Mafia X - Futurama
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14-08-2013, 12:48 PM
RE: Mafia X - Futurama
I still haven't calculated the best/worst case scenerio.

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14-08-2013, 12:52 PM
RE: Mafia X - Futurama
I'd like to makes some points:

1: Yes, the mafia was seriously underpowered this game, they needed at least one more player to stand a chance against the townies and better special abilities.

The Mafia had 3 players and 3 votes, possibly 4 if Tinny Tim joined. The townies had 9 players and 10 votes because of the double voter, possibly 11 if Tinny Tim joined. The mafia was SEVERELY outnumbered. Yes, that is the point of the game, but the mafia could have used one more player, especially with the townies holding a double voter.

Secondly, the power role distribution was just silly.

Mafia:
Donbot-protected from night investigations
Clamps-50% chance of avoiding a lynch
Joey-Nothing
All can perform night kills.

On the other hand townies had two investigators, two roleblockers, a doctor, a double voter, and a mystery role. That's a seriously stacked role distribution.

2. The night time delay really fucked this game up, the townies used this as time figure out who EVERYBODY was... which leads me to....

3. We need to re-examine the way we play mafia games on this forum.

Mafia is a game that is exciting because it is full of tension, mystery, deceit, trickery, and all that other good stuff. How does it work? By pitting an INFORMED minority against an UNINFORMED majority. This is how the game is supposed to be played, and this is the ONLY advantage the mafia has over the townies.

Guess what the philosophy the townies have been using for the past two games? Become the INFORMED majority fucking night 1! By day 2/night 2, the townies have become the INFORMED majority being pitted against an informed MINORITY! The mafia is fucking destroyed way to quickly under these circumstances, basically, the townies have been playing to win as quickly as possible at the expense of robbing the game of its intended tension and enjoyment. It turns into an exercise of shooting fish in a barrel. They do this by forming huge alliances day 1 and pinpointing who the mafia members are by the first night or second day. The mafia can no longer do ruses and pretend to be other players since they will be outed too quickly before they can do any damage.

THIS IS NOT HOW THE GAME IS SUPPOSED TO BE PLAYED. It's supposed to be intense romp of deception, logic, and always being unsure of who to trust, and we have been playing to the antithesis of that. On mafiascum.net a forums which has been up for over a decade solely dedicated to mafia players, they have rules SPECIFICALLY in place to prevent this kind of stuff from destroying the game too early, such as:

-No talking during the night phase
-No communication between players outside of the thread unless their roles allow it (such as mafia and mason roles)
-No outside sources of information allowed, such as screenshots and alliances

Basically, you have to use your wits about analyzing the actions of people within the thread and that's IT. THAT'S how mafia is supposed to be played, not these massive "let's figure out who is who" skype calls where the townies figure out who each other are day one. Otherwise, the townies have such a huge advantage it's not even funny.

That's my two cents. Drinking Beverage

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14-08-2013, 12:52 PM
RE: Mafia X - Futurama
Okay, it is still possible for the townies to lose. The game is not over. If there is still interest to continue we will.

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14-08-2013, 01:02 PM
RE: Mafia X - Futurama
(14-08-2013 12:52 PM)Tartarus Sauce Wrote:  I'd like to makes some points:

1: Yes, the mafia was seriously underpowered this game, they needed at least one more player to stand a chance against the townies and better special abilities.

The Mafia had 3 players and 3 votes, possibly 4 if Tinny Tim joined. The townies had 9 players and 10 votes because of the double voter, possibly 11 if Tinny Tim joined. The mafia was SEVERELY outnumbered. Yes, that is the point of the game, but the mafia could have used one more player, especially with the townies holding a double voter.

Secondly, the power role distribution was just silly.

Mafia:
Donbot-protected from night investigations
Clamps-50% chance of avoiding a lynch
Joey-Nothing
All can perform night kills.

On the other hand townies had two investigators, two roleblockers, a doctor, a double voter, and a mystery role. That's a seriously stacked role distribution.

2. The night time delay really fucked this game up, the townies used this as time figure out who EVERYBODY was... which leads me to....

3. We need to re-examine the way we play mafia games on this forum.

Mafia is a game that is exciting because it is full of tension, mystery, deceit, trickery, and all that other good stuff. How does it work? By pitting an INFORMED minority against an UNINFORMED majority. This is how the game is supposed to be played, and this is the ONLY advantage the mafia has over the townies.

Guess what the philosophy the townies have been using for the past two games? Become the INFORMED majority fucking night 1! By day 2/night 2, the townies have become the INFORMED majority being pitted against an informed MINORITY! The mafia is fucking destroyed way to quickly under these circumstances, basically, the townies have been playing to win as quickly as possible at the expense of robbing the game of its intended tension and enjoyment. It turns into an exercise of shooting fish in a barrel. They do this by forming huge alliances day 1 and pinpointing who the mafia members are by the first night or second day. The mafia can no longer do ruses and pretend to be other players since they will be outed too quickly before they can do any damage.

THIS IS NOT HOW THE GAME IS SUPPOSED TO BE PLAYED. It's supposed to be intense romp of deception, logic, and always being unsure of who to trust, and we have been playing to the antithesis of that. On mafiascum.net a forums which has been up for over a decade solely dedicated to mafia players, they have rules SPECIFICALLY in place to prevent this kind of stuff from destroying the game too early, such as:

-No talking during the night phase
-No communication between players outside of the thread unless their roles allow it (such as mafia and mason roles)
-No outside sources of information allowed, such as screenshots and alliances

Basically, you have to use your wits about analyzing the actions of people within the thread and that's IT. THAT'S how mafia is supposed to be played, not these massive "let's figure out who is who" skype calls where the townies figure out who each other are day one. Otherwise, the townies have such a huge advantage it's not even funny.

That's my two cents. Drinking Beverage
Nope. Fuck that shit. Your rules are restricive as fuck and it severely limiys the true deception aspect of the game which is the PMs. Its not like screenshots are accurate, they can be painlessly faked.

So, in aspect, you had two townies (Rev and I) who absolutely knew how to win and what it took TO WIN. We played the game exactly as it should have been played. The only thing wrong with this game was that people aren't suspicous enough of PMs and shit. They trusted Rev and I, and if one of us is Mafia, that could have severely fucked them up.

You balme the townies philosophy? Well, the philosphy is a good one, BUT it requires trust. The instant the townies get suspicous of one another, they have a chance of fucking shit up and losing.

In short, no, the game rules don't need to be changed.

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14-08-2013, 01:06 PM
RE: Mafia X - Futurama
(14-08-2013 12:52 PM)Tartarus Sauce Wrote:  -No outside sources of information allowed, such as screenshots and alliances

...these massive "let's figure out who is who" skype calls where the townies figure out who each other are day one.

No more Mafia related Skype calls. Post on the Board. That is why it is there.
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14-08-2013, 01:08 PM
RE: Mafia X - Futurama
It also didn't help that DL fucked up and PMed Rev his night action result 15minutes after Rev sent it in allowing Rev to know exactly who the Lovers were.

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14-08-2013, 01:09 PM
RE: Mafia X - Futurama
(14-08-2013 01:02 PM)Atothetheist Wrote:  Nope. Fuck that shit. Your rules are restricive as fuck and it severely limiys the true deception aspect of the game which is the PMs. Its not like screenshots are accurate, they can be painlessly faked.

So, in aspect, you had two townies (Rev and I) who absolutely knew how to win and what it took TO WIN. We played the game exactly as it should have been played. The only thing wrong with this game was that people aren't suspicous enough of PMs and shit. They trusted Rev and I, and if one of us is Mafia, that could have severely fucked them up.

You balme the townies philosophy? Well, the philosphy is a good one, BUT it requires trust. The instant the townies get suspicous of one another, they have a chance of fucking shit up and losing.

In short, no, the game rules don't need to be changed.

Stevie, you're just disagreeing because you know that if we change the game rules, you're going to have a harder time playing the game because you know it so well. The game originated on the board. Play it on the board. I'm not saying you or Dark should apply these rules to your future games, but it would make the games more fun and intense. Your method takes the fun out of the game. Future mods of games may apply these rules for different, interesting and intense games.
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14-08-2013, 01:13 PM
RE: Mafia X - Futurama
(14-08-2013 01:06 PM)Ferdinand Wrote:  
(14-08-2013 12:52 PM)Tartarus Sauce Wrote:  -No outside sources of information allowed, such as screenshots and alliances

...these massive "let's figure out who is who" skype calls where the townies figure out who each other are day one.

No more Mafia related Skype calls. Post on the Board. That is why it is there.

I disagree. I think it is a tool that can be used. Again, this game relies ON TRUST. I think that restricting modes of communication is bad. You people act like the TOWNIES KNOW WHO OTHER TOWNIES ARE. We don't. WE TRUST that these other people aren't. If we had fucked up and let the Mafia in the group, the game would have been there.

The time was long, but it was to be expected due to it being Dark's first game.

The game would have gone differently if muffs didn't reveal info he shouldn't have.

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14-08-2013, 01:16 PM
RE: Mafia X - Futurama
(14-08-2013 01:13 PM)Atothetheist Wrote:  
(14-08-2013 01:06 PM)Ferdinand Wrote:  No more Mafia related Skype calls. Post on the Board. That is why it is there.

I disagree. I think it is a tool that can be used. Again, this game relies ON TRUST. I think that restricting modes of communication is bad. You people act like the TOWNIES KNOW WHO OTHER TOWNIES ARE. We don't. WE TRUST that these other people aren't. If we had fucked up and let the Mafia in the group, the game would have been there.

The time was long, but it was to be expected due to it being Dark's first game.

The game would have gone differently if muffs didn't reveal info he shouldn't have.

No it wouldn't have.

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14-08-2013, 01:16 PM
RE: Mafia X - Futurama
(14-08-2013 01:13 PM)Atothetheist Wrote:  I disagree. I think it is a tool that can be used. Again, this game relies ON TRUST. I think that restricting modes of communication is bad. You people act like the TOWNIES KNOW WHO OTHER TOWNIES ARE. We don't. WE TRUST that these other people aren't. If we had fucked up and let the Mafia in the group, the game would have been there.

The time was long, but it was to be expected due to it being Dark's first game.

The game would have gone differently if muffs didn't reveal info he shouldn't have.

Again, not saying you need to apply these rules, but games with these rules enforced will be more enjoyable and intense to the players. The game should not be played like shooting fish in a barrel, as it has been played. Pay a visit to Mafia scum. They abide by the rules even with small groups like ours, and their games go about more intensely and surprisingly than ours because they abide by these rules.
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