Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
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09-12-2016, 05:19 PM
RE: Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
(09-12-2016 04:52 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  Had Logan stabbed or sliced and wounded or killed any of the bystanders what kind of conversation would we be having now?

The officer didn’t do everything he could to stop what was clearly a dangerous situation and let those innocent teenagers get killed and wounded, what was he thinking? Why didn’t he shoot the guy wielding knives in a schoolyard full of kids? He should have his badge taken for not doing his duty to protect the public from armed assailants.

Damned if you do and damned if you don’t.

It would be an even more bizarre narrative if the cop missed and killed someone else.

Should police be shooting people who are mentally disturbed? In a crowded environment? I could see one justification if the subject is also armed with a firearm.

We have to remember that what we observe is not nature herself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning ~ Werner Heisenberg
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09-12-2016, 05:22 PM
RE: Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
(09-12-2016 04:49 PM)Dom Wrote:  Why don't they shoot tranquilizers?

(Probably a stupid question)

Because anything fast acting will be very dependent on the body weight of the perp..... If he's 10 kilos too light - you're just as likely to kill him as incapacitate him........

Tranq guns are for highly trained professionals - used in pretty controlled settings....


Taking down a violent human with one would not have a likely good outcome...

Also --- wild animals, unlike wild humans aren't likely to be stone to the gills on cocaine, meth or some other stimulant that'd counteract a tranquilizer.........

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09-12-2016, 05:25 PM
RE: Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
(09-12-2016 04:27 PM)tomilay Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 04:00 PM)Paleophyte Wrote:  In a situation like this it is easy to play armchair quarterback. The one fact that we can know for certain is that we weren't there and it wasn't our call to make.

Honestly though, if I were running around in a crowd weilding a pair of knives and a police officer with gun drawn yells at me to drop them, I'd be surprised if I wasn't shot.

Someone has to play armchair quarterback. Otherwise, we can throw our hands up and say all shootings are justified because we weren't there and it wasn't our call.

One can see clearly, that there is a crowd of high-school children. You don't need to be there to realize how dangerous firing a weapon is in that environment.

Even if the man were scared, or poorly trained, cops usually have tasers.

Everybody's an expert - after the fact.....

Try doing it in real life.

Then you'll understand how quickly situations turn to flaming buckets of shit....


....

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09-12-2016, 05:30 PM
RE: Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
(09-12-2016 05:25 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 04:27 PM)tomilay Wrote:  Someone has to play armchair quarterback. Otherwise, we can throw our hands up and say all shootings are justified because we weren't there and it wasn't our call.

One can see clearly, that there is a crowd of high-school children. You don't need to be there to realize how dangerous firing a weapon is in that environment.

Even if the man were scared, or poorly trained, cops usually have tasers.

Everybody's an expert - after the fact.....

Try doing it in real life.

Then you'll understand how quickly situations turn to flaming buckets of shit....


....

My hunch is situations are less likely turn to flaming buckets the better trained the protagonist.

We have to remember that what we observe is not nature herself, but nature exposed to our method of questioning ~ Werner Heisenberg
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09-12-2016, 05:33 PM
RE: Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
(09-12-2016 05:25 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 04:27 PM)tomilay Wrote:  Someone has to play armchair quarterback. Otherwise, we can throw our hands up and say all shootings are justified because we weren't there and it wasn't our call.

One can see clearly, that there is a crowd of high-school children. You don't need to be there to realize how dangerous firing a weapon is in that environment.

Even if the man were scared, or poorly trained, cops usually have tasers.

Everybody's an expert - after the fact.....

Try doing it in real life.

Then you'll understand how quickly situations turn to flaming buckets of shit....


....

Cops are supposed to be trained for these types of situations.
I hear a lot about how they risk their lives everyday (and they do sometimes),but they also should know when their lives are not at risk and less-than-lethal measures can be used.
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09-12-2016, 05:37 PM
RE: Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
(09-12-2016 05:33 PM)pablo Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 05:25 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  Everybody's an expert - after the fact.....

Try doing it in real life.

Then you'll understand how quickly situations turn to flaming buckets of shit....


....

Cops are supposed to be trained for these types of situations.
I hear a lot about how they risk their lives everyday (and they do sometimes),but they also should know when their lives are not at risk and less-than-lethal measures can be used.

The only cop I know who would try disarming an attacker with a knife -- by hand -- is a moron.....

All the cops I know, who know him -- think he's a moron too...... They call him "Bruce Lee" behind his back......

.....

Sorry -- I don't think anyone's obligated to handle an armed individual - who's armed with a knife - with kid gloves.....

Tell him to stop?? Sure....

Then shoot his ass, and keep shooting till he quits being a moron.....

.......................................

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09-12-2016, 05:40 PM
RE: Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
(09-12-2016 05:30 PM)tomilay Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 05:25 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  Everybody's an expert - after the fact.....

Try doing it in real life.

Then you'll understand how quickly situations turn to flaming buckets of shit....


....

My hunch is situations are less likely turn to flaming buckets the better trained the protagonist.

It's obvious he DID train....

One shot - one stopped perp -- no collateral injuries.

Perfect.

....

Who needed training is the moron with the knives....

.......................................

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09-12-2016, 05:42 PM
RE: Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
(09-12-2016 05:37 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 05:33 PM)pablo Wrote:  Cops are supposed to be trained for these types of situations.
I hear a lot about how they risk their lives everyday (and they do sometimes),but they also should know when their lives are not at risk and less-than-lethal measures can be used.

The only cop I know who would try disarming an attacker with a knife -- by hand -- is a moron.....

All the cops I know, who know him -- think he's a moron too...... They call him "Bruce Lee" behind his back......

.....

Sorry -- I don't think anyone's obligated to handle an armed individual - who's armed with a knife - with kid gloves.....

Tell him to stop?? Sure....

Then shoot his ass, and keep shooting till he quits being a moron.....

I didn't say anything about disarming him by hand.
Most cops these days have pepper spray and tazers.
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09-12-2016, 06:04 PM
RE: Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
(09-12-2016 05:40 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(09-12-2016 05:30 PM)tomilay Wrote:  My hunch is situations are less likely turn to flaming buckets the better trained the protagonist.

It's obvious he DID train....

One shot - one stopped perp -- no collateral injuries.

Perfect.

....

Who needed training is the moron with the knives....

So... you consider it perfect that a slim, untrained, probably scared to shit child is shot dead with a gun, by a meatwagon trained in multiple ways of subduing people twice his size, with multiple *non-lethal* weapons at his disposal. This is "perfect" to you?




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09-12-2016, 07:35 PM
RE: Logan Clark Should Not Have Been Shot
I've seen the training used to show law enforcement how not to be a witness to their own murders, complete with video footage of officers dying at the hands of armed individuals from their dash cameras. Even an unarmed person can disable an officer if (s)he is close enough, before the officer can draw a firearm for self defense. There is a prescribed distance (not sure, ~21 feet) at which law enforcement is authorized to use deadly force, because in that distance, they can be charged by the perp, and that's where it can get hairy in a hurry. No, it's not nice, it's not pretty, but that is the grim truth about subduing someone who is an immediate threat. Hate on me if you want, but I've seen the training, and it has resulted in fewer members of law enforcement being killed or injured seriously enough in the line of duty that they are permanently unable to serve. I know guys who have been slashed by a knife badly enough that they can't even use one arm again. I don't like what happened, either, but I'm not going to judge that officer based on that video.
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