Limited capitalism: a "you're too rich" cap on income

[germanyt]

Fucking commies.

[mysticjbyrd]

(12-03-2012 01:14 AM)morondog Wrote:  

(11-03-2012 10:06 PM)mysticjbyrd Wrote:  The source of the problem is the disparity between the rich and poor. The poor can't even make enough money to live on anymore. Average wages for the poor haven't increased since like 1980, which is shockingly the same time we started Reaganomics.

Have you ever seen that movie, "Trading Places"? Essentially, a poor black man trades places with a rich white stock broker. The black guy makes an easy transition and as the film progresses becomes just as snobbish as the white guy concerning the poor. The white guy on the other hand goes crazy, bought a gun, does drugs, drinks cheap alcohol, and even steals some shit.

Well that movie isn't far from the truth.

I have seen the glaring difference between rich and poor in my own backyard. I haven't seen the movie but I can well believe that it would exactly happen like that if a rich and a poor guy were to trade. I agree with you that something needs to be done about it, just... I don't know, taking away stuff that people have worked hard for seems like treating symptoms and not the cause. Maybe that is a solution but I'd like to explore alternatives as well.

But thats just it. You have this vision of this rich guy who clawed his way from the bottom with nothing more than their sweat and tears.

That character may have existed in the past, but now its just pure fantasy. The majority of them don't work hard, they don't create jobs, and they did little to nothing to deserve their gross incomes.

[GirlyMan]

(12-03-2012 05:05 PM)mysticjbyrd Wrote:  But thats just it. You have this vision of this rich guy who clawed his way from the bottom with nothing more than the sweat and tears.

That character may have existed in the past, but now its just pure fantasy. The majority of them don't work hard, they don't create jobs, and they did little to nothing to deserve their gross incomes.

It's not only too much Bible that can hurt one in their youth, too much Horatio Alger can be just as damaging.

[morondog]

(12-03-2012 05:33 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  

(12-03-2012 05:05 PM)mysticjbyrd Wrote:  But thats just it. You have this vision of this rich guy who clawed his way from the bottom with nothing more than the sweat and tears.

That character may have existed in the past, but now its just pure fantasy. The majority of them don't work hard, they don't create jobs, and they did little to nothing to deserve their gross incomes.

It's not only too much Bible that can hurt one in their youth, too much Horatio Alger can be just as damaging.

Up yours Girly Never heard of the bugger.

And I disagree. Of the rich people I've met (not many, and not uber rich though so maybe they're a different breed), all of them have been hard working guys who've made their way up through the ranks. One was an absolute shit though - just grabbing what he could and not caring about other people, not afraid to do illegal stuff if he could get away with it etc. The others are pretty awesome people.

[Azaraith]

(10-03-2012 11:38 PM)jackashflash Wrote:  

(10-03-2012 09:59 PM)Azaraith Wrote:  haha... The only people saying it's luck are the ones without the skill or work ethic to do it themselves. Everyone I know that has money spent years in school and has worked their ass off.

The fact you are even alive was an infinitesimally small chance.

You could have been born with one of many debilitating childhood diseases. You could have been born to abusive parents. You could have been born in some 3rd world country during an ethnic cleansing.

Now consider all the things that happened in your life that made you, you. A lazy little white douche that grew up in a middle class suburb, and wouldn't know real work if it bit you in the ass. Your definition of work is driving the lawn tractor to cut the grass.

So yes, in this universe dominated by chance you were simply lucky. I am sorry, but that does not morally give you the right to have billions, whilst others starve and die in the streets.

lol. Here's some cheese for your whine:

Chance gives you a start, hard work takes you the rest of the way. Honestly, people have worked their way from nothing to millions/billions and have also squandered away great opportunity. You can either become extremely bitter and demand others give you stuff just for existing or you can man up and make something of yourself. One thing I've noticed that almost no one understands is that labor is subject to supply and demand as much as anything else. If your skillset isn't unique or rare, there are going to be many more people competing for your job, which drives down wages. You want to make a lot of money? You have to understand what you're really, really good at and then master it and sell yourself.

You have no inherent right to comfort. No inherent right to anything, really. No more natural/inherent rights than a lion or a gazelle. What rights are afforded to us are those that are established by our society. Increasingly, common human rights are being agreed upon globally, but they aren't established anywhere else. If you want to help the poor, establishing education and infrastructure are the best ways, not just doling out cash from the rich to the poor.

These things require stable governments and well-defined rights, which are sorely lacking in Africa. When you see stable governments that have established rights for its citizens, you will see progress. You will not see change by simply taxing the hell out of the rich and handing it out to the poor. Such governmental systems have been attempted and have failed miserably - see the Soviet Union, Cuba, and North Korea.

Oh, and fuck you too. You don't know me, you've simply made baseless assumptions. I work 60 hours/week or more. Yeah, not physical labor, but one doesn't have to roll boulders up hills to work hard. In my environment, you're constantly learning or you're on your way out. Tell me, what projects have you worked on that have had a significant impact on the operations of your company? I'm working on several, and since I'm in PE, that means I am working in several different industries, different sized companies, and different types of management teams. I've worked on projects that have helped save the company several times as much money as I make in a year.

[germanyt]

(12-03-2012 05:33 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  

(12-03-2012 05:05 PM)mysticjbyrd Wrote:  But thats just it. You have this vision of this rich guy who clawed his way from the bottom with nothing more than the sweat and tears.

That character may have existed in the past, but now its just pure fantasy. The majority of them don't work hard, they don't create jobs, and they did little to nothing to deserve their gross incomes.

It's not only too much Bible that can hurt one in their youth, too much Horatio Alger can be just as damaging.

Too bad ignore doesn't block when people quote you. Mystic, are you aware that something like 70% of millionaires did not inherit their money. They built their wealth from the ground up. Lottery winners and heirs make up the majority of the remaining 30%. Also, of that 30% only 6% are rich soley from inheritance. Many heirs use the money to build companies and make themselves richer. As for just regular rich folk, they are your typical small business owner. They guy in the nice neighborhood on the golf course that drives the Escalade. He's probably the owner of a successful construction company. He works damn hard for his 3 or 400 thousand a year. And small businesses make up over 70% of the US workforce. Small and large businesses make up nearly 85% with much of the rest being self employed.

So why don't you shut your mouth.

[jackashflash]

(13-03-2012 01:34 AM)Azaraith Wrote:  

(10-03-2012 11:38 PM)jackashflash Wrote:  

(10-03-2012 09:59 PM)Azaraith Wrote:  haha... The only people saying it's luck are the ones without the skill or work ethic to do it themselves. Everyone I know that has money spent years in school and has worked their ass off.

The fact you are even alive was an infinitesimally small chance.

You could have been born with one of many debilitating childhood diseases. You could have been born to abusive parents. You could have been born in some 3rd world country during an ethnic cleansing.

Now consider all the things that happened in your life that made you, you. A lazy little white douche that grew up in a middle class suburb, and wouldn't know real work if it bit you in the ass. Your definition of work is driving the lawn tractor to cut the grass.

So yes, in this universe dominated by chance you were simply lucky. I am sorry, but that does not morally give you the right to have billions, whilst others starve and die in the streets.

Chance gives you a start, hard work

Stopped reading there.... Hard work means diddly shit.

[morondog]

(13-03-2012 12:34 PM)jackashflash Wrote:  Stopped reading there.... Hard work means diddly shit.

My hard work means plenty to me. What, you want me to sit on my ass?

[germanyt]

(13-03-2012 12:34 PM)jackashflash Wrote:  

(13-03-2012 01:34 AM)Azaraith Wrote:  

(10-03-2012 11:38 PM)jackashflash Wrote:  

(10-03-2012 09:59 PM)Azaraith Wrote:  haha... The only people saying it's luck are the ones without the skill or work ethic to do it themselves. Everyone I know that has money spent years in school and has worked their ass off.

The fact you are even alive was an infinitesimally small chance.

You could have been born with one of many debilitating childhood diseases. You could have been born to abusive parents. You could have been born in some 3rd world country during an ethnic cleansing.

Now consider all the things that happened in your life that made you, you. A lazy little white douche that grew up in a middle class suburb, and wouldn't know real work if it bit you in the ass. Your definition of work is driving the lawn tractor to cut the grass.

So yes, in this universe dominated by chance you were simply lucky. I am sorry, but that does not morally give you the right to have billions, whilst others starve and die in the streets.

Chance gives you a start, hard work

Stopped reading there.... Hard work means diddly shit.

And liberals wonder why conservatives take such a hard line opposition to liberal economic policies.

[Logica Humano]

(13-03-2012 01:12 PM)germanyt Wrote:  

(13-03-2012 12:34 PM)jackashflash Wrote:  

(13-03-2012 01:34 AM)Azaraith Wrote:  

(10-03-2012 11:38 PM)jackashflash Wrote:  

(10-03-2012 09:59 PM)Azaraith Wrote:  haha... The only people saying it's luck are the ones without the skill or work ethic to do it themselves. Everyone I know that has money spent years in school and has worked their ass off.

The fact you are even alive was an infinitesimally small chance.

You could have been born with one of many debilitating childhood diseases. You could have been born to abusive parents. You could have been born in some 3rd world country during an ethnic cleansing.

Now consider all the things that happened in your life that made you, you. A lazy little white douche that grew up in a middle class suburb, and wouldn't know real work if it bit you in the ass. Your definition of work is driving the lawn tractor to cut the grass.

So yes, in this universe dominated by chance you were simply lucky. I am sorry, but that does not morally give you the right to have billions, whilst others starve and die in the streets.

Chance gives you a start, hard work

Stopped reading there.... Hard work means diddly shit.

And liberals wonder why conservatives take such a hard line opposition to liberal economic policies.

Both sides are filled with dipshits. Neither one is more innocent, right, or smart than the other. Instead of caring what group they belong to, look at their damn policies. This is what I mean by blind.