Poll: Should Prostitution be legalized
Yes, free from government and tax
Yes, with reasonable constraints and regulations
No, because it's immoral/dehumanizes people/causes psycological trauma
No, it's against my religion
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Legalizing Prostitution
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07-05-2016, 02:21 AM
RE: Legalizing Prostitution
Bump!

I was doing some research on this topic today and came across a surprising poll that was conducted back in 2013. It shows that a majority of women (57%) in the US oppose the legalization of prostitution while only a minority of men (40%) do the same.

Why do you think that is? Consider

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07-05-2016, 03:02 AM (This post was last modified: 07-05-2016 03:06 AM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: Legalizing Prostitution
(07-05-2016 02:21 AM)Vosur Wrote:  Bump!

I was doing some research on this topic today and came across a surprising poll that was conducted back in 2013. It shows that a majority of women (57%) in the US oppose the legalization of prostitution while only a minority of men (40%) do the same.

Why do you think that is? Consider

Societal gender norms. The larger your number of sexual partners is seen as a positive for men, and a negative for women. Having a strong sexual drive is lionized, and so it's both accepted and encouraged that men seek out many sexual partners. Flip those tables, and women that engage in such 'empowering' males activities are labeled as 'sluts' and 'whores' instead. The very fact that 'whore', a term used to refer to a promiscuous woman, is still used exclusively in the derogatory sense and without a popular or common male equivalent? It's so pervasive that even women view their own sexual empowerment as something to be avoided or ashamed of. Gender norms simply haven't balanced out, sexual equality hasn't yet been achieved.

So yeah, men in a society where the acquirement of sexual partners will skew towards making such things purchasable. Likewise women in a society where such sexual freedom is shamed upon will likewise skew against the selling of one's sexuality. There are probably other factors at work here as well, but it seems all too easy to connect those dots.

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07-05-2016, 03:23 AM (This post was last modified: 07-05-2016 03:32 AM by Gilgamesh.)
RE: Legalizing Prostitution
(07-05-2016 02:21 AM)Vosur Wrote:  Bump!

I was doing some research on this topic today and came across a surprising poll that was conducted back in 2013. It shows that a majority of women (57%) in the US oppose the legalization of prostitution while only a minority of men (40%) do the same.

Why do you think that is? Consider

The more saturated the market is with x, the less x is worth. In the sexual marketplace women offer access to their sex/body, and men offer access to resources/commitment. So if men can get lots of sex without paying much commitment or resources, women on the whole have to start selling their goods for less to keep the exchange enticing. Basically low-price sex (prostitution) makes the marketplace less profitable for competitors (women) who aren't selling for that price. They don't want that, obviously, and so will support legislation which criminalises it.
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07-05-2016, 03:46 AM
RE: Legalizing Prostitution
(07-05-2016 03:23 AM)Gilgamesh Wrote:  
(07-05-2016 02:21 AM)Vosur Wrote:  Bump!

I was doing some research on this topic today and came across a surprising poll that was conducted back in 2013. It shows that a majority of women (57%) in the US oppose the legalization of prostitution while only a minority of men (40%) do the same.

Why do you think that is? Consider

The more saturated the market is with x, the less x is worth. In the sexual marketplace women offer access to their sex/body, and men offer access to resources/commitment. So if men can get lots of sex without paying their commitment, women on the whole have to start selling their goods for less to keep the exchange enticing. Basically low-price sex makes the marketplace less profitable for competitors (women.) They don't want that, obviously, and so will support legislation which criminalises it.


Sex is not a one way street...

Male escorts and prostitutes are a thing you know, right? If anyone was seriously thinking about sexuality in such economic terms, then making it legal could increase demand by making it safe and available; and increased demand leads to either increased supply to meet it, or increased price driven by competition for the same limited supply. Legalizing it still seems like a win, even economically.

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07-05-2016, 04:06 AM
RE: Legalizing Prostitution
(07-05-2016 03:46 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(07-05-2016 03:23 AM)Gilgamesh Wrote:  The more saturated the market is with x, the less x is worth. In the sexual marketplace women offer access to their sex/body, and men offer access to resources/commitment. So if men can get lots of sex without paying their commitment, women on the whole have to start selling their goods for less to keep the exchange enticing. Basically low-price sex makes the marketplace less profitable for competitors (women.) They don't want that, obviously, and so will support legislation which criminalises it.

If anyone was seriously thinking about sexuality in such economic terms, then making it legal could increase demand by making it safe and available; and increased demand leads to either increased supply to meet it, or increased price driven by competition for the same limited supply. Legalizing it still seems like a win, even economically.

Right, but no matter how much you increase the price of prostitution, many men would still see it as a better deal than marriage/commitment. Thus any woman not prostuting her sex in a market where other women are is going to be worse off than if she were in a market where other women aren't. That's why they want it illegal.
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07-05-2016, 04:10 AM
RE: Legalizing Prostitution
(07-05-2016 04:06 AM)Gilgamesh Wrote:  
(07-05-2016 03:46 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  If anyone was seriously thinking about sexuality in such economic terms, then making it legal could increase demand by making it safe and available; and increased demand leads to either increased supply to meet it, or increased price driven by competition for the same limited supply. Legalizing it still seems like a win, even economically.

Right, but no matter how much you increase the price of prostitution, many men would still see it as a better deal than marriage/commitment. Thus any woman not prostuting her sex in a market where other women are is going to be worse off than if she were in a market where other women aren't. That's why they want it illegal.
Both of you offer interesting explanations. I've seen a third one offered by various feminist groups online, namely that prostitution only serves to harm and demean women - not just the ones who partake in it either, but women as a whole - and that it should therefore not be legal.

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07-05-2016, 04:28 AM (This post was last modified: 07-05-2016 04:33 AM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: Legalizing Prostitution
(07-05-2016 04:06 AM)Gilgamesh Wrote:  
(07-05-2016 03:46 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  If anyone was seriously thinking about sexuality in such economic terms, then making it legal could increase demand by making it safe and available; and increased demand leads to either increased supply to meet it, or increased price driven by competition for the same limited supply. Legalizing it still seems like a win, even economically.

Right, but no matter how much you increase the price of prostitution, many men would still see it as a better deal than marriage/commitment. Thus any woman not prostuting her sex in a market where other women are is going to be worse off than if she were in a market where other women aren't. That's why they want it illegal.


I'm not disagreeing with the reason, only with the motivation. I've never once heard a woman cite the value of their own personal sexuality as a trade commodity as the reason for why they're against prostitution. Now I've heard plenty coming from men, and the sick fascination with and valuation of woman virginity. But even this stems, historically at least, from treating marriage as a means of brokering power, influence, and alliances between families. It originates from a time when women were seen as property to be owned and traded. I think that this is part of the base that modern gender norms are built upon, where we see women being valued for their chastity, and those who discard it are shamed for 'devaluing' not only themselves, but also by extension their families. Abstinence only sex-ed programs are built entirely out of shame.

But using marriage for such power brokerage is rather antiquated, but the shame aspect has not diminished nearly as much. That shame probably has a basis in male control over women's sexuality and is meant as a tool to enforce their dominance. But we're long past the time when women should be shamed for the same sexual empowerment men are lionized for, let alone trying to make am honest buck off of it.

Plus, doesn't prostitution devalue that person to someone else interested in and looking for a steady monogamous relationship, thus raising the value of such other people in that market place? Not everyone shopping around for a sexual partner is looking for the same thing. Your argument paints with too broad of a brush I think.

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07-05-2016, 04:45 AM (This post was last modified: 07-05-2016 04:49 AM by Gilgamesh.)
RE: Legalizing Prostitution
(07-05-2016 04:28 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  I think that this is part of the base that modern gender norms are built upon, where we see women being valued for their chastity, and those who discard it are shamed for 'devaluing' not only themselves, but also by extension their families.

Right. Women are shaming other women who freely offer sex.

Quote:But using marriage for such power brokerage is rather antiquated, but the shame aspect has not diminished nearly as much. That shame probably has a basis in male control over women's sexuality and is meant as a tool to enforce their dominance. But we're long past the time when women should be shamed for the same sexual empowerment men are lionized for, let alone trying to make am honest buck off of it.

Are you trying to blame men for women expressing distaste for other womens sexuality lol?

Edit:
Quote:Plus, doesn't prostitution devalue that person to someone else interested in and looking for a steady monogamous relationship, thus raising the value of such other people in that market place?

No. Men aren't looking for commitment in the same way women are.
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07-05-2016, 05:22 AM
RE: Legalizing Prostitution
(07-05-2016 04:45 AM)Gilgamesh Wrote:  
(07-05-2016 04:28 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  I think that this is part of the base that modern gender norms are built upon, where we see women being valued for their chastity, and those who discard it are shamed for 'devaluing' not only themselves, but also by extension their families.
Right. Women are shaming other women who freely offer sex.

It's not limited to women. It is unfortunately a cultural norm practiced by both sexes, but it's stems from a practice that existed for the explicit benefit of men; controlling women (and their sexuality) as property to be owned and traded for their benefit.


(07-05-2016 04:45 AM)Gilgamesh Wrote:  
(07-05-2016 04:28 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  But using marriage for such power brokerage is rather antiquated, but the shame aspect has not diminished nearly as much. That shame probably has a basis in male control over women's sexuality and is meant as a tool to enforce their dominance. But we're long past the time when women should be shamed for the same sexual empowerment men are lionized for, let alone trying to make am honest buck off of it.
Are you trying to blame men for women expressing distaste for other womens sexuality lol?

If such shame does indeed come from ingrained cultural norms stemming from a system of power put in place for the sole benefit of men, then that system shares in the culpability.


(07-05-2016 04:45 AM)Gilgamesh Wrote:  
(07-05-2016 04:28 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Plus, doesn't prostitution devalue that person to someone else interested in and looking for a steady monogamous relationship, thus raising the value of such other people in that market place?
No. Men aren't looking for commitment in the same way women are.

Oh really? I must thank you on behalf of speaking for the entirely of the male species and all sexual preferences... Facepalm

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07-05-2016, 06:20 AM
RE: Legalizing Prostitution
If you're saying that the prime reason that people are against legalisation is because they think shamefully of women who have tons of sex, then you're necessarily saying that women are doing the majority of shaming, since they oppose it in greater numbers than men. In which case; yes, I agree, and that doesn't sit at odds with anything I've said. We disagree in the 'why' of it, though. I think women are autonomous, so I look at female nature for the answer.
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