Looking for best place to debate
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26-12-2014, 09:45 PM
Looking for best place to debate
Lately I've been getting banned from Facebook theist-atheist groups, even though I'm not doing anything wrong. I get to the point where I can get a theist to agree to debate with me and then poof, I'm ousted.

Are there some groups or forums that debating is encouraged that anyone in here can recommend?

Check out my now-defunct atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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26-12-2014, 09:56 PM (This post was last modified: 26-12-2014 10:05 PM by Full Circle.)
RE: Looking for best place to debate
(26-12-2014 09:45 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  Lately I've been getting banned from Facebook theist-atheist groups, even though I'm not doing anything wrong. I get to the point where I can get a theist to agree to debate with me and then poof, I'm ousted.

Are there some groups or forums that debating is encouraged that anyone in here can recommend?

Thunderdome!

Actually I don’t have the patience for it so I haven’t gone looking, sorry I can’t help.

EDIT: Wait a minute, there was this guy name dr truth on a theist forum that was there for a long time and left by his own accord, his final post was a gem and I saved it
Here is a brief summary of what I have learned:

1. Some people's concept of god is that god is not omniscient.

Many of you have asserted that god does not know the outcomes of our choices before we make them, or knows all possible outcomes but not the actual outcomes in advance.

2. Some people's concept of god is that god's love and/or mercy is conditional.

Many of you have asserted that god is merciful but only to those he saves. Those who he creates knowing they will go to hell do not receive his mercy on the day of judgment, but his wrath.

3. I have learned some new (to me) paradoxes of faith:

a. If hell is a place where people are separated from god, then god can't be omnipresent. If god is omnipresent then hell can't be a place where people are separated from god.

b. God can't be omniscient and omnipotent at the same time. If he's omniscient, he knows every outcome in the history of the universe right at the start. Therefore, he can't change any outcome at all, because if he changes an outcome, then he didn't know what the outcome was and was therefore not omniscient. If god can't change any outcomes, he can't change any part of his plan, he is not omnipotent. God became effectively impotent the moment he became omniscient. At what point in creation did he become omniscient? At that moment, he lost his omnipotence.


In summary, the best solution to the paradox that allows the possibility of an omniscient, loving, merciful god who grants free will, is to abandon the idea of hell altogether, as one responder almost did when he said "hell is just the end of an unsaved person's existence". God could be omniscient, loving and merciful if he only creates people who will go to heaven. The only adjustment to faith that is required if we abandon the idea of hell is to dismiss the Christian view that the only way to the father is through Jesus. This rather inconvenient line of the Bible makes it abundantly clear that there is a heaven, and if so, as a matter of necessity, there must be a corresponding place that is not heaven, which you can call anything you like I suppose but is commonly called hell. However, if we want an omniscient, loving, merciful god and free will, then we must at the very least admit that such a god can only exist if every person goes to heaven after death. God could not permit a single soul into hell and be merciful. So, why has nobody suggested this simple answer to the paradox? It must be that the threat of hell is a requirement of religion, because if everybody goes to heaven regardless, then nobody has any compelling reason to worship god. Clearly, if a religion did not assert the existence of hell, then nobody would need to join the religion in the first place and the religion would have a very small congregation of people who worship god for reasons other than their desire to go to heaven.

I feel satisfied that we have gone as far as we can in the discussion and again would like to thank you all for contributing to helping me understand faith.

but at the moment I don’t remember the name of the forum.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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26-12-2014, 10:10 PM
RE: Looking for best place to debate
Found it! It was a link given by dancefortwo last year.

(23-05-2013 03:01 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  Debating is just not my forte so I stay clear of things like that. However, I discovered this confrontation/conversation between an atheist and a bunch of christians on the ChristianForum but it was pinned and highlighted on the Ex-Christian Forum.

Actually I posted this on another thread but I think it deserves it's own thread subject. It's very long but just stay with it. Dr Truth is the atheist. He/she is always polite, keeps the topic from drifting off center and in the end sticks it to the christians.

Here it is:

http://www.christianforums.com/t7686721/

Dancer

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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26-12-2014, 10:17 PM
RE: Looking for best place to debate
(26-12-2014 10:10 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  Found it! It was a link given by dancefortwo last year.

(23-05-2013 03:01 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  Debating is just not my forte so I stay clear of things like that. However, I discovered this confrontation/conversation between an atheist and a bunch of christians on the ChristianForum but it was pinned and highlighted on the Ex-Christian Forum.

Actually I posted this on another thread but I think it deserves it's own thread subject. It's very long but just stay with it. Dr Truth is the atheist. He/she is always polite, keeps the topic from drifting off center and in the end sticks it to the christians.

Here it is:

http://www.christianforums.com/t7686721/

Dancer

Just looking at that website gave me the willies.
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26-12-2014, 10:25 PM
RE: Looking for best place to debate
Thanks FC, I was banned from there a while ago.

Check out my now-defunct atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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26-12-2014, 11:04 PM
RE: Looking for best place to debate
(26-12-2014 10:25 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  Thanks FC, I was banned from there a while ago.

Congratulations? Undecided

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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26-12-2014, 11:05 PM
RE: Looking for best place to debate
(26-12-2014 10:17 PM)pablo Wrote:  
(26-12-2014 10:10 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  Found it! It was a link given by dancefortwo last year.

Just looking at that website gave me the willies.

Take the time to read the first 11 pages, I just did again and this dr truth person is amazing.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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26-12-2014, 11:12 PM
RE: Looking for best place to debate
I remember when this was posted the first time around and I did read it. He was remarkable, staying in point and holding them to it as well.

But I'm still searching for a site that won't just evict me because I'm an atheist.

Check out my now-defunct atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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26-12-2014, 11:16 PM
RE: Looking for best place to debate
(26-12-2014 11:12 PM)WillHopp Wrote:  I remember when this was posted the first time around and I did read it. He was remarkable, staying in point and holding them to it as well.

But I'm still searching for a site that won't just evict me because I'm an atheist.

I’ve only joined one Christian forum but haven’t outed myself yet. Have you ever gone in saying you are looking for a reason to believe?

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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26-12-2014, 11:54 PM
RE: Looking for best place to debate
Actually, I can't remember the pretenses I assumed when I joined them. A few times I tried the KingsChosen approach and posted an "Ask an Atheist" thread, but that didn't work for too long. I did mention I wanted a reason to believe in the FB group I joined (and was ousted from), but that didn't work either.

Check out my now-defunct atheism blog. It's just a blog, no ads, no revenue, no gods.
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