Loopholes
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27-04-2010, 08:05 PM
RE: Loopholes
(27-04-2010 07:37 PM)martinb59 Wrote:  You view it as a jab because it is true.

No, we view it as a jab because that's what it is. You have no basis whatsoever for saying that we haven't looked at your position, and the "you are supposed to be a critical thinker" bit really can't be interpreted any other way. Stop pretending that you're innocent and own up to the fact that you used an insult when you shouldn't have.
Now, if you want to show us up and present proof that the flood occurred, feel free.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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27-04-2010, 08:07 PM
 
RE: Loopholes
Christians(I am generalizing here obviously, but trying to cover the majority never-the-less) believe that Yahweh created the universe, approximately six thousand years ago. Yahweh did so over the course of a week, spontaneously generating, through his godhood, the cosmos, earth, and everything else. Eden was created on earth, and Adam the first male human, created from dust. Shortly afterwards, Eve, the first female, was created from one of Adams ribs. Then happiness occurred.

Later Lucifer, Yahwehs friend, would betray Yahweh, by deceiving Eve and tricking her into eating the forbidden fruit that Yahweh had placed into Eden. Long story short, Adam and Eve were kicked out of Eden and never allowed to return again.

Following this, they began the population of earth. After a significant amount of inbreeding, the earth was now populated, culture had taken root, and life was going great.

However, Lucifer had set his grasp deeply upon the world. Yahweh was displeased with how his creation had turned evil, yes everyone, including the babies too. So, he told Noah, whom Yahweh liked very much, to build a boat and using his divine powers Yahweh ushered two of every variety of creature upon earth, into the boat, known as the ark. Then Yahweh spontaneously generated a massive amount of water, and drowned the entire world. Forty days later, everything was cool again though, and then the organisms that had survived upon the earth, came off from the ark, and began to repopulate the planet once more; with an extreme amount of inbreeding.

So, now that the world had been reset, so to speak, Yahweh wasn't in such a bad mood. On the other hand, he didn't like the false idols that everyone was starting to worship, so Yahweh let his chosen people know what he thought of that. After a significant amount of butchering and destroying of these false idols, and various miracles to prove his existence, Yahweh decided it was time to create Heaven.

So, he created a son through a virgin conception in a random human. Through his divine guidance, Yahwehs son, Jesus would become the savior of the world, and initiate the 'first coming' as prophesied in various holy text. After a fair amount of time had passed, Jesus was up and about and doing his thing, being the savior and everything. Then, he was betrayed. Long story short, he was crucified, dead for three days, and then resurrected, ascending into heaven and opening the doorway for everyone who accepted Jesus into their heart as the one true savior. Fast forward a couple thousand years, and here we are.

That's my 'Christianity in a nutshell', with as little prodding as possible bias.
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27-04-2010, 08:11 PM
 
RE: Loopholes
(27-04-2010 07:03 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(27-04-2010 06:14 PM)martinb59 Wrote:  Do I think it happened yes.

Why?

Quote:Funny you say it today as there another group that claimed they found Noah's ark.

Yeah. So what? People have been claiming that they found Noah's ark for years. Every single time, it's been exposed as false almost immediately afterward. Let me know when it's been declared official.

Quote:You are supposed to be a critical free thinker Google it and see what the other side says

I have. What the "other side" says is crap, plain and simple. If you think it isn't, could you explain why?

And about your post responding to Ceryle, simply saying "You're an idiot" means nothing. If you want to defend Christianity, try to actually build an argument rather than insulting people.

Didn't say he was an idiot said he was ignorant. Do I need to Wikipedia the definitions for you.

As far as the Noah's arc story I said ANOTHER group. Did I put any credence in it?
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27-04-2010, 08:16 PM
 
RE: Loopholes
(27-04-2010 06:14 PM)martinb59 Wrote:  
(27-04-2010 05:25 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  As an aside, martin, what do you think of the flood story? Do you think that there is evidence for its occurrence? If so, what? If not, why not?

Do I think it happened yes. Funny you say it today as there another group that claimed they found Noah's ark. You are supposed to be a critical free thinker Google it and see what the other side says, trust me they won't take away your atheist card if you go on those sites, then compare it to what people who don't believe it happened say. Try and do it with an unbiased mind, if that is possible.
(27-04-2010 08:21 AM)omega21 Wrote:  Can everyone tell me the loopholes you all see in christianity? I need arguments to help support me in debates with christians. I know of some but I want to see what you all have to say.

I don't think you know what "loophole" means. If you mean Loophole the way the true meaning is then people are responding wrong.

Here's a link to the article: http://www.thestar.com/news/world/articl...hers-claim

I still call bullshit, though. There have been hundreds of claims and none of them have been verified as true.

The simple fact that it was 'Christian researchers' who claim they found the ark shows you can't take it 100% seriously.

What I also find ironic is the fact that they claim they used carbon dating to determine the 'craft' at 4800 years old...the same carbon dating method that fundies say doesn't work when dating fossils...Funny how it works for them, but fails for science!
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27-04-2010, 08:25 PM
 
RE: Loopholes
(27-04-2010 06:55 PM)Ceryle Wrote:  "You are supposed to be a critical free thinker Google it and see what the other side says, trust me they won't take away your atheist card if you go on those sites, then compare it to what people who don't believe it happened say. Try and do it with an unbiased mind, if that is possible." -Martin

Yes, and you are supposed to be a bigoted, paranoid, and delusional Christian. Glad you're living up to the standard.

....Seriously, do you think we can stop constantly making personal jibes at one another?
Also, I don't really think that Jesus being part of the divine conflicts at all. After all, it's clearly a polytheistic religion.
I just searched out that information you commented on. Noahs ark being found and such. Although I am very interested in seeing how this develops, I'm currently skeptical by both the informations primary source: Fox News. As well as the way that the information is presented. I will definitely look forward to further developments of this discovery though; thanks for sharing.

Look critical thinkers, Fox news is not the problem with the story, the group that claims to have found it is. "Archeologists from Noah’s Ark Ministries International (NAMI) have reported that they found an ark that they believe has a “99.9 percent” chance of being the ancient Biblical artifact known as Noah’s Ark." Who wrote the story? "World Net Daily (WND) is an American web site that publishes news and associated content from a U. S. conservative perspective"

So what are the odds that "Noah's Ark Ministries" found Noah's ark? And the story was published by "World Daily Net"? My guess is zero! But what do I know? I am a "bigoted, paranoid, and delusional Christian" Outside of calling some ignorant, show me where I have ever called anyone "bigoted, paranoid, and delusional Atheist" I have never called anyone "asshat"
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27-04-2010, 08:29 PM
 
RE: Loopholes
What I wrote was sarcastic and neither fair, nor true. I was using it to make a point; and I apologize for the disrespect that it created.
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27-04-2010, 08:32 PM
RE: Loopholes
(27-04-2010 08:11 PM)martinb59 Wrote:  Didn't say he was an idiot said he was ignorant. Do I need to Wikipedia the definitions for you.

You'll excuse me if I think that this

(27-04-2010 06:49 PM)martinb59 Wrote:  You making the above comment would be the equivalent of me saying "The people from Dane are foolish people, they believe a boy put a finger in a lesbian and that saved a town" How may things are wrong with that comment? What if I made that comment and tried to argue with you how stupid the the people from "Denmarkia" are? Those comments that I made are the equivalent of the majority of comments on this site.

And what happens is I would argue and use Wikipedia as my source "Dyke is slang terminology referring to a lesbian" and how could a boy put a finger in a lesbian and save a town? And since no one saw the boy how do you know it wasn't a lesbian? Do you see how ridiculous that is? But that is what I have to put up with on this site all the time.

goes a little beyond calling someone "ignorant".

Quote:As far as the Noah's arc story I said ANOTHER group. Did I put any credence in it?

As you presented it, I would assume that you did.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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27-04-2010, 08:35 PM
 
RE: Loopholes
"Your comments about Jesus show your ignorance! People... you don't have to agree with the other persons position when you argue a point, BUT you have to understand and have researched it enough to refute it."

I think I give a fair enough outline as to the nature of the specific argument that I am attempting to refute:
http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...59#pid3559
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27-04-2010, 08:37 PM
 
RE: Loopholes
(27-04-2010 08:07 PM)Ceryle Wrote:  Christians(I am generalizing here obviously, but trying to cover the majority never-the-less) believe that Yahweh created the universe, approximately six thousand years ago. Yahweh did so over the course of a week, spontaneously generating, through his godhood, the cosmos, earth, and everything else. Eden was created on earth, and Adam the first male human, created from dust. Shortly afterwards, Eve, the first female, was created from one of Adams ribs. Then happiness occurred.

Later Lucifer, Yahwehs friend, would betray Yahweh, by deceiving Eve and tricking her into eating the forbidden fruit that Yahweh had placed into Eden. Long story short, Adam and Eve were kicked out of Eden and never allowed to return again.

Following this, they began the population of earth. After a significant amount of inbreeding, the earth was now populated, culture had taken root, and life was going great.

However, Lucifer had set his grasp deeply upon the world. Yahweh was displeased with how his creation had turned evil, yes everyone, including the babies too. So, he told Moses, whom Yahweh liked very much, to build a boat and using his divine powers Yahweh ushered two of every variety of creature upon earth, into the boat, known as the ark. Then Yahweh spontaneously generated a massive amount of water, and drowned the entire world. Forty days later, everything was cool again though, and then the organisms that had survived upon the earth, came off from the ark, and began to repopulate the planet once more; with an extreme amount of inbreeding.

So, now that the world had been reset, so to speak, Yahweh wasn't in such a bad mood. On the other hand, he didn't like the false idols that everyone was starting to worship, so Yahweh let his chosen people know what he thought of that. After a significant amount of butchering and destroying of these false idols, and various miracles to prove his existence, Yahweh decided it was time to create Heaven.

So, he created a son through a virgin conception in a random human. Through his divine guidance, Yahwehs son, Jesus would become the savior of the world, and initiate the 'first coming' as prophesied in various holy text. After a fair amount of time had passed, Jesus was up and about and doing his thing, being the savior and everything. Then, he was betrayed. Long story short, he was crucified, dead for three days, and then resurrected, ascending into heaven and opening the doorway for everyone who accepted Jesus into their heart as the one true savior. Fast forward a couple thousand years, and here we are.

That's my 'Christianity in a nutshell', with as little prodding as possible bias.

Congratulations! You made my point about how little you know about the Bible. Anyone of you critically thinking, know both sides of the argument, have researched it many times, it's a bunch of bullocks, atheists want to tell young Ceryle how many mistakes he made?
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27-04-2010, 08:42 PM
 
RE: Loopholes
Yes, I am curious to know.
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