Liberal? Conservative?
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18-04-2017, 08:10 AM
Liberal? Conservative?
I've always found that to be a curious question.

I mean, I believe in a standing military, the death penalty, gun ownership... So all my liberal friends think I'm a conservative.

I also believe in same sex marriage, abortion rights, legalizing marijuana, single payer healthcare... So all my conservative coworkers think I'm gay.
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18-04-2017, 09:01 AM (This post was last modified: 18-04-2017 09:06 AM by GenesisNemesis.)
RE: Liberal? Conservative?
The only stances I have that I agree with conservatives on are guns and political correctness. Yes, you have a right to self defense, and yes, we can be too politically correct, but that doesn't mean we need to say crazy shit and be total assholes. We simply have to ask questions. Furthermore, both parties have their own forms of political correctness. Drives me crazy when the right calls liberals "snowflakes" and yet they get offended when you say anything bad about America, or the general idea of patriotism, etc.

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18-04-2017, 09:33 AM
RE: Liberal? Conservative?
I have no problem with a strong military or guns, but I don't worship either like conservatives do. I'm never opposed to lower taxes, but I don't worship the rich like conservatives do. The overly political correct stuff is highly annoying as well, but too many conservatives use that excuse to dismiss any narrative about race/gender/sexual orientation at all.

The Democrats are hardly great, but the Republicans pander to the religious and big business (well more than Democrats do). They are also constantly anti-science, pander to the military and police, and hijacked the whole concept of "patriotism" and completely bastardized it. They also throw out the words "freedom" and "liberty", all while demonstrating most of them have no damn clue what those concepts are.
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18-04-2017, 09:47 AM
RE: Liberal? Conservative?
(18-04-2017 08:10 AM)Missiletowe Wrote:  ... So all my liberal friends think I'm a conservative.
... So all my conservative coworkers think I'm gay.

You are aware that it is possible to be conservative and gay? The former MP and now parliamentary correspondent Matthew Parris was and is both.

=====================
According to the card game Illuminati there are ten alignments held by various groups. They can appear in any combination except direct opposites:
Conservative is the opposite of Liberal
Government is the opposite of Communist
Weird is the opposite of Straight
Violent is the opposite of Peaceful
Criminal is not the opposite of anything
Fanatic is the opposite of Fanatic (there is nothing fanatic groups hate more than other fanatic groups.)

Fnord.

“I am not responsible for actions of the imaginary version of me you have inside your head.” - John Scalzi

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18-04-2017, 10:03 AM
RE: Liberal? Conservative?
(18-04-2017 08:10 AM)Missiletowe Wrote:  I've always found that to be a curious question.

I mean, I believe in a standing military, the death penalty, gun ownership... So all my liberal friends think I'm a conservative.

I also believe in same sex marriage, abortion rights, legalizing marijuana, single payer healthcare... So all my conservative coworkers think I'm gay.

I'm assuming that you are using Murikan definitions of 'Liberal' and 'Conservative'.

It might be worth noting that TTA is a global brand so some may take issue with your categorisations.

In a more classical sense Liberal is about freedom, change (or chaos in its uncontrolled form) and Conservative is about stability and maintaining the status quo (or stagnation in its uncontrolled form). Which is why union members are some of the most conservative people you'll ever meet.

As an example, here's how I would categorise the topics you mentioned:

"a standing military" - that's socialism, like a standing Fire Service or Standing Ambulance Service... as opposed to Private Armies which is equatable with barbarism.

"the death penalty" - general considered a tool to maintain the status quo, hence Conservative but used in both socialised (civilisations) and barbarian communities.

"gun ownership" - makes sense in a barbarian hierarchy / fear-culture but makes no sense in an urban environment where it would be delegated (in-sourced) to trusted authorities i.e. police / border patrols.
Or putting it another way, Abel needs to defend the flock but Cain is better off with insecticide.

"same sex marriage"- Yup, Liberal/libertarian. That's about the right to self-determination (at the individual rather than societal level).
"abortion rights" - ditto
"legalizing marijuana" - ditto
... but with all individual rights come social responsibilities i.e. the balance between liberal (rights) and conservative (responsibilities).

"single payer healthcare" - Socialism.

Thumbsup

Your friends don't understand nuance, it seems.

Big Grin

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18-04-2017, 10:18 AM
RE: Liberal? Conservative?
(18-04-2017 08:10 AM)Missiletowe Wrote:  I've always found that to be a curious question.

I mean, I believe in a standing military, the death penalty, gun ownership... So all my liberal friends think I'm a conservative.

I also believe in same sex marriage, abortion rights, legalizing marijuana, single payer healthcare... So all my conservative coworkers think I'm gay.

Welcome to my boat.....

Smile

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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18-04-2017, 10:26 AM
RE: Liberal? Conservative?
I'm generally very liberal/progressive- especially from an American perspective. I'm a feminist. I want equal rights for all (gay marriage, equal pay, reproductive rights, a law enforcement system that doesn't target minorities, and more).

I think gun ownership is generally unnecessarily. An unnecessary risk to the populace.

I think the death penalty is a complete waste of taxes, and there exists a non-zero chance to execute an innocent person.

I believe in a volunteer military paid for by the government/taxpayers. Though I'd prefer to see some of what we spend on defense go to better goals like supporting NASA and other scientific aims not directly intended to kill people, health care for all, basic income, better education and free college tuition, etc. We spend far too much on our military. We could easily cut back and still be the most powerful military in the world.

I believe in single-payer healthcare. Healthcare is a right, not a privilege provided to only those who can afford it. The sick are quite often also those who cannot afford their own care- or they lose the ability to pay for their own care.

Legalizing pot can help us in a lot of positive ways that outweigh all or most of the potential risks that we can foresee.

I believe political correctness in general means being empathetic and respectful of individuals that are not you. That are different than you. This is not a bad thing, and most people believe in political correctness whether they would call it that or not.

Of course, I've just listed some of the things we've seen so far here and in a very general non-nuanced way. Wink
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18-04-2017, 10:27 AM
RE: Liberal? Conservative?
(18-04-2017 10:03 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(18-04-2017 08:10 AM)Missiletowe Wrote:  I've always found that to be a curious question.

I mean, I believe in a standing military, the death penalty, gun ownership... So all my liberal friends think I'm a conservative.

I also believe in same sex marriage, abortion rights, legalizing marijuana, single payer healthcare... So all my conservative coworkers think I'm gay.

I'm assuming that you are using Murikan definitions of 'Liberal' and 'Conservative'.

It might be worth noting that TTA is a global brand so some may take issue with your categorisations.

In a more classical sense Liberal is about freedom, change (or chaos in its uncontrolled form) and Conservative is about stability and maintaining the status quo (or stagnation in its uncontrolled form). Which is why union members are some of the most conservative people you'll ever meet.

As an example, here's how I would categorise the topics you mentioned:

"a standing military" - that's socialism, like a standing Fire Service or Standing Ambulance Service... as opposed to Private Armies which is equatable with barbarism.

"the death penalty" - general considered a tool to maintain the status quo, hence Conservative but used in both socialised (civilisations) and barbarian communities.

"gun ownership" - makes sense in a barbarian hierarchy / fear-culture but makes no sense in an urban environment where it would be delegated (in-sourced) to trusted authorities i.e. police / border patrols.
Or putting it another way, Abel needs to defend the flock but Cain is better off with insecticide.

"same sex marriage"- Yup, Liberal. That's about the right to self-determination.
"abortion rights" - ditto
"legalizing marijuana" ditto
... but with all rights come responsibilities i.e. the balance between liberal (rights) and conservative (responsibilities)

"single payer healthcare" - Socialism.

Thumbsup

Your friends don't understand nuance, it seems.

Big Grin

You say barbarian like it's a bad thing Huh I'm still waiting for this civilization fad to pass.

'Murican Canadian
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18-04-2017, 10:35 AM
RE: Liberal? Conservative?
(18-04-2017 10:27 AM)yakherder Wrote:  
(18-04-2017 10:03 AM)DLJ Wrote:  ... [said stuff including the word "barbarian"] ...

You say barbarian like it's a bad thing Huh I'm still waiting for this civilization fad to pass.

You shouldn't have to wait long with the current US administration.

Then we'll all be looking to hire you and your barbarian friends...

... magnificent seven at a time.

Big Grin

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18-04-2017, 10:44 AM
RE: Liberal? Conservative?
(18-04-2017 10:35 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(18-04-2017 10:27 AM)yakherder Wrote:  You say barbarian like it's a bad thing Huh I'm still waiting for this civilization fad to pass.

You shouldn't have to wait long with the current US administration.

Then we'll all be looking to hire you and your barbarian friends...

... magnificent seven at a time.

Big Grin

Even Canada managed to find a use for my non college educated, barbaric (multilingual) ass Big Grin. I've spent most of my life dealing with the worst society (not all at the same end of the civilized spectrum) has to offer, and they're everywhere. I could be biased, spending every day having face to face conversations with murders, pedophiles, and Somalian gang bangers in a county that prides itself on staying near the top of the happiest countries in the world list.

'Murican Canadian
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