32 PM)Dom Wrote:  Trump said almost a year ago: If we have nukes, why not use them?

https://www.cnbc.com/video/3000540110

Can't seem to import that video. It's really short...

"unnamed sources" of course

"Evil will always triumph over good, because good is dumb." - Lord Dark Helmet
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