Life and help
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29-05-2017, 03:12 PM (This post was last modified: 29-05-2017 03:23 PM by JesseB.)
RE: Life and help
(29-05-2017 02:53 PM)julep Wrote:  
(28-05-2017 01:18 PM)JesseB Wrote:  Thanks DLJ, and thanks to everyone else who commented.

I didn't share my story for hugs or sympathy (though it is nice and appreciated), more for me what I need are tools? Ideas? Understanding? If that makes sense. I'm not the type to cry very often, though when things stay this bad this long without an opportunity for change I do get a bit.... Compromised.... quick to outburst. I don't particularly like that. I don't feel myself when that happens.

I don't know, but the score was 32. I'm not sure how reliable some internet "test" would be. My parents took me to countless psychologists when I was younger and the only thing they could come up with was "Pervasive Development Disorder not otherwise specified" AKA they had no clue, they kept telling my mom I seemed healthy and normal but they couldn't deny I had no friends. All they'd do is say, "He's very intelligent, has a unusually strong sense of right/wrong, and is unusually empathetic for his age"

However you're totally right, while it's easy to know when a person is lying to me, and it's easy to pick up on emotions through tiny body language, it's still damn near impossible to understand what the fuck is going on inside peoples heads, like I've been working on this to the exclusion of almost everything else for as long as I can remember. Just a survival thing ya know. I can never seem to understand what's really motivating a person. To put it in a way I tend to say it, people are confusing and scary as fuck. They are emotional and irrational and that makes them all dangerous. At least from my perspective.

Like I can easily tell what a person is feeling based on tiny changes in the face, yet I have no fucking clue what it means or what they'll do as a result. One thing I do know no one seems to ever respond the way I would, so It's hard to anticipate even with all the data I collect......

PDDNOS can be a not-yet-classified as well as a no-clue dx. It's frequently made in cases where it's considered too early to diagnose a person with autism or one of the other non-neurotypical classifications, yet it's apparent that the person would benefit from some extra help. (My kid started out PDDNOS at around 4-5 and then had an evaluation at 8 that moved his dx to autism, for example.) You need an official diagnosis in most public schools in order to be eligible for extra services like speech or occupational therapy, social skills groups, etc.

Formal diagnosis as an adult, which many people do now: you may or may not benefit from it. If you did have a workup that produced a diagnosis, it could give you some tools to help you navigate socially and professionally. Or you might find that your own workarounds are better than the ones presented to you.

Reasonable. I would suggest an open and honest look at my life (not just in relationships, but also professional, money management, decision making, Social interactions in general) would indicate I'm doing something very wrong. I am well aware of this.

I learned long ago that no matter what I say or do (or don't say or don't do) the outcome will always be pretty much the same and always negative against me. I've been successful in jobs based on work ethic, intellect, ability to quickly master skills needed to do jobs. Yet the common denominator that has always wrecked my life has been the existence of humans. If I lived in a world populated only by computers I would mostly thrive. I like affection, love, kindness, ect but to be honest I don't get that anyway, so I could do without the mindless hate, abuse, manipulations, games, lies, that I have to deal with currently. Knowing that my actions have little meaningful effect on the outcome has allowed me to be.... malleable.... try different things and observe the results. For instance the person you see on these forums is a rather new thing I've been trying to develop since I was discarded by Amy. Before then I was doing something that was I think more successful, yet left me feeling even more isolated than I do now (That is lie, make up that I'm happy, tell people how hopeful I am for the future, you know the fake it till you make it approach), the problem with this is no matter what I do I will never be accepted by anyone. And anyone who pretends to be my friend is full of shit and is looking for a way to harm me. Honestly I feel far more safe around people openly hostile than I ever could around someone who pretends I'm their friend. Granted I still pretend to be hopeful, and I suppose some small part of me is, despite having no reasonable rational justification for it. And I DON"T need some bullshit that things will get better. Come on people this is a place for "skeptics" people who value "reason" "Factual Evidence" FUCKING HELL DO YA"LL EVER LISTEN TO THE ASININE SHIT YOU SAY? NO things aren't just going to magically be ok. They'll only be ok if people come together and MAKE IT FUCKING SO. So lying to me, acting like bad things happen but things always work out is about as ignorant, cold and stupid as saying the same thing to a child about to die from NEVER having eaten a single meal in any number of other parts of the world. WHY? because I know that things don't always work out and lying about that is a fucking dick move to all the people who struggle and try and die in misery. How fucking disconnected from reality can you be. The only way to fix shit is to be honest, no matter where you are in this world. Just because reality makes you uncomfortable is no justification to lie to yourself or ANYONE else about it. Grow the fuck up (Not directed at you Julep this is directed at anyone/everyone who ever reads this, it's not an attack or indictment against you at all, I'm just jumping ahead of anyone who wants to feed me some useless bullshit.)

I get Christians offering me food from the church, you know what I say to them? No it's ok eating today will only make my stomach hurt worse tomorrow. What I need isn't a meal, it's a job. (well they also try to bully me to go to church too which is also unacceptable)

So what I'm looking for isn't sympathy, or empathy. What I'm looking for are answers, any answers that may offer some meaningful way to manage my life better and if I can't be successful or loved at least be comfortable and safe.


Edit^ From my perspective, saying it'll get better, it'll be ok and not doing a DAMN thing to help, is ABSOLUTELY just has hurtful, hateful, useless, harmful, and shitty as telling someone you will pray for them. Either step the fuck up or admit you don't give a fuck I don't really care either is better than lying to a person. From my perspective the only appropriate approach to someone who says such bullshit is "GO FUCK YOURSELF" and yet... usually I don't say that. I just smile at them and say "Sure"

Fucking weird ass useless species the human race is, how the fuck did it ever survive this long.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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29-05-2017, 03:19 PM (This post was last modified: 29-05-2017 03:36 PM by JesseB.)
RE: Life and help
There's really only 1 person in recent memory who's gone out of his way to PROVE to me that he doesn't just say he likes me or is my friend but has actually DONE something to demonstrate it's so. He's a fucking hero and he know's exactly who he is.

How do I put this, my policy on accepting help from others is to only accept help.... meaningless bullshit that isn't really helpful or meaningful to my life just so you can feel better about YOUR life isn't something I should feel obligated to accept. Help should have clearly defined goals and outcomes otherwise you're really not helping at all. Help should be able to identify a specific need, a means of obtaining a desirable outcome, have the ability to provide a lasting impact, and be intended to end. If it fails to meet these criteria then you aren't helping, you're either enslaving someone to you through perpetual "assistance" (and some don't get the luxury of avoiding this because of physical limitations, but those who can work and want to that get trapped... like my situation... that's not cool) OR you're being as helpful as finding a drowning person pulling their head over the water, letting them grab a gulp of air and dropping them back in. You know what that kinda "help" makes you? A sadistic fuck. Now don't get me wrong, I'll give a starving person a sandwich if I can, even if that means I don't eat that day. But I don't lie to myself or them and call that helping them.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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29-05-2017, 04:31 PM
RE: Life and help
JesseB: You strike me like the type that needs straight talk so here have it.

Since you apparently don't have the social skills to deal with frustration and communication, here some free advice.
1. If you do not appreciate the help of someone (for whatever reason), a good and acceptable response is: "No thank you", "No, I tried that, it doesn't work" "No that is not my thing" ("meaningless bullshit" and "go fuck yourself" are not good responses)
2. ALLCAPS means you are yelling, and people don't like being yelled at. So if you want people to help you, don't yell at them.
3. Also people don't like being cursed at, so again if you are looking for help, don't curse at those who are trying to help. Communicate why you don't like the specific thing they offer to you. (pulling the example out of my ass) "Thanks for the tip with praying, but I am atheist so this is not working for me"
4. Yes, say "thanks" even though you decline. Why? Because you asked for help and the person made an effort to help. Whether or not you take the advise doesn't matter, when people spend time to try and help you, that is a nice thing and you should be thankful for it.

Feel free to tell me to go fuck myself, I don't take it personally. I know it is just because you are frustrated.
If you still want help, my offer for pm stands, but you need to make the first step and I will not go out of my way to prove that I like you because you will either get the hint from the posts I made here or you won't.

Cheers

"Freedom is the freedom to say that 2+2=4" - George Orwell (in 1984)
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29-05-2017, 04:44 PM (This post was last modified: 29-05-2017 04:49 PM by JesseB.)
RE: Life and help
(29-05-2017 04:31 PM)Leerob Wrote:  JesseB: You strike me like the type that needs straight talk so here have it.

Since you apparently don't have the social skills to deal with frustration and communication, here some free advice.
1. If you do not appreciate the help of someone (for whatever reason), a good and acceptable response is: "No thank you", "No, I tried that, it doesn't work" "No that is not my thing" ("meaningless bullshit" and "go fuck yourself" are not good responses)
2. ALLCAPS means you are yelling, and people don't like being yelled at. So if you want people to help you, don't yell at them.
3. Also people don't like being cursed at, so again if you are looking for help, don't curse at those who are trying to help. Communicate why you don't like the specific thing they offer to you. (pulling the example out of my ass) "Thanks for the tip with praying, but I am atheist so this is not working for me"
4. Yes, say "thanks" even though you decline. Why? Because you asked for help and the person made an effort to help. Whether or not you take the advise doesn't matter, when people spend time to try and help you, that is a nice thing and you should be thankful for it.

Feel free to tell me to go fuck myself, I don't take it personally. I know it is just because you are frustrated.
If you still want help, my offer for pm stands, but you need to make the first step and I will not go out of my way to prove that I like you because you will either get the hint from the posts I made here or you won't.

Cheers

? That wasn't at anyone specific, it was more of a general rant. The title is "Life and Help" Like.... i don't know it seems crazy to me when someone asks for help to respond and not offer any help of any kind? I don't understand this at all. Clearly I'm weird this way. I strive to make sure any advice I offer is thoughtful and I don't carry any expectations of anything I say to change anyone's life. I don't think your response was lacking in helpful input at all. No where did you say "I'll pray for you" or "it'll get better" (magically). So I have no idea why you would think I would tell you to go fuck yourself. Even if you had I wouldn't, i'd think and feel it inside but I'm generally mature enough to keep my thoughts to myself. Perhaps I wasn't specific enough or clear enough.

I thought Julep's response was valuable as well. Everything in my response to her was for her consumption and analysis, and potentially response (positive or negative) I did try to point out those parts that weren't directed in any way towards her which were general rantyness.... I wonder if maybe no one reads the entire thing before passing judgement? I don't know, help me understand where I failed to communicate my intent. Also I don't see where I yelled at anyone, I did all caps which indicates yelling (volume) which if we were in a room I would have turned away and given grandiose body language maybe.... it's such a different context than what I think you interpreted it as.

I appreciate the advice, and I really appreciate the straightforward way you laid it out. That means a WHOLE lot Smile

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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29-05-2017, 04:52 PM
RE: Life and help
I didn't take it at my own, it was just a general hint.
We good.

Now about the people who give you hugs or say "it'll get better"
Most of the time, they just want you to know that they read what you said, they want you to see that people care even if they might not be able to help because knowing that someone has read it helps many people. There is a reason that this section of the forum is so full of very long stories and rambles. It is because writing things in a place where everybody can see it, that is very therapeutic to many people. Just the fact that the word is out.
Now in your case, you tell your story and seek help and that is fine.
You don't have to respond to the hugs and well wishes, they are just showing that they are thinking of you.

"Freedom is the freedom to say that 2+2=4" - George Orwell (in 1984)
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29-05-2017, 04:55 PM
RE: Life and help
@Leerob

And this exemplifies the problems in communicating with emotional people who don't seem to analyze what they read (no offense intended), I mean perhaps my wording was unclear. The entire topic at large is emotional for me so it's difficult to type about it at all (also... I haven't eaten in far too long which always creates problems in my ability to type well, just a few more days till I get some money and can get food).

Like it seems to me on the surface that people don't read what others say at all (or listen when in person) they just listen for a few words to evoke emotions and make full judgement based on those few words and those emotions. This makes no sense to me, often when I find people getting upset (at me or others) the person they are upset with was saying the exact opposite or something is being taken completely out of context. Now I can full well admit my communication ability on this topic in general gets um.... degraded by my emotional compromised state, and admit that at the time of writing that I hadn't eaten since um.... the taco my land lady gave me yesterday at around 4pm I think. So I'm certainly willing to own some of the breakdown in communication in that response. It might not have been laid out and categorized as logically as it should, or been as clear in separation of topics and intent. I get that. But even in that compromised state I wouldn't have come to the conclusions you did having read such a post from someone else. These are the things I need to understand if I'm going to more effectively communicate with people.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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29-05-2017, 04:57 PM
RE: Life and help
(29-05-2017 04:52 PM)Leerob Wrote:  I didn't take it at my own, it was just a general hint.
We good.

Now about the people who give you hugs or say "it'll get better"
Most of the time, they just want you to know that they read what you said, they want you to see that people care even if they might not be able to help because knowing that someone has read it helps many people. There is a reason that this section of the forum is so full of very long stories and rambles. It is because writing things in a place where everybody can see it, that is very therapeutic to many people. Just the fact that the word is out.
Now in your case, you tell your story and seek help and that is fine.
You don't have to respond to the hugs and well wishes, they are just showing that they are thinking of you.

I guess that makes sense. A better way to do that in my mind would be to spend time with me. I get pretty lonely and enjoy lots of topics, in fact I hate talking about the stuff I'm bringing up here, I've been doing it way too much in my private conversations and I don't like that at all. I'd prefer to get back to my normal self dealing with real problems not this weird social shit that just gets in the way of life, fun, and living.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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29-05-2017, 05:07 PM
RE: Life and help
Well talking about your problems is probably the only way to vent and to work it all out. So yes it is emotionally exhausting but probably helps on the long run.

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29-05-2017, 05:11 PM (This post was last modified: 29-05-2017 05:17 PM by JesseB.)
RE: Life and help
(29-05-2017 05:07 PM)Leerob Wrote:  Well talking about your problems is probably the only way to vent and to work it all out. So yes it is emotionally exhausting but probably helps on the long run.

That's the only reason I'm doing this. This certainly isn't fun for me, and I doubt anyone else is enjoying it either. And I appreciate every response here as a result.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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29-05-2017, 05:35 PM (This post was last modified: 29-05-2017 05:39 PM by JesseB.)
RE: Life and help
(29-05-2017 01:57 PM)Leerob Wrote:  It's a lot of shit you went through and that is what some of us just have. A life that, at least up to a point, simply consists of a nice neat row of piles of shit.
But you know what the great thing is?
The fact that, even without a therapy, you can change a lot of things in your life and shift it to something more positive. You said therapy hasn't worked for you so far and that is fine.
Seeking happiness has never worked for everybody. Our brains are not wired that way and while we can make changes in our thinking, nobody can be happy 24/7 (and it would be kinda freaky and exhausting too).

I am not sure what would help you to be honest. Probably an open ear that will listen without judgement. Maybe someone you can bounce some ideas and thoughts off, someone who can maybe make you see things from different angles and so on. If you don't have friends like that in real life, you still have us here. I can offer to listen, if you want to pm me, go ahead.

Generally what has helped me most of my life, to stay sane and work through different things, it was always just reflecting on everything. To use every quiet moment before sleeping or whatever, to just reflect on everything that happened that day. Things that annoyed me, things where I fucked up, etc. Just reflecting and being honest to myself. You'd be surprised how much you can learn about yourself and how much you can alter your own behavior just from being honest to yourself. Not saying you are not honest to yourself but in case you have not used your quiet moments to sit down and play with the things that work you up. Nothing can happen if you play through different scenarios in your head.
For example that nurse that raped you (let's just call that by its name, shall we). You already mentioned that she didn't listen to you, that she was going to fast, and that she didn't stop. You already mentioned that you couldn't do anything. But you can play with all the what if's in your head. You will probably still come to the conclusion that you were young and really there was nothing you could have done (rape victims for some reason are never taken serious on that). But once you played through all the scenarios that you can come up with and everything leads you to the same conclusion, at least you can make peace with it. It won't make better what happened to you, but you can come to the point of "ok this happened. this is how it impacted my life. I am aware of it. And I can finally move on."
And this approach can probably work with most everything that caused you trauma and distress in your life. It is a long rocky road that you have in front of you, my friend, but you can walk it and we are all here to catch you if you stumble.

You can also look into the concept of "mindfulness". It is a newer concept but the idea behind is to recognize the things in your life and how they are impacting you and simply accept that your feelings and emotions about things are okay. It is to recognize what you are going through and understanding yourself better. I like the concept generally. See if it is maybe something you like too?

Be well and take care of yourself.

I missed this earlier I think and I'd like to respond to it. When things are going reasonably well I don't think about any of this stuff. That is to say the only reason anything from my past is on my mind is because I'm working on fixing my current situation and um.... trying to encompass everything within that fix. I'm generally pretty honest with myself about my feelings, and my actions (both things I do right and mistakes I make, or even things I knowingly do wrong cause lets face it sometimes we know what the correct thing to do is and we say fuck it and do the wrong thing anyway, there's not always even a flimsy logical justification for this we all just do sometimes). I would like to think I'm generally aware of where my emotions come from too (when they can be traced back to specific events, I mean sometimes emotions are just chemicals that do their thing and have no real tie to what's going on around you) And most important for me anyway, I understand the difference between emotion and reason and I don't place emotion above reason. I can't deny I have emotions, they are the most honest part of who I am. But that doesn't make anything/everything I do based on those emotions right. And no matter how emotional I get on ANY topic the best way to reach me is with reason, if you switch from an irrational emotion based position and reach out to me with well structured logic, no matter how upset I am I will instantly respond with logic, really it's the fastest way to get me to calm down in any situation. Just make sure you're correct or I'll tear into the logical fallacies. You can even point out that I've made mistakes and If you can demonstrate it I'll instantly accept the correction. I'm not emotionally bonded to thoughts or ideas as a part of my identity. In fact the thing I tend to draw from most for my identity are my values which I have put a lot of effort into ensuring they are correct and unlikely to change, and If I find I am wrong and need to change them I will. Honestly I don't know how anyone could live/be any other way.

I really like this response from you though. Thank you. As for PMing you I'd rather we talk here out in the open, I think it's prolly just safer than PM's Everyone know's what a worthless pile of shit I am now anyway so we can talk here, nothing is going to change their minds if they are judging me on blind dogmatic ideology political or religious. And frankly if that's how they want to judge me that says far more about them than it does about me.

EDIT^
Bill Nye what would change your mind? "Evidence"
Ken Ham what would change your mind? "Nothing"

^ My last point in a nutshell

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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