Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
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04-11-2013, 09:24 AM
Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
I posted a comment on a youtube video [the video was of a street preacher who was saying absurd comments like "if you hate someone, you commit murder in your heart", and I posted that it was a ridiculous concept. The youtuber then started asking me these types of question:

"Can the universe have existed and not existed in the same way and at the same time before there was a human mind?"

"Before there where humans could the universe have existed and not existed in the same way and at the same time?"

"Does the law of non-contradiction function before there were humans brains to understand it?"

Now, I can't help but think that he has some sort of "apologetic script" to trap people into some sort of "snake oil sales tactic", but . . . .my question is, have you encountered Christians like this?

BTW, . . . his answer to my statement against "hate = murder" was . . . . . "God said so." Rolleyes
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04-11-2013, 10:03 AM
RE: Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
(04-11-2013 09:24 AM)DeavonReye Wrote:  I posted a comment on a youtube video [the video was of a street preacher who was saying absurd comments like "if you hate someone, you commit murder in your heart", and I posted that it was a ridiculous concept. The youtuber then started asking me these types of question:

"Can the universe have existed and not existed in the same way and at the same time before there was a human mind?"

"Before there where humans could the universe have existed and not existed in the same way and at the same time?"

"Does the law of non-contradiction function before there were humans brains to understand it?"

Now, I can't help but think that he has some sort of "apologetic script" to trap people into some sort of "snake oil sales tactic", but . . . .my question is, have you encountered Christians like this?

BTW, . . . his answer to my statement against "hate = murder" was . . . . . "God said so." Rolleyes

eh, this sounds like a metaphor to me. Don't take it literally.
As for youtube comments received... inept comments, nonsense
Lucky I haven't encounter christians like this but I have encounter psychic or ghost believers, they are more or less incapable of thinking differently.

"I don't have to have faith, I have experience." Joseph Campbell
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04-11-2013, 10:16 AM
RE: Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
(04-11-2013 09:24 AM)DeavonReye Wrote:  I posted a comment on a youtube video [the video was of a street preacher who was saying absurd comments like "if you hate someone, you commit murder in your heart", and I posted that it was a ridiculous concept. The youtuber then started asking me these types of question:

"Can the universe have existed and not existed in the same way and at the same time before there was a human mind?"

"Before there where humans could the universe have existed and not existed in the same way and at the same time?"

"Does the law of non-contradiction function before there were humans brains to understand it?"

Now, I can't help but think that he has some sort of "apologetic script" to trap people into some sort of "snake oil sales tactic", but . . . .my question is, have you encountered Christians like this?

BTW, . . . his answer to my statement against "hate = murder" was . . . . . "God said so." Rolleyes

I think I can make some sense of the questions, although I am not sure exactly
what the person meant. Some of the questions are akin to:

"Does logic exist independent of human existence?"
"Did the universe exist when there were no people to observe it?"
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04-11-2013, 10:20 AM
RE: Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
I THINK he's trying to get me to "admit that logic and reason come from [his] god". I'm sure there was an apologetic pamphlet that has circulated around the various denominations. It may even have some "Kalam" type origins.
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04-11-2013, 06:08 PM
RE: Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
That sounds like an I&I philosophy debate. Perhaps I&I could point you in the direction of the leaders of his particular branch of philosophy.

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
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04-11-2013, 09:10 PM
RE: Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
That would be helpful. However, I must admit that I'm uncertain as to what "I&I" is.
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04-11-2013, 09:29 PM
RE: Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
Its like a theist friend of mine that thinks he has won an augment by trying to claim you can make 1+1=0 with math.

I got two apples once and said to him make those two apples = 0 (was expecting him to eat them, but he just wafted on with other esoteric nonsense.
tree in forest yaddayadda.

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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04-11-2013, 10:01 PM
RE: Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
(04-11-2013 10:20 AM)DeavonReye Wrote:  I THINK he's trying to get me to "admit that logic and reason come from [his] god". I'm sure there was an apologetic pamphlet that has circulated around the various denominations. It may even have some "Kalam" type origins.

Yeah, it sounds like a TAG script. His premise is that you can't know anything/use logic without god because everything comes from god. It's one of his "proofs." Whatever you do, don't admit that you might be wrong about everything you know, yada, yada. He'll blow off everything you say from that point on.
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05-11-2013, 07:10 AM
RE: Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
(04-11-2013 09:24 AM)DeavonReye Wrote:  . . . .my question is, have you encountered Christians like this?

That try to reason without a brain? Yeah.

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05-11-2013, 08:22 AM
RE: Logic/Reason without a human brain? Christian apologetics.
(04-11-2013 10:01 PM)Chopdoc Wrote:  
(04-11-2013 10:20 AM)DeavonReye Wrote:  I THINK he's trying to get me to "admit that logic and reason come from [his] god". I'm sure there was an apologetic pamphlet that has circulated around the various denominations. It may even have some "Kalam" type origins.

Yeah, it sounds like a TAG script. His premise is that you can't know anything/use logic without god because everything comes from god. It's one of his "proofs." Whatever you do, don't admit that you might be wrong about everything you know, yada, yada. He'll blow off everything you say from that point on.

He's already tried that. I stated that logic is true whether or not there is a human brain there to test it. He used that, later, to say that "I admitted that REASON [my caps] can happen without a mind". I made sure he knew that I did not say that. Reason does require a human mind, as far as I'm concerned.

So far, I haven't seen any emails stating that he posted a new response, but he's one the requires all posts be reviewed before he puts them up. In other words, . . . he could very easily end his posts to me [regardless of my response] and make it look like he "won the debate". I realize it is foolish to converse under those conditions, but I can only hope he [as a good Christian and all] would be honest about the true exchan. . . Weeping. . . . yeah, I laugh at the very attempt to type that out. Confused
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