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08-08-2017, 05:17 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 04:40 PM)abaris Wrote:  
(08-08-2017 04:30 PM)jerry mcmasters Wrote:  I don't envy those that have to make the actual calls on this. Do nothing and we're putting off a threat that's just going to get worse every year.

That's hyperbole. The one and only reason why Kim is beating the war drum is to remind everyone that he has the bomb. His very own life insurance. The Kims are living the high life at the expanse of their population. They won't strike first, but one shouldn't take them for fools. They follow the news closely and the drum beating coming from this particular American administration or the parody thereoff. They also know that new sanctions have been negotiated. So it's a good time to remind everyone of their nuclear abilities.

Do nothing is exactly what everybody should strive for.

It's not hyperbole. If today they can hit location X and next year they can hit location x and y and five years from now they can hit location x, y, and z then literally the threat is getting worse every year. So forget his intentions for a moment, assume either he isn't the rational actor you presume or assume there is a false warning he gets- nobody's attacking him but a malfunction goes off or whatever, these things do happen or are at least possible. The threat is worse if this happens when he can blow up x,y, and z rather than just x.

That said, I totally agree with your post. His main and maybe sole objective is to be guaranteed to remain in power. That's pretty much it, from that position he can continue to treat his people like ants. As the best of shitty options, "Do nothing" as you say is the best option, play the long game, maybe twenty years from now there is a radical shift in factors and we can de-escalate this whole thing. I hope people in power realize how horrific the results are going to be if we think we (the US) can "first gulf war" these guys with a blitzkrieg. But who knows for sure.

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08-08-2017, 05:27 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 02:31 PM)BryanS Wrote:  Frankly, we should be taking advantage of this situation to reshape security in Southeast Asia. We could get Japan and S Korea to significantly upgrade their military capabilities as a result of N Korea's programs. China will find it has to deal with an increased military capability among US allies in its neighborhood as a price for playing N Korea against the US too far and for too long. That is already starting to happen, and probably a significant reason both China and Russia supported the last UN resolution.

This is why THAAD and joint exercises are not bad responses. They not only buttress the defenses of our allies, they also are very visible messages.

(I think you meant to write Northeast Asia, though -- forgive my pedantry.)
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08-08-2017, 05:35 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 04:40 PM)abaris Wrote:  
(08-08-2017 04:30 PM)jerry mcmasters Wrote:  I don't envy those that have to make the actual calls on this. Do nothing and we're putting off a threat that's just going to get worse every year.

That's hyperbole. The one and only reason why Kim is beating the war drum is to remind everyone that he has the bomb. His very own life insurance. The Kims are living the high life at the expanse of their population. They won't strike first, but one shouldn't take them for fools. They follow the news closely and the drum beating coming from this particular American administration or the parody thereoff. They also know that new sanctions have been negotiated. So it's a good time to remind everyone of their nuclear abilities.

Do nothing is exactly what everybody should strive for.

Exactly, Un will not fire the first shot, because once he has, his arsenal has lost 100% of the value it held for the regime -- that of insurance policy.

Everybody needs to take a deep breath, and give the new sanctions time to hopefully hit their intended targets.
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08-08-2017, 05:38 PM
RE: Korea
The problem is that we have crazed shitgibbon in the white house. The man with 5 deferments has a need to think he is tough.

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08-08-2017, 06:17 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 05:35 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  Exactly, Un will not fire the first shot, because once he has, his arsenal has lost 100% of the value it held for the regime -- that of insurance policy.

Everybody needs to take a deep breath, and give the new sanctions time to hopefully hit their intended targets.

In my opinion, if Trump starts a Second Korean War without congressional approval, and hundreds of thousands die in South Korea as a consequence, congress could impeach Trump on that alone.
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08-08-2017, 06:35 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 05:38 PM)Minimalist Wrote:  The problem is that we have crazed shitgibbon in the white house. The man with 5 deferments has a need to think he is tough.

Through no good intention of his own, he's surrounded himself with three generals in key positions who have all imbibed the same doctrine for three+ decades. Of all the Administration, they know what's going on in the outside world, and they know how to work together as a team. He's about to learn what tough is ... and it ain't him.

Some nonexistent god will have to forgive me cheering on a military triumvirate, but I do think that they will work together to handcuff this jackoff before the silos get warmed up.
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08-08-2017, 06:38 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 06:17 PM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  
(08-08-2017 05:35 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  Exactly, Un will not fire the first shot, because once he has, his arsenal has lost 100% of the value it held for the regime -- that of insurance policy.

Everybody needs to take a deep breath, and give the new sanctions time to hopefully hit their intended targets.

In my opinion, if Trump starts a Second Korean War without congressional approval, and hundreds of thousands die in South Korea as a consequence, congress could impeach Trump on that alone.

"If" he does, sure. It's seem to violate the laws regulating civilian military leadership absent an immediate threat.
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08-08-2017, 06:52 PM
RE: Korea
Doing some reading it seems that all the attention being paid US/Korea tensions is warily watching an annoying tick while ignoring the dragon next door. How much will our having given an ignorant bully the keys cost the world? Shocking
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08-08-2017, 07:04 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 06:52 PM)Airportkid Wrote:  Doing some reading it seems that all the attention being paid US/Korea tensions is warily watching an annoying tick while ignoring the dragon next door. How much will our having given an ignorant bully the keys cost the world? Shocking

Isn't that Bannon's thing? War with China?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/...56546.html

Quote:“We’re going to war in the South China Sea in five to 10 years, aren’t we?” Mr Bannon said on his radio show in March 2016. “There’s no doubt about that. They’re taking their sandbars and making basically stationary aircraft carriers and putting missiles on those. They come here to the United States in front of our face — and you understand how important face is — and say it’s an ancient territorial sea.”

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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08-08-2017, 07:08 PM
RE: Korea
(08-08-2017 06:38 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  
(08-08-2017 06:17 PM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  In my opinion, if Trump starts a Second Korean War without congressional approval, and hundreds of thousands die in South Korea as a consequence, congress could impeach Trump on that alone.

"If" he does, sure. It's seem to violate the laws regulating civilian military leadership absent an immediate threat.

I wonder if Trump will try to get himself one of those "blank check" use of force permission from Congress. Don't really need a declaration of war. LBJ got one for Vietnam after Tonkin Gulf, Bush Jr got his after 9-11. Congress LOVES being taken off the hook for any real responsibility so if the shit hits the fan they can say "We gave the executive power to make that decision, it's not our fault!"

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