Liberalism is bad word for Christians... REALLY?
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28-12-2015, 02:28 PM
RE: Liberalism is bad word for Christians... REALLY?
(28-12-2015 12:39 PM)frankksj Wrote:  
(28-12-2015 11:30 AM)DerFish Wrote:  I have read this three times and it is non comprehensible. You seem to interchange liberalism with libertarianism.

It's because people calling themselves liberals today hijacked the word to mean the opposite. Originally it means giving people the freedom to choose, from the latin "liber". And was explicitly used to contrast the prior definition of the state as an entity which takes away individual liberty by forcing people to do things against their will. ie: the role of the state is to defend minorities against the will of the majority, to block the use of force rather than initiate it.

The problem is that liberalism was so wildly successful, the old statists started hijacking the word to refer to the old system which liberalism was intended to get away from. So now the same word means 2 totally opposite things. So most "classic liberal" call themselves "libertarian", while statists call themselves "liberal". The same group who hijacked the word "liberal" similarly hijacked other classic liberal terms, like "pro-choice" and "social contract", to mean the exact opposite of their intended definition. Yes it makes for a confusing debate.

I have found that most people calling themselves Libertarians do not have any knowledge of what the term means, nor what the Libertarian party stands for. They openly admit they have no idea of the difference between the USA Democratic Party and Communism and on and on.
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28-12-2015, 04:54 PM
RE: Liberalism is bad word for Christians... REALLY?
(28-12-2015 12:39 PM)frankksj Wrote:  
(28-12-2015 11:30 AM)DerFish Wrote:  I have read this three times and it is non comprehensible. You seem to interchange liberalism with libertarianism.

It's because people calling themselves liberals today hijacked the word to mean the opposite. Originally it means giving people the freedom to choose, from the latin "liber". And was explicitly used to contrast the prior definition of the state as an entity which takes away individual liberty by forcing people to do things against their will. ie: the role of the state is to defend minorities against the will of the majority, to block the use of force rather than initiate it.

The problem is that liberalism was so wildly successful, the old statists started hijacking the word to refer to the old system which liberalism was intended to get away from. So now the same word means 2 totally opposite things. So most "classic liberal" call themselves "libertarian", while statists call themselves "liberal".

And once again, what you think you know just isn't so.

History of liberalism

And you might have some sort of argument if the meanings of words never changed, but they do.

Quote:The same group who hijacked the word "liberal" similarly hijacked other classic liberal terms, like "pro-choice" and "social contract", to mean the exact opposite of their intended definition. Yes it makes for a confusing debate.

Citation, please.

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28-12-2015, 06:48 PM
RE: Liberalism is bad word for Christians... REALLY?
(27-12-2015 10:41 PM)Sylia Gray Wrote:  
(27-12-2015 07:02 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  What is wrong with people? ??

Liberal does not equal Democrat. Conservative doesn't equal republican.

These aren't some directly interchangeable terms that for some reason people want to bicker about with.

Exactly my point! I wasn't even referring to any political party in the original thread anyway.
Well to focus to that point, not sure if others have mentioned these things but there are moral values judged to different degrees in these different groups according to studies of some, such as something called moral foundations theory.

At least especially with a fundementalist, the view of liberal people as worse or bad because they are less likely to care about sanctity/purity or traditions the way they do.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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28-12-2015, 07:38 PM
RE: Liberalism is bad word for Christians... REALLY?
(28-12-2015 06:48 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  
(27-12-2015 10:41 PM)Sylia Gray Wrote:  Exactly my point! I wasn't even referring to any political party in the original thread anyway.
Well to focus to that point, not sure if others have mentioned these things but there are moral values judged to different degrees in these different groups according to studies of some, such as something called moral foundations theory.

At least especially with a fundementalist, the view of liberal people as worse or bad because they are less likely to care about sanctity/purity or traditions the way they do.

I have found that the biggest difference between the "Conservatives" and the "Liberals" is basically that the Conservatives need heroes to look up to and brag about. Where as Liberals understand for example that Obama is not perfect, just that he was a better choice than the other choice twice. But a Conservative cannot imagine that Rush Limpdick is not a perfect saint although he has his own drug convictions.
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28-12-2015, 08:30 PM (This post was last modified: 29-12-2015 03:42 PM by Stevil.)
RE: Liberalism is bad word for Christians... REALLY?
(28-12-2015 06:48 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  the view of liberal people as worse or bad because they are less likely to care about sanctity/purity or traditions the way they do.
I have no respect what-so-ever for sanctity/purity or traditions.
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