Lying - And there lies the problem
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21-02-2016, 09:40 AM
Lying - And there lies the problem
We all have the ability to lie.
If you disagree, you are lying and thus proving my point.

We not only lie to others, but we can lie to ourselves.
We can be deceived and at times it's difficult to find the truth, even when it's right before our eyes. Any decent magician can tell you that.

We can watch a cartoon and even cry when a cartoon character dies. It's all fiction, but we can empathize. We can imagine how sad it would be if it were real and our imagination floods our emotions.

We can even look at other fictional stories and feel great joy for the same reason. Our minds lie to us and we happily let it.

This is how religion prospers. It benefits from our ability to lie. Lies are the only way any religion survives.

Atheists base their epistemology on what we can show to be the truth. Science is what you do to prevent you from lying to yourself. Evidence, justifying your beliefs, taking steps toward the truth with each step based upon a observed fact.

It's no wonder that truth vs lies are at odds with each other. It's a war of reality vs fantasy and although we have the ability to get sucked into a fantasy, we really should be able to turn it off when we walk out of the movie theater or a church.

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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21-02-2016, 12:13 PM
RE: Lying - And there lies the problem
I think there are more than one kind of atheist "Atheists base their epistemology on what we can show to be the truth." There are atheist who simply do not buy or care about religion or it's stories, there are atheist who study the evidence and/or philosophy of beliefs and claims of gods and determine there's no evidence for them and there are atheists that are ignorant of any beliefs. They're all atheist (no god beliefs) just by/for different reasons.

Lying to ourselves has many benefits, the biggest drawback is our inability to sometimes recognize the lies we tell ourselves to make us feel better from the lies we tell to benefit ourselves in ways that hurt others. Human need VS human greed.

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21-02-2016, 02:06 PM
RE: Lying - And there lies the problem
Once the lies are realized, it is instructive to trace the effects throughout society.

The Iraq war is the easy place to start, but the myth of "American exceptionalism" yields more results.

I prefer to say that one of Man's greatest abilities is the tendency toward self deception.

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" -Epicurus (341-270B.C.E.)
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23-02-2016, 02:12 AM
RE: Lying - And there lies the problem
One of the main ways a lie protects itself is to impede or forbid examination and scrutiny. My advice for religious believers is as follows.

Whenever any ideology discourages or prohibits questioning, either via its own doctrine or via its proponents, that is one of the surest signs that you should question it. In fact, the more averse it is to being scrutinized, the more important it probably is to scrutinize it.

Unfortunately, most major religions at least have this very prohibition built into their core values.

The only sacred truth in science is that there are no sacred truths. – Carl Sagan
Sōla vēritās sancta in philosophiā nātūrālī est absentia vēritātum sanctārum.
Ἡ μόνη ἱερᾱ̀ ἀληθείᾱ ἐν φυσικῇ φιλοσοφίᾳ ἐστίν ἡ ἱερῶν ἀληθειῶν σπάνις.
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