Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
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21-12-2015, 10:22 AM
RE: Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
(20-12-2015 06:13 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  "Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something DOES NOT exist."

Easy peasy. Find the paradox. They're everywhere.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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21-12-2015, 12:51 PM
RE: Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
(20-12-2015 06:13 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  In re "Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists."

~ snip ~

"Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something DOES NOT exist."

Shocking


my brain hurts.

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21-12-2015, 01:30 PM
RE: Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
(21-12-2015 01:40 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  Dear Whiskey, as you bring up the term evidence, then let you and me work to concur on what is the meaning of evidence, in regard to something existing or not existing, is that all right with you?
No work to be done as I've already said MULTIPLE damn times what is and what constitutes evidence. If you can't keep up feel free to leave and let the next bargain bin philosopher take your place.
Evidence is demonstrable.
It is falsifiable.
It is testable.
It can be independently verified.

If you need the above explained to you then you are out of your depth even more then I thought. I should not have to explain to you, a grown ass person, what is and is not evidence. You have a fucking High School diploma do you not?
Simple question: do you have any evidence to present in support of whatever whack-a-do nonsense you are trying to build up to or are you just here to JAQ off all over the forum?

(21-12-2015 01:40 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  First, if I may, you and I know for a certainty is that evidence is something, it is not nothing, it participates in the default status of things in the world, which is existence.
First off let me thank you for that entirely useless observation. Could you please now move on from this pointless deepity and on to something in the neighborhood of substantive?
Secondly the only things that have any status as "existing" are those which can be demonstrated to exist with EVIDENCE. So before you even got to your god nonsense if you can't demonstrate it's existence it does not get to be included in the category of "existing".

(21-12-2015 01:40 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  Please, I like to learn from you what sort of a thing is evidence.
Would you really? Cause I've explained it multiple times now including in the last post I made about 3 times and now in this one. Try actually reading the replies you get.

(21-12-2015 01:40 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  is it a concept in our mind or an object that is independent of our mind..
Someone has already posted the definition of Evidence. Read it. If between that and my repeated explanations of what constitutes evidence you STILL can figure it out you need to leave if you are coming that ill prepared to the conversation. No one here has the time nor the inclination to teach you the entirety of basic reasoning and logic.

(21-12-2015 01:40 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  so that in the timeline of the history of mankind when mankind was not existing...
.......are you fucking high right now? The history of mankind does not include a time when mankind did not exist as mankind existing is kinda a fucking prerequisite of "the history of mankind".
Facepalm


(21-12-2015 01:40 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  was there an object that is evidence, so that evidence exists then when no mind at all was present to think about it?
If I have to explain that fossils existed and were evidence of the existence of dead organisms before mankind found them and they did not magically come into existence at some point in mankinds history.
Evidence exists independently from any mind (the earth for example has always spun around the sun and the evidence for that has always existed) the Scientific method is how minds, like ours, go about gathering, analyzing, and interpret that evidence to arrive at conclusions that are the most reliably accurate.

(21-12-2015 01:40 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  Let me learn from you.
Sure. If when you are on this site you go to post on the forums the first thing you should do is scroll to the top of the web page. Now while there you should be able to locate a button that says "Log out". Press that. End of steps.

(21-12-2015 01:40 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  The question that I like to learn from you....
Yes I got that the first time you asked it, stop repeating your questions in an attempt to pad your responses you pedantic little monkey.

(21-12-2015 01:40 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  I hope to welcome your effort of sharing your thinking with me
I'm just repeating what I've already said to you again because you are sloooooow. I already explained what was and was not evidence, you failed to address it so just reasked the question.

Do better or leave.

When valour preys on reason, it eats the sword it fights with.
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21-12-2015, 02:43 PM
RE: Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
I reiterate:

(18-12-2015 05:32 PM)Vosur Wrote:  Yawn. You're not fooling anyone. We all know that there's an argument for God coming at the end of this pointless exercise so how about you just cut to the chase and stop wasting everyone's time?

Drinking Beverage

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21-12-2015, 04:43 PM
RE: Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
[If this message is too much to read, please proceed right away to the end, read the end text which is in bold.]



Dear Banjo and everyone else who ever mentioned the word evidence, please do not write as to make readers turn away owing to too much to read.

And may I, forgive me, again request that whatever you get from published reference sources, you also seek to rewrite it in a way that is not too much to read by people.

Let’s say, you are into a written test on whether you understand a piece of writing, and you are required to write in 50 words or less what is the core of that piece of writing, in respect of the context in which that piece of writing is located.

I yearn to learn from you, but please, with not too much to read from you, I love to learn from you in not more than 50 words: What is in your own thinking and writing -– okay, no matter you get your thoughts from others, what is evidence, namely first: is it something that exists at all, or it is not anything that exists, then its purpose or role (or no purpose and no role) in the default status of things in the world, which default status is existence.

Whiskey is no longer around, but I was hoping that he and I would continue with our exchange; that is the trouble with many folks, once you want to carry on in earnest productive exchange with them, they disappear -- still I hope he will return to resume our exchange.

Okay, everyone who has ever mentioned the word evidence and know something about it in the context of this thread, namely, “Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists," which is in this board, "The Thinking Atheist Forum › The Heavy Stuff › Atheism and Theism": Tell me in your own words what is evidence.


(21-12-2015 01:40 AM)Pachomius Wrote:  Dear Whiskey, as you bring up the term evidence, then let you and me work to concur on what is the meaning of evidence, in regard to something existing or not existing, is that all right with you?

From Pachomius
(Today 09:29 AM)Pachomius Wrote:
Please forgive me, may I request you to reproduce what you find in dictionaries, in say 50 words or less?

From Whiskey
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/proof
Basically Evidence. […]

[From Pachomius]
First, if I may, you and I know for a certainty is that evidence is something, it is not nothing, it participates in the default status of things in the world, which is existence.

Please, I like to learn from you what sort of a thing is evidence. is it a concept in our mind or an object that is independent of our mind, […]

Let me learn from you.

The question that I like to learn from you, is in few words, As evidence is something, does it exist in a mind or it also exists outside a mind, and even when there is no mind at all?

I hope to welcome your effort of sharing your thinking with me, by replying to the question immediately preceding these ending words from me.

Cheers.


Summing up, to all who mention the word evidence, I love to learn from you, but not too much to read from you, just produce in your own words not more than 50, what is evidence in regard to this board, atheism and theism.

Forgive me, even though I say that I want to learn from you posters here, still I have to let readers know what is my own self-thought out concept of evidence, here:

Evidence is anything at all in existence that leads man to know another thing to be existing (17 words).



Cheers.
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21-12-2015, 05:02 PM
RE: Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
(21-12-2015 04:43 PM)Pachomius Wrote:  First, if I may, you and I know for a certainty is that evidence is something, it is not nothing, it participates in the default status of things in the world, which is existence.





(21-12-2015 04:43 PM)Pachomius Wrote:  Please forgive me, may I request you to reproduce what you find in dictionaries, in say 50 words or less?

Tell Girly what existence is in 50 words or less and then we can get to other, simpler concepts like evidence.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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21-12-2015, 05:05 PM
RE: Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
(21-12-2015 04:43 PM)Pachomius Wrote:  Dear Banjo and everyone else who ever mentioned the word evidence, please do not write as to make readers turn away owing to too much to read.

Says the guy who posts little else but walls of text and puts this right after a caveat about the latest post maybe being too long. You don't get irony, do you?

Quote:[b]Summing up, to all who mention the word evidence, I love to learn from you, but not too much to read from you, just produce in your own words not more than 50, what is evidence in regard to this board, atheism and theism.

Atheism is the default position unless and until evidence can be provided for theism.
(14 words)

Or, if you prefer haiku...
no evidence found
theism has no support
so atheism
(9 words)

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
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21-12-2015, 05:36 PM (This post was last modified: 21-12-2015 05:53 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
(21-12-2015 04:43 PM)Pachomius Wrote:  Evidence is anything at all in existence that leads man to know another thing to be existing (17 words).[/b]

Completely false. (2 words)

Humans are frequently led to think something "exists", when in fact they have actually MISPERCEIVED, misinterpreted, or misunderstood the evidence.
The number of times this has happened is innumerable.
Your criteria are bogus.
There are, in fact, things that do not exist, which are evidence of something.
Your childish argument is a failure.
Try harder.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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21-12-2015, 05:44 PM
RE: Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
(21-12-2015 05:36 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(21-12-2015 04:43 PM)Pachomius Wrote:  Evidence is anything at all in existence that leads man to know another thing to be existing (17 words).[/b]

Completely false.

Humans are frequently led to think something "exists", when in fact they have actually MISPERCEIVED, misinterpreted, or misunderstood the evidence.
The number of times this has happened is countless.
Your criteria are bogus.

Try harder.


What are you talking about Bucky? Bigfoot exists. Aliens keep giving colonoscopies and Elvis is still alive.

Sheesh! Wink

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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21-12-2015, 05:47 PM
RE: Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something exists.
(20-12-2015 07:29 PM)Pachomius Wrote:  Now, dear readers here, do you notice that the posters who reply, do not as is their disappointing habit attend to the actual issue or subject I have proposed that we all go into, at the present juncture of this thread.

That would be because you changed the subject. This is known as derailing a thread and is considered particularly poor nettiquette when practised by the individual who originated it. Kindly note how, as is my disappointing habit, I addressed your original topic.

Quote:Let us work together to concur on how to prove that something DOES NOT exist."

The only things that can be proven not to exist are logical impossibilities. Anything else may exist, no matter how unlikely.

Quote:In few words, Tell me, dear posters here, what do you understand by the verb, to prove, and the noun, proof?

Proof is for mathematicians and alcoholics. The rest of us rely on evidence.

(21-12-2015 04:43 PM)Pachomius Wrote:  just produce in your own words not more than 50, what is evidence

Evidence: Factual information. From Latin: That which is seen. More comprehensively, that which is observed.

Quote:First and before anything else, of course parties in an exchange on a contentious question must come to concurrence on the meanings of important words employed in the exchange.

And when one of those parties attempts to redefine "existence" and "evidence" we can be pretty sure that he's a weasle of the lowest order.

Quote:That is proceeding according to critical thinking, otherwise parties would be talking wastefully of time and labr, past each other's heads.

Ah, you mean like the last 10 pages where you wittered on about vague terms such as "the default status of things" (Can you get less precise than "things"?) while the rest of us tried to figure out what in the name of all that's unholy you were yammering about? It isn't about critical thinking, it's a matter of clarity of expression. For example:

Chew your own damned word salad and get to the point in fifty words or less.

---
Flesh and blood of a dead star, slain in the apocalypse of supernova, resurrected by four billion years of continuous autocatalytic reaction and crowned with the emergent property of sentience in the dream that the universe might one day understand itself.
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