Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
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12-04-2012, 12:27 PM
 
RE: Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
(12-04-2012 10:33 AM)Vipa Wrote:  And hell no you have every right to hate them if they are like this. Making sure you survive your childhood is their job anyways, they don't deserve thanks for it if they fail to love you for who you are and constantly try to mindfuck you..

OMG. No you didn’t just say that!

(12-04-2012 10:39 AM)Dom Wrote:  [quote]Yes Egor, you are a guest here among atheists. Back off vulnerable people. I will not sit and watch you do harm. This is truly unacceptable.

Oh, will you shut up. Other than Lilith down there, I’m the only one telling him the responsible thing.

And let me say one other thing to him and you and anyone els: These support groups for atheists you all keep mentioning aren’t going to feed him, house him and pay his medical bills, so when you keep encouraging him to ditch his family for a support group, keep in mind you’re probably fucking him over with that advice.

Now, he’s 18 years old. If he wants to move out and get a job and try to make it on his own, he can do that, but he’s going to need his family. Encouraging him to hate them is the real harm you are doing.

So you’re little front, Dom? Whenever you feel froggy—leap.



(12-04-2012 05:27 AM)Zangash Wrote:  So what you're saying is the events contributing and leading up to my hating my parents is punishment for... hating my parents? I would explain to you how backwards and absurd that is, but since you're very clearly a theist...

You haven't given one reason to hate your parents. And you know, you're 18 so you need to be responsible for your word choices. The word hate is a pretty strong word, and you can justify just about anything if you hate someone enough. In my opinion, you need to learn a term: "external locus of control" because it will severely fuck up your life. It means you blame external things for your current situation and all your energy goes into "blaming" instead of internalizing a locus of control and fixing the situation for yourself. Fair or unfair as it may be, you have to take responsibility for your situation and either come to accept it or do something to fix it. Hating your parents (unless you were doing it as Jesus meant, which you're not) is not going to help you one bit.

So when you say "...the events leading up to hating my parents..." you aren't taking responsibility for hating your parents. You're saying some external thing is using you like a puppet and making you hate your parents. That's bullshit, and you know it.

I know you think you should be sympathized with, and every post on here other than mine will tell you just what you want to hear. I'm the odd one out--a theist, as you'd have it. Having said that, I do sympathize with you. When I was seventeen I wanted nothing more than to escape my mother. So I went into the Air Force, and I went to England for 8 years. Maybe the military isn't an option for you given your health concerns, but there are other options. And if there are no other options, then might I suggest you quit telling your very religious mom that you're a freaking atheist while she's setting a plate of food down in front of you?

If you have no other choice than to accept their help, then why not meet them halfway? Atheists are all about reason; how is that unreasonable?
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12-04-2012, 01:21 PM
RE: Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
Quote: If he wants to move out and get a job and try to make it on his own, he can do that, but he’s going to need his family. Encouraging him to hate them is the real harm you are doing.

I never encouraged him to hate his parents. IMO a bit of distance will do wonders in smoothing things out.

I am concerned about Crohns. I happen to know a lot about it, and constant emotional turmoil is going to make him very, very sick. The bout he had with it was unusually long lasting and unusually severe and dangerous. So I wonder hw come he experienced such an unusually severe atttack, and why the hospital stay didn't fix him up in a week.

Go back to extreme emotional turmoil.

You have no idea what it can do to an atheist to be forced to go to church 3 times a week and lie and lie and lie. Maybe you think we have no morals and we don't mind lying - you are so wrong.

How would you like it if we forbade you to ever mention god and we had the power to enforce it? How would you feel after a week? A year? many years?

IMO it is irresponsible to have him live in a situation like that when he is afflicted with Crohns. It could kill him.

Egor, I am not the fighting type, but please learn about things that are mentioned in a post before you reply. I cannot sit by and watch you harm someone, I don't care if you mean well or believe in what you say.

To the OP - I want to apologize deeply for the turn this thread has taken. You came for help and ended up with people arguing about your situation. Please chalk it up to the fact that we truly care about you and what happens to you. This is a very supportive group here and if you stick around you will find a lot of help.

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12-04-2012, 02:13 PM
 
RE: Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
Dom, I'm not going to hijack this post and derail it, so I'm not going to argue with you except to say I don't give a damn what you will or won't sit by and watch. You really have to know that, or you will mistake me.
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12-04-2012, 02:31 PM
RE: Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
Hating your parents is wrong unless you do it like Jesus told you to =p

What a horribly biased statement. I've helped plenty of people deal with issues that are in no way mine, Next time you try to help remember that not everyon is you. If you're lookng to give him advice accept that he has different opinions than you do. Don't tell him to become you.

He is right though, that if you just focus on how bad your parents treat you then you'll stay stuck. You're 18, find a way out of it. You are legally capable to leave so you should have an answer. You should've been looking for it at 11. I have the same issue with overthinking sometimes. There are times that you have to act. Meeting groups will give you some better perspectives and you might meet people who can help teach you things. Work always helps. Get out there and do what you need to do. Trust me, I suck at it, I'm barely independent and I'm 29, you have to make it happen. While you're working on it things will make more sense.

Asking a group even online was a great first step, but keep going further and keep us informed. Make sure you get some local contacts though, it's very important to know people in your area in the event of unexpected circumstances. Friends very often save lives, find them and cherish them. There are people out there perfectly willing to spend time with you and help you out. There are people out there for anyone. If you have some people behind your decisions it really will help.

And as Dom said you really need some space from your family they probably won't seem as bad after a while away from them, but it's a bad time to just stay put and be upset. Start working on your ticket out and I bet yur mood will be a lot mor positive. The first trick is to find people who will help keep you on track. It's really easy to back track if there's no one around to catch you.

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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12-04-2012, 02:37 PM
RE: Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
I can't reply at all... I've tried several times but it all ends up like my second post in this thread... It's getting pretty frustrating. What do the boxes in the reply box mean? How do I end make specific quote tags?
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12-04-2012, 02:43 PM (This post was last modified: 12-04-2012 02:50 PM by Anjele.)
RE: Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
Not all parents should be parents, nor do they deserve respect and love if they have never shown any. Some parents are just toxic.

This young man needs support, not religious babble and more of what he is enduring at home.

Egor, you are an ass. Gonna call Dom out for a fight, gonna rant when someone is looking for help, this is the way your god tells you to live...glad I don't feel the deluded need to adhere to that crap.

I'm not anti-social. I'm pro-solitude. Sleepy
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12-04-2012, 02:45 PM
RE: Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
(12-04-2012 02:37 PM)Zangash Wrote:  I can't reply at all... I've tried several times but it all ends up like my second post in this thread... It's getting pretty frustrating. What do the boxes in the reply box mean? How do I end make specific quote tags?
Best option is to make the quotes yourself not using reply:
[ quote] [ /quote] without spaces

[ quote=dude] blubb [ /quote] (without spaces) =
dude Wrote:blubb
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12-04-2012, 02:47 PM
RE: Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
As I said in my email just switch the editor to source while using quotes and use editor mode while inputting links and such. When you switch tabs the source is all written out clear as day, and quotes become a lot easier.

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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12-04-2012, 02:51 PM (This post was last modified: 12-04-2012 02:58 PM by Zangash.)
RE: Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
(12-04-2012 02:31 PM)Lilith Pride Wrote:  Hating your parents is wrong unless you do it like Jesus told you to =p

What a horribly biased statement. I've helped plenty of people deal with issues that are in no way mine, Next time you try to help remember that not everyon is you. If you're lookng to give him advice accept that he has different opinions than you do. Don't tell him to become you.

He is right though, that if you just focus on how bad your parents treat you then you'll stay stuck. You're 18, find a way out of it. You are legally capable to leave so you should have an answer. You should've been looking for it at 11. I have the same issue with overthinking sometimes. There are times that you have to act. Meeting groups will give you some better perspectives and you might meet people who can help teach you things. Work always helps. Get out there and do what you need to do. Trust me, I suck at it, I'm barely independent and I'm 29, you have to make it happen. While you're working on it things will make more sense.

Asking a group even online was a great first step, but keep going further and keep us informed. Make sure you get some local contacts though, it's very important to know people in your area in the event of unexpected circumstances. Friends very often save lives, find them and cherish them. There are people out there perfectly willing to spend time with you and help you out. There are people out there for anyone. If you have some people behind your decisions it really will help.

And as Dom said you really need some space from your family they probably won't seem as bad after a while away from them, but it's a bad time to just stay put and be upset. Start working on your ticket out and I bet yur mood will be a lot mor positive. The first trick is to find people who will help keep you on track. It's really easy to back track if there's no one around to catch you.
I actually have several plans to get out. My confidence in them is kinda... low, though. At 11 I kind of figured leaving at 18 was going to happen regardless without really thinking it out. When I was 16 I seriously started plotting.

One way out is through soccer. I'm going to a pretty major tournament with my team in July in Denmark. We're sponsored and everything, so it won't be too expensive, and hundreds of scouts are going to be there to pick up players for their teams. They'll pay for my college and living arrangements if they pick me up.

If that doesn't work, I have another major tournament in August with another team. I think the tournament is being hosted by ESPN. A lot of college scouts will be there. I could possibly get a scholarship to play for a University.

Another way is a book I've been writing. I in no way want to toot my own horn, but I'm a good writer. Everyone I've let read it has loved it. I know, that's really not many in the grand scheme of things, but it's motivating. When I finish it I'm gonna send it to a bunch of companies to try and get them interested, and if it never makes it out of the slush pile I'm gonna enter a contest where all the quality stories entered will get a more or less instant deal on their book. That's not until December, though, but it's the route I have the most confidence in...

As it turns out, one of the people on my team is also an Atheist, and he said he'll help me find a group.

Thanks for the help.
(12-04-2012 08:42 AM)Dom Wrote:  You said you were 18 - any chance of moving out?

Having something continuously shoved down your throat that you don't believe in is unbearable sometimes, especially at your age.

It also exacerbates Crohn's. Emotional turmoil is a trigger for flare ups. This is actually making you sick.

For that reason have no problems recommending that you try your darndest to get out of there.

I've got chances, but not anytime in the immediate future.

I was never actually told emotional turmoil can cause flare ups, but I kind of had a suspicion... Thanks for confirming it.
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12-04-2012, 03:31 PM
RE: Living in a heavily Christian household when you have no belief
(12-04-2012 02:51 PM)Zangash Wrote:  I actually have several plans to get out. My confidence in them is kinda... low, though. At 11 I kind of figured leaving at 18 was going to happen regardless without really thinking it out. When I was 16 I seriously started plotting.

One way out is through soccer. I'm going to a pretty major tournament with my team in July in Denmark. We're sponsored and everything, so it won't be too expensive, and hundreds of scouts are going to be there to pick up players for their teams. They'll pay for my college and living arrangements if they pick me up.

If that doesn't work, I have another major tournament in August with another team. I think the tournament is being hosted by ESPN. A lot of college scouts will be there. I could possibly get a scholarship to play for a University.

Another way is a book I've been writing. I in no way want to toot my own horn, but I'm a good writer. Everyone I've let read it has loved it. I know, that's really not many in the grand scheme of things, but it's motivating. When I finish it I'm gonna send it to a bunch of companies to try and get them interested, and if it never makes it out of the slush pile I'm gonna enter a contest where all the quality stories entered will get a more or less instant deal on their book. That's not until December, though, but it's the route I have the most confidence in...

As it turns out, one of the people on my team is also an Atheist, and he said he'll help me find a group.

Thanks for the help.
(12-04-2012 08:42 AM)Dom Wrote:  You said you were 18 - any chance of moving out?

Having something continuously shoved down your throat that you don't believe in is unbearable sometimes, especially at your age.

It also exacerbates Crohn's. Emotional turmoil is a trigger for flare ups. This is actually making you sick.

For that reason have no problems recommending that you try your darndest to get out of there.


I've got chances, but not anytime in the immediate future.

I was never actually told emotional turmoil can cause flare ups, but I kind of had a suspicion... Thanks for confirming it.


Eat often and little at a time, and learn to love fish. Don't smoke. Flareups will become less and less likely as you get older until you hit your 50s.

Your plans sound good if you are good at soccer. You should check into all types of scholarships, there are quite a few out there. You may get a literary one for instance. Not knowing you I can't suggest any others but go and track down lists of scholarships and see what may fit.

Sounds like you are on the right track already.

Don't hate your parents, they mean well enough. Just sift the good from the bad and go with that. I bet of you make a list of all the good things about them and what they do for you, you will surprise yourself.

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Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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