Life after death: I've died many times
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
29-01-2013, 03:45 PM
Life after death: I've died many times
Often times I have, like most of us, thought about death. I find it hard sometimes to come to grips with the fact that my current experience will come to an end. Religion gave me an answer to that when I was younger, but sometime after discovering that i was atheist, I came to revisit the idea of death. What I disovered gave me comfort. I discovered that I have lived and died many times.
I remember my mom's love for me when I was a child. She adored and loved everything about me, especially the fine details of what I was like as a child. Like any parent, the thought of having her son ever leave her was a terrible idea. But gradually I changed. I became an adolescent and then later a man.
If you remove the block of time between my childhood and now, the child I once was is gone forever. His thoughts, feelings, desires, physical appearance....all lost forever. Even the stuff that made up his body has already returned to the earth in a diffrent form. That child is, as far as I can tell, dead. The same goes for the adolescent son that my mother loved.
But of course, here "I" am, in the form of a man. I have faint memories of those earlier experiences, but are they really all that different from yours or anyone else's? At the very least, my childhood was similar enough to others to where our faint memories of those early days seem quite the same in many ways.
That child is gone, but he feels no pain. He has no sorrow or regrets. He is simply gone. In his place is someone else now with only memories. At some point in the future, when I die and after I have left myself behind many times already, there will always be someone in my place. There will be those who remember me in the same way that I remember myself. My experience will end and theirs will continue on, just as my experience continues on long after my childhood experience has ended.
I see little difference between my experience and the experiences of others. I take comfort in knowing that its OK to not be too attached to anything in life, including life itself, because there will always be someon else experiencing life in the same way I did. Their experiences are just as important, just as valid and just as primary as my own.
This is how I view life and death today, and everything is going to be just fine.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like moonbogg's post
29-01-2013, 03:50 PM
RE: Life after death: I've died many times
Proof or gtfo.

Forgive me if I don't take your word for it.

[Image: 3cdac7eec8f6b059070d9df56f50a7ae.jpg]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-01-2013, 03:52 PM
RE: Life after death: I've died many times
(29-01-2013 03:45 PM)moonbogg Wrote:  Often times I have, like most of us, thought about death. I find it hard sometimes to come to grips with the fact that my current experience will come to an end. Religion gave me an answer to that when I was younger, but sometime after discovering that i was atheist, I came to revisit the idea of death. What I disovered gave me comfort. I discovered that I have lived and died many times.
I remember my mom's love for me when I was a child. She adored and loved everything about me, especially the fine details of what I was like as a child. Like any parent, the thought of having her son ever leave her was a terrible idea. But gradually I changed. I became an adolescent and then later a man.
If you remove the block of time between my childhood and now, the child I once was is gone forever. His thoughts, feelings, desires, physical appearance....all lost forever. Even the stuff that made up his body has already returned to the earth in a diffrent form. That child is, as far as I can tell, dead. The same goes for the adolescent son that my mother loved.
But of course, here "I" am, in the form of a man. I have faint memories of those earlier experiences, but are they really all that different from yours or anyone else's? At the very least, my childhood was similar enough to others to where our faint memories of those early days seem quite the same in many ways.
That child is gone, but he feels no pain. He has no sorrow or regrets. He is simply gone. In his place is someone else now with only memories. At some point in the future, when I die and after I have left myself behind many times already, there will always be someone in my place. There will be those who remember me in the same way that I remember myself. My experience will end and theirs will continue on, just as my experience continues on long after my childhood experience has ended.
I see little difference between my experience and the experiences of others. I take comfort in knowing that its OK to not be too attached to anything in life, including life itself, because there will always be someon else experiencing life in the same way I did. Their experiences are just as important, just as valid and just as primary as my own.
This is how I view life and death today, and everything is going to be just fine.


That's a very thoughtful, interesting way to look at it. Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-01-2013, 03:53 PM
RE: Life after death: I've died many times
(29-01-2013 03:50 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  Proof or gtfo.

Forgive me if I don't take your word for it.


Fucking 'Muffs. Did you actually read it? Dodgy

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-01-2013, 04:00 PM (This post was last modified: 29-01-2013 04:05 PM by Adenosis.)
RE: Life after death: I've died many times
Your argument is that because the person we previously were is 'dead' and that we are a 'new' or 'different' person, the same is true with when we physically die.

Well the assumption is stupid because the child we were didn't die, it changed. Your conscious mind spans the time frame of around twenty seconds, this is YOU as you know you to be. As time goes on there is a lot of experience that has passed through this conscious mind and much of it sits in 'storage'. As things in storage chance, you change. The way you handle certain situations or problems and the way you act around people, ext. The child did not die, the child underwent a massive amount of experience which shaped that child into a seemingly different person.

You are an emergent property of the brain, the brain changes based on experiences over time, this is why you change. When that brain no longer sustains conscious activity, you are gone. It isn't just a change, it's an end to the physical processes that give rise to YOU. Your consciousness, memories, thoughts, everything.

It sure sounds nice, the idea that we have an infinite series of reincarnations after death, but there's no rational reasoning behind it.

2.5 billion seconds total
1.67 billion seconds conscious

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-01-2013, 04:00 PM
RE: Life after death: I've died many times
no

[Image: 3cdac7eec8f6b059070d9df56f50a7ae.jpg]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-01-2013, 04:11 PM
RE: Life after death: I've died many times
(29-01-2013 03:50 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  Proof or gtfo.

Forgive me if I don't take your word for it.
He's not talking about a literal, biological death of his body.

Jeez 'muffs, I can see right through you when you attempt to be dense on purpose. Consider



As for the OP, that's certainly an interesting perspective. I'll ponder on this tomorrow and share my thoughts with you. Yes

[Image: IcJnQOT.gif]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-01-2013, 04:13 PM
RE: Life after death: I've died many times
(29-01-2013 04:11 PM)Vosur Wrote:  
(29-01-2013 03:50 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  Proof or gtfo.

Forgive me if I don't take your word for it.
He's not talking about a literal, biological death of his body.

Jeez 'muffs, I can see right through you when you attempt to be dense on purpose. Consider
Title was misleading.

[Image: 3cdac7eec8f6b059070d9df56f50a7ae.jpg]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-01-2013, 04:48 PM
RE: Life after death: I've died many times
It's the classic conundrum.

You have a hairbrush made of two parts: a handle and a head. The handle breaks after some use, so you replace it. After a while the head breaks, and you replace that. Is it still the same brush now as it was before?

Boiling it down to so simple proposition though, I feel, is a hindrance, because the main idea of the argument is on the persistence of complicated systems. So let's look at a complicated system: a computer.

I started in 2007 with an HP Pavilion. In early 2008 I replaced the graphics card and power supply. In late 2008 I replaced the case, motherboard, and RAM. In 2009 I added a new hard drive and replaced the graphics card. I upgraded the CPU and added an SSD and another graphics card in 2010, and replaced the graphics card again in 2011. I also replaced the case and power supply, and in 2012 I upgraded the SSD.

When did it stop becoming an HP Pavilion, and start becoming a custom computer? Is it the same custom computer as it was years ago after 70% of the parts have been replaced?


You could say that any change to the computer results in it being an entirely new machine. But this is unsatisfactory. Swapping out one set of RAM for another set, for instance, might have a barely noticeable change and not change the character of the machine at all. It still behaves the same, performs the same. Must we create a new conceptual entity for every change to this machine?

Another look at it is that it stays the same machine as long as some remnant of the original remains. This gives unsatisfactory results as well. You could argue, for instance, that my computer is still an HP Pavilion, because it retains one original component, the hard drive (used for storage now). But my machine no longer resembles the HP in any real way. Why should I still consider it an HP then?

The way it is handled with computers is to choose an arbitrary component (industry standard is the motherboard) and say that *that* is the computer. Thus it's the same computer until you replace the motherboard. Problem is that you can still replace a motherboard with a very similar one and get a machine that feels and acts the same. It's still the same computer, really. It's an arbitrary decision, and thus the results are arbitrary as well.



I think the most mature way to look at it is in terms of perception. Objects are just arrangements of atoms. We are the ones who assign them purpose and meaning. Thus, my computer's history can be divided into different "computers" based on how I feel it should be divided. I started with an HP Pavilion, then I had my earlier gaming system with the E2200 in the Antec 900 case, then I had my intermediate system with the quad core and the 4870, then I had my current system in the ugly case with the same CPU as before but bigger graphics cards.

The same applies to your mind. It's just a pattern of electrical impulses and neurons. You are the one who decides what purpose and meaning you had at different points in your life, and you are the one who gets the divide it up as you choose, and you can call those previous "selves" dead if you like.

E 2 = (mc 2)2 + (pc )2
614C → 714N + e + ̅νe
2 K(s) + 2 H2O(l) → 2 KOH(aq) + H2 (g) + 196 kJ/mol
It works, bitches.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-01-2013, 04:54 PM
RE: Life after death: I've died many times
Moonbogg.
The analogies you make are meaningful.
It is not usual to think this way,in terms of flow.
Rather Buddhst;still lots of problems. Unsure
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: