LaVeyan Satanism
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18-11-2012, 11:18 AM (This post was last modified: 18-11-2012 11:21 AM by Vosur.)
RE: LaVeyan Satanism
(18-11-2012 10:50 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  Oh I am interested in reasonable conversation when there is some reason applied. Satanism is NOT a cult by any standard definition of the word.
It most definitely is. I gave you a whole bunch of definitions of the word. Several of them fit your description of Satanism.

(18-11-2012 10:50 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  The link from about.com examines Satanism based on the standard definition and lets the reader decide. Did you read it? Probably not because your mind is already made up.
Actually, I did read it. Given that you think it refutes anything that has been said so far, I'm inclined to assume that you're the one who hasn't read it - at the very least not carefully enough. If you did, you would have noticed that the article from about.com does not address the question of whether or not Satanism is a cult in general, but whether or not it is a dangerous one. Contrary to your claim, the authoress of the article does not use any of the standard definitions of the term. She is using the ones to find out if Satanism is a dangerous cult specifically. Essentially, your argument is a red herring, because nobody in this thread asserted that it is one of them.

(18-11-2012 10:50 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  You did attack my position, I simply stated the truth back.
You have (repeatedly) accused me of attacking your position prior to this post. I'd like you to give me any reason/evidence supporting this claim.

(18-11-2012 10:50 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  Just because you and others here are close minded, ignorant, stupid or weak or whatever you show yourselves to be in time does not mean that I cannot learn something of value by being here, nor does it mean that I will not meet some interesting friends here down the line.
Hopefully i can educate a few who are willing to open up and see things from a different perspective as well.
It appears to me that you do not take criticism well. Perhaps Chas was right after all when he called you childish and self-important. One thing is very clear to me regardless, you are quick to judge people you know virtually nothing about.

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18-11-2012, 01:08 PM
RE: LaVeyan Satanism
The two primary organizations of LaVeyan Satanism refer to themselves as churches. You are in a cult whether you like it or not.

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18-11-2012, 01:14 PM
LaVeyan Satanism
(18-11-2012 01:08 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  The two primary organizations of LaVeyan Satanism refer to themselves as churches. You are in a cult whether you like it or not.

And he's apparently a self-described worthless fuck who gets a hard-on being an asshole liar and thief and greedy bastard. I hope I never run into a piece of shit like this in real life. I may not be so polite in person.

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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18-11-2012, 01:17 PM
RE: LaVeyan Satanism
(18-11-2012 01:14 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(18-11-2012 01:08 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  The two primary organizations of LaVeyan Satanism refer to themselves as churches. You are in a cult whether you like it or not.

And he's apparently a self-described worthless fuck who gets a hard-on being an asshole liar and thief and greedy bastard. I hope I never run into a piece of shit like this in real life. I may not be so polite in person.


Preach it, Brother Hellbound! Bowing

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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18-11-2012, 02:29 PM (This post was last modified: 18-11-2012 02:33 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: LaVeyan Satanism
(18-11-2012 05:33 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  ...nor do Atheists that I know believe they are their own Gods and I could go on.

Please allow me to introduce myself, I'm a man of wealth and taste. ... Consider Okay, maybe not a man of taste 'cause I like vodka. ... Consider Okay, maybe not a man of wealth 'cause ManlyGirl takes care of all that bullshit. But I am an atheist and My Own Personal Jesus ... fucker.

(18-11-2012 01:14 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(18-11-2012 01:08 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  The two primary organizations of LaVeyan Satanism refer to themselves as churches. You are in a cult whether you like it or not.

And he's apparently a self-described worthless fuck who gets a hard-on being an asshole liar and thief and greedy bastard. I hope I never run into a piece of shit like this in real life. I may not be so polite in person.

Sounds like me working Capitalism to my asshole advantage. Other than the following 2 aggressive comments, I find no reason to break out the clean fundoshis and invite him into the dohyo. And those comments were a result of his being piled on in the first place so Ima gonna excuse them. I do think I could sumo Satan, though. Hell Jesus did it as a scrawny fuck after 40 days in the wilderness eating only grasshoppers and honey, Girly'd take the prick easily in the dohyo with my diet of protein and testosterone.

(18-11-2012 10:18 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  A cult is where you follow a leader blindly. I follow no one and I am certainly not blind and I am just as anti religious as the next person. Rituals are not childish, in fact EVERYONE on the planet engages in some kind of Ritual, I just have the balls to admit it. I do not expect respect from someone who isnt capable of having respect. I personally view most of the people I have encountered on here as ignorant fucks.

(18-11-2012 10:35 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  You are simply trying to attack something you do not understand and have no ability to understand, instead of attacking a religion/philosophy that is an ally to Atheism, why don't you open your little mind up a bit?
I know! I was just informed by a demon that you are not capable of it. so nevermind. Excl Hobo Evil_monster

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18-11-2012, 05:25 PM
RE: LaVeyan Satanism
(18-11-2012 11:18 AM)Vosur Wrote:  
(18-11-2012 10:50 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  Oh I am interested in reasonable conversation when there is some reason applied. Satanism is NOT a cult by any standard definition of the word.
It most definitely is. I gave you a whole bunch of definitions of the word. Several of them fit your description of Satanism.

(18-11-2012 10:50 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  The link from about.com examines Satanism based on the standard definition and lets the reader decide. Did you read it? Probably not because your mind is already made up.
Actually, I did read it. Given that you think it refutes anything that has been said so far, I'm inclined to assume that you're the one who hasn't read it - at the very least not carefully enough. If you did, you would have noticed that the article from about.com does not address the question of whether or not Satanism is a cult in general, but whether or not it is a dangerous one. Contrary to your claim, the authoress of the article does not use any of the standard definitions of the term. She is using the ones to find out if Satanism is a dangerous cult specifically. Essentially, your argument is a red herring, because nobody in this thread asserted that it is one of them.

(18-11-2012 10:50 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  You did attack my position, I simply stated the truth back.
You have (repeatedly) accused me of attacking your position prior to this post. I'd like you to give me any reason/evidence supporting this claim.

(18-11-2012 10:50 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  Just because you and others here are close minded, ignorant, stupid or weak or whatever you show yourselves to be in time does not mean that I cannot learn something of value by being here, nor does it mean that I will not meet some interesting friends here down the line.
Hopefully i can educate a few who are willing to open up and see things from a different perspective as well.
It appears to me that you do not take criticism well. Perhaps Chas was right after all when he called you childish and self-important. One thing is very clear to me regardless, you are quick to judge people you know virtually nothing about.

And Yet....Cults usually have a charismatic leader who seeks to lead his followers to believe exactly as he does, he then controls them with threats if they do not believe as he does, he usually seeks to isolate them from society and then from their friends and family, he will then convince them that the doctrine has requirements that they must abide by, such as mass suicide or mass murder, he probably has asked them to give up all of their belongings at this point or give all of them to him, they may kill people or animals as well.
Lets look at the article on what a cult is that you refused to read. 1. Cults have central leaders. I am my leader, so I am in the cult of Terry, LOL dumbfuck that you are must be able to see how foolish this sounds!
Actually the article is assessing whether Satanism is a cult in General and then gives the common guidelines as to what constitutes a cult, However, Atheism is clearly a cult given your beliefs. You have a centralized leader named Dawkins. You do not determine your own lives, dawkins does. You follow his teachings from his books which tells you what to believe in and how to act. etc etc (of course I am being silly, I know you do not follow a cult, just as you know That I do not follow one) You simply have no leg to stand on so you throw out whatever you can to justify your position, Its weak.
As a member of the Elite, I am the one who gets to judge people, I am a very good judge of character by the way and can assess someone very quickly, thats what makes me so good at determining who is to be a friend or who is to become a mark in my life. I know almost instantly. so Yes, I do judge rather quickly. and Im always right. Smile
Is it childish to have confidence in yourself and in your religion? To you perhaps. I see a very ignorant person, in fact most atheists are ignorant, fuck that, most people are ignorant/stupid. No worries. all that matters is I know my status in Shadak ranking.
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18-11-2012, 06:03 PM
RE: LaVeyan Satanism
(18-11-2012 05:25 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  And Yet....Cults usually have a charismatic leader who seeks to lead his followers to believe exactly as he does, he then controls them with threats if they do not believe as he does, he usually seeks to isolate them from society and then from their friends and family, he will then convince them that the doctrine has requirements that they must abide by, such as mass suicide or mass murder, he probably has asked them to give up all of their belongings at this point or give all of them to him, they may kill people or animals as well.
Such characteristics may or may not be common among cults, it's irrelevant because it does not have any effect on the definition of the term. Meeting any of the criteria mentioned in the cited paragraph is not a requirement for a religion (or a group of people in general) to be called a cult. Let me give you a different example. Despite the fact that many atheists are materialists and embrace reason, science and logic, sharing these views is not a necessity for being an atheist. You can be an atheist for entirely emotional reasons. For instance, there are atheists who stopped believing in god because something terrible happened to them, or because they couldn't rationalize how there can be so much evil in the world with an omni-benevolent god.

(18-11-2012 05:25 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  Lets look at the article on what a cult is that you refused to read.
As mentioned previously, I have read the article thoroughly.

(18-11-2012 05:25 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  1. Cults have central leaders. I am my leader, so I am in the cult of Terry, LOL dumbfuck that you are must be able to see how foolish this sounds!
Apparently I have already reduced you to insults. What a pity.

(18-11-2012 05:25 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  Actually the article is assessing whether Satanism is a cult in General and then gives the common guidelines as to what constitutes a cult,
I feel like I should remind you that repeating yourself won't magically (pun intended) make you right. Perhaps you should reread the article yourself, as you seem to have missed the very first paragraph of it:

about.com Wrote:All forms of Satanism are commonly labeled as cultish by those unfamiliar with specific practices and teachings, thanks to rumor, folklore, and a hefty collection of B-movies. Using these guidelines for determining a dangerous cult [sic], let's see how LaVeyan Satanism actually stacks up.

If you compare the criteria for determining a dangerous cult and a "harmless", for the lack of a better term, cult, you will find that there are major differences between the two of them.

(18-11-2012 05:25 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  However, Atheism is clearly a cult given your beliefs. You have a centralized leader named Dawkins. You do not determine your own lives, dawkins does. You follow his teachings from his books which tells you what to believe in and how to act. etc etc (of course I am being silly, I know you do not follow a cult, just as you know That I do not follow one) You simply have no leg to stand on so you throw out whatever you can to justify your position, Its weak.
Ah, the fallacy of the false analogy. Contrary to atheists, who need not meet any criteria except for lacking a belief in god, you as a Satanist are bound by the rules and guidelines outlined in the Satanic Bible and have to follow them in order to be considered a Satanist (hence why you suggested Nevermore not to call himself a Satanist if he agrees with the tenets of secular humanism).

(18-11-2012 05:25 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  As a member of the Elite, I am the one who gets to judge people, I am a very good judge of character by the way and can assess someone very quickly, thats what makes me so good at determining who is to be a friend or who is to become a mark in my life. I know almost instantly. so Yes, I do judge rather quickly. and Im always right. Smile
I do get that you are overly confident, arrogant and show signs of sociopathy. There's no need for you to waste your time by repeating yourself.

(18-11-2012 05:25 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  Is it childish to have confidence in yourself and in your religion? To you perhaps. I see a very ignorant person, in fact most atheists are ignorant, fuck that, most people are ignorant/stupid. No worries. all that matters is I know my status in Shadak ranking.
You are most definitely entitled to have your own opinion. There is, however, no need for me to agree with you if you are unable or unwilling to provide any evidence to support it. I suppose you don't really care about my position anyway.

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19-11-2012, 11:01 AM (This post was last modified: 19-11-2012 11:11 AM by Irishdize.)
RE: LaVeyan Satanism
(18-11-2012 06:03 PM)Vosur Wrote:  Ah, the fallacy of the false analogy. Contrary to atheists, who need not meet any criteria except for lacking a belief in god, you as a Satanist are bound by the rules and guidelines outlined in the Satanic Bible and have to follow them in order to be considered a Satanist (hence why you suggested Nevermore not to call himself a Satanist if he agrees with the tenets of secular humanism).

(18-11-2012 05:25 PM)Irishdize Wrote:  

I do get that you are overly confident, arrogant and show signs of sociopathy. There's no need for you to waste your time by repeating yourself.





Actually you are quite in error here. Both Satanism and Shadakism do not require followers to follow every single piece of literature written to be a follower, in fact The Satanic Bible and Satanic scriptures encourages readers to defy what is written and think for themselves.
[i]The Book of Shadak, In Lattimore 3:32 says 'What is written is truth, Only follow the core 8 unless the 8 seeks a change, otherwise defy, think, change, grow' This would indicate that I am to think for myself while following set GUIDELINES.

That is why we call Peter Gilmore the current Priest of the COS a TEACHER. He has words of wisdom to share but we are by no means obligated to follow all of them, take for example a Satanist who does believe in charity and giving to those in need vs one who says that he is only going to help himself. Yes, we are to put ourselves first but that does not mean we cannot help others, that is a personal choice
SociopathIC being the keyword. I cry when someone is in pain, I help those who need it as long as it doesnt infringe on my own personal needs, I feel compassion which is something a true sociopath is incapable of doing, so Yes, I look after myself first and then my circle of 9 and then if it doesnt cause me harm, I look after others, I started a charity in 2009 to do that and its gone quite well actually but if I need something and the only way to get it is working lesser magic-manipulation or black magic (whatever name you give it) then that is what I will do (Unless it will harm someone in my circle).
Its a very careful balance I feel that has to be honored, being a person who cares about others, wants to make the world a better place but also wants to make sure he gets his fair share-which requires using people (and its fun) Smile and then there is the balance between Shadakism which I am a member of and Satanism.
As far as being a cult, you seem to be going by the idea that all religions are cults and thats fine. I was going by the ideas I already stated earlier in which case they are not Smile
The reason I suggested Nevermore not refer to himself as a humanist is because he is a Satanist, Humanism and Satanism is too far apart on several issues-Humanists seem to think they human beings are the answer to everything and that we should work together to better humanity where Satanism says that we are the best things on the planet (we, me, us) and that we should seek to have the best lives possible but that there are others who deserve nothing for they are weak/stupid-which is NOT a humanistic POV.
It seems though that what you are saying is that if something has guidelines or rules that have to be followed it is a cult, which means ALL religions including Humanism is a cult.
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19-11-2012, 11:27 AM
RE: LaVeyan Satanism
(19-11-2012 11:01 AM)Irishdize Wrote:  
(18-11-2012 06:03 PM)Vosur Wrote:  Ah, the fallacy of the false analogy. Contrary to atheists, who need not meet any criteria except for lacking a belief in god, you as a Satanist are bound by the rules and guidelines outlined in the Satanic Bible and have to follow them in order to be considered a Satanist (hence why you suggested Nevermore not to call himself a Satanist if he agrees with the tenets of secular humanism).


Actually you are quite in error here. Both Satanism and Shadakism do not require followers to follow every single piece of literature written to be a follower, in fact The Satanic Bible and Satanic scriptures encourages readers to defy what is written and think for themselves.
[i]The Book of Shadak, In Lattimore 3:32 says 'What is written is truth, Only follow the core 8 unless the 8 seeks a change, otherwise defy, think, change, grow' This would indicate that I am to think for myself while following set GUIDELINES.

That is why we call Peter Gilmore the current Priest of the COS a TEACHER. He has words of wisdom to share but we are by no means obligated to follow all of them, take for example a Satanist who does believe in charity and giving to those in need vs one who says that he is only going to help himself. Yes, we are to put ourselves first but that does not mean we cannot help others, that is a personal choice
SociopathIC being the keyword. I cry when someone is in pain, I help those who need it as long as it doesnt infringe on my own personal needs, I feel compassion which is something a true sociopath is incapable of doing, so Yes, I look after myself first and then my circle of 9 and then if it doesnt cause me harm, I look after others, I started a charity in 2009 to do that and its gone quite well actually but if I need something and the only way to get it is working lesser magic-manipulation or black magic (whatever name you give it) then that is what I will do (Unless it will harm someone in my circle).
Its a very careful balance I feel that has to be honored, being a person who cares about others, wants to make the world a better place but also wants to make sure he gets his fair share-which requires using people (and its fun) Smile and then there is the balance between Shadakism which I am a member of and Satanism.
As far as being a cult, you seem to be going by the idea that all religions are cults and thats fine. I was going by the ideas I already stated earlier in which case they are not Smile
The reason I suggested Nevermore not refer to himself as a humanist is because he is a Satanist, Humanism and Satanism is too far apart on several issues-Humanists seem to think they human beings are the answer to everything and that we should work together to better humanity where Satanism says that we are the best things on the planet (we, me, us) and that we should seek to have the best lives possible but that there are others who deserve nothing for they are weak/stupid-which is NOT a humanistic POV.
It seems though that what you are saying is that if something has guidelines or rules that have to be followed it is a cult, which means ALL religions including Humanism is a cult.
[/i]

my apologies in advance for that post, it looks like crap, lol, I made a mistake and went back to edit and I fucked that up too, lol, am still learning the system I guess. I will try to do better next time
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19-11-2012, 05:20 PM
RE: LaVeyan Satanism
(18-11-2012 01:08 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  The two primary organizations of LaVeyan Satanism refer to themselves as churches. You are in a cult whether you like it or not.
The only difference in cult and church is the # of members...
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