Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
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10-08-2016, 01:54 AM
RE: Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
(08-08-2016 01:08 PM)Aliza Wrote:  Sorry to interject here, but there’s this tendency that Christians have to assume that Christianity is somehow the only ticket in town. As if their fucked up sense of morality is so awesome that they’re qualified to speak on everyone else’s behalf. I know you’re here on this forum to challenge the atheist’s way of thinking and “educate” them, but I feel maybe this is a good opportunity for me to challenge your way of thinking and educate you.

The proabortion movement is the same way. If a state tries to pass anti abortion laws the pro abortion movement tries to get the courts to overrule the will of the people. You're okay with that because it jives with your fucked up sense of morality that you wish to impose on everyone else.
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10-08-2016, 02:19 AM
RE: Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
(10-08-2016 01:40 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(08-08-2016 06:35 AM)Anjele Wrote:  I have to assume that you are also against taking a person off life support when there is no hope of them recovering or when the brain activity has ceased. We can keep bodies pumping for a long time with machinery but does that constitute life?

There is a difference between taking someone off life support and actively killing them.

You were critical of Rubio because he is against abortion even in cases of babies with birth defects. You called him an ass for being against abortion even in cases when the child is likely to suffer from a birth defect. Why should birth defects matter at all unless you believe they are a reason to kill another human being.

Now if you accept the premise that a birth defect is a valid reason to kill a human being, why does it matter if that human being is in or out of the womb?

Your position is inconsistent and not well thought out. Mathilda and Dancesfortwo take the Nazi position that a birth defect can be a reason to kill a child outside the womb. I certainly do not agree with that, but at least they are being consistent on the matter. You are trying to have it both ways because your moral code is governed by your whims instead of axioms.

I explained that in a later post, which you chose to ignore.

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF
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10-08-2016, 02:29 AM
RE: Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
(10-08-2016 01:44 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  A fetus is a human being. THat is a fact and it is only disputed by morons like you.

You are displaying religious binary thinking and are only able to think in black and white. It's a common problem for all theists I find.

Is a fertilised egg a foetus? If so then is it a human being and if I scrape some live skin off me will I have created a new human being? If not then at what point does a fertilised egg become a foetus and therefore a human being? And why can't it therefore be killed before it becomes a foetus?

And nor can you claim the potential to be a human being means that you are one. If I had a body on life support that was stripped of all its organs and even its brain, then is that still a human being? Or is it just some meat?
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10-08-2016, 02:31 AM
RE: Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
(10-08-2016 02:19 AM)Anjele Wrote:  
(10-08-2016 01:40 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  There is a difference between taking someone off life support and actively killing them.

You were critical of Rubio because he is against abortion even in cases of babies with birth defects. You called him an ass for being against abortion even in cases when the child is likely to suffer from a birth defect. Why should birth defects matter at all unless you believe they are a reason to kill another human being.

Now if you accept the premise that a birth defect is a valid reason to kill a human being, why does it matter if that human being is in or out of the womb?

Your position is inconsistent and not well thought out. Mathilda and Dancesfortwo take the Nazi position that a birth defect can be a reason to kill a child outside the womb. I certainly do not agree with that, but at least they are being consistent on the matter. You are trying to have it both ways because your moral code is governed by your whims instead of axioms.

I explained that in a later post, which you chose to ignore.

You gave no explanation why you believe it is okay to kill a child in the womb but not okay to kill a child outside the womb other than that is what you think is okay. Like I said your morality is based on your whims.

I am pro-life and anti capital punishment because an axiom of my morality is:

Do not kill another human being unless you absolutely have too.

I don't like being anti capital punishment. I'd like to see murders, rapists, and child molesters hanged. But when I apply my axiom to capital punishment, I have to admit that as a society we don't have to kill these human beings and therefore it is wrong to do so.

You, on the otherhand, go with what your whims tell you is right. There is no logic or reason behind your morality. I am not surprised that it is so warped.
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10-08-2016, 03:48 AM
RE: Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
(10-08-2016 02:29 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(10-08-2016 01:44 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  A fetus is a human being. THat is a fact and it is only disputed by morons like you.

You are displaying religious binary thinking and are only able to think in black and white. It's a common problem for all theists I find.

^^ This. ^^

It is especially true in biology, where very few things are either A or B, black or white.

Even if we grant your premise (which I do not) that every fertilized egg is a human being and therefore it doesn't even matter if they would have nothing resembling life as we know it, we terminate people who have no hope to live with functioning brains, all the time, based on the decisions of their families-- and that's for full-grown adults. (Terri Schiavo is a famous example.) You really should look up what this virus does, physically, to a fetus/infant.

And Blowjob, go fuck yourself for saying we have twisted moral reasoning. Even the Bible says there are circumstances under which a priest can induce a miscarriage (an abortion) in a woman suspected of infidelity, so don't pretend that it's Jesus telling you not to abort. This is just 20th century religious-culture bullshit, an argumentum ex culo.

So shove it right back up your ass.

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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10-08-2016, 03:56 AM
RE: Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
(10-08-2016 03:48 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  And Blowjob, go fuck yourself for saying we have twisted moral reasoning. Even the Bible says there are circumstances under which a priest can induce a miscarriage (an abortion) in a woman suspected of infidelity, so don't pretend that it's Jesus telling you not to abort. This is just 20th century religious-culture bullshit, an argumentum ex culo.

My position on abortion has nothing to do with religion. I am pro-life because an axiom of my morality is Do not kill another human unless you absolutely have too.

You are trying to interject religion into my position because you have failed to refute it otherwise.
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10-08-2016, 06:30 AM
RE: Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
(10-08-2016 03:56 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(10-08-2016 03:48 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  And Blowjob, go fuck yourself for saying we have twisted moral reasoning. Even the Bible says there are circumstances under which a priest can induce a miscarriage (an abortion) in a woman suspected of infidelity, so don't pretend that it's Jesus telling you not to abort. This is just 20th century religious-culture bullshit, an argumentum ex culo.

My position on abortion has nothing to do with religion. I am pro-life because an axiom of my morality is Do not kill another human unless you absolutely have too.

You are trying to interject religion into my position because you have failed to refute it otherwise.

And what are the reasons when you would 'have to' kill?

See here they are the bruises some were self-inflicted and some showed up along the way. - JF
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10-08-2016, 06:58 AM
RE: Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
(10-08-2016 01:44 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  You lack a basic understanding of biology and therefore it is simply impossible to argue this issue with you.

You are the one who lacks basic understanding:

Fetus
In human development, a fetus or foetus (/ˈfiːtəs/; plural fetuses or foetuses) is a prenatal human between its embryonic state and its birth.

Wikipedia - fetus

Baby/Infant
The term infant is typically applied to young children between the ages of 1 month and 12 months; however, definitions may vary between birth and 1 year of age, or even between birth and 2 years of age. A newborn is an infant who is only hours, days, or up to a few weeks old. An infant is usually called a baby in simple English, as many people use the term 'baby' instead of infant.

Wikpedia - baby/infant

(10-08-2016 01:44 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  A fetus is a human being. THat is a fact and it is only disputed by morons like you.

Considering that you cannot even get basic definitions right, you may want to refrain from calling names. Moron. Drinking Beverage

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Freedom offers opportunity. Opportunity confers responsibility. Responsibility to use the freedom we enjoy wisely, honestly and humanely. ~ Noam Chomsky
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10-08-2016, 07:03 AM (This post was last modified: 10-08-2016 07:06 AM by Aliza.)
RE: Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
(10-08-2016 01:54 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(08-08-2016 01:08 PM)Aliza Wrote:  Sorry to interject here, but there’s this tendency that Christians have to assume that Christianity is somehow the only ticket in town. As if their fucked up sense of morality is so awesome that they’re qualified to speak on everyone else’s behalf. I know you’re here on this forum to challenge the atheist’s way of thinking and “educate” them, but I feel maybe this is a good opportunity for me to challenge your way of thinking and educate you.

The proabortion movement is the same way. If a state tries to pass anti abortion laws the pro abortion movement tries to get the courts to overrule the will of the people. You're okay with that because it jives with your fucked up sense of morality that you wish to impose on everyone else.

Uhm.... I've never heard of the "proabortion" movement. I've never even heard of the "Pro-Abortion" movement. I Googled it and it tried to correct my search term to "Pro-Choice". Last time I checked, the Pro-Choice movement wanted to put the power in women's hands to decide, not to force abortion onto women who don't want it (hence the term, "choice").

It's funny that you mention overruling the will of the people. If my will is to have an abortion, then it would be the Christians Pro-Life people who want take my will away by forcing me to carry to term a child who I will be responsible for for the next 18 years.

If you're so concerned about overruling a person's will, then how is that acceptable?

Further, laws are made and passed in this country by "trying to overrule the will of the people." For example, it may be your will that David and Henry can't get married, but your will doesn't really much matter, so we have to overrule it to allow David and Henry to get married. The standing law of the land may no longer fit the social climate of the citizens. Once upon a time, that law may have more accurately reflected the will of the people, but when people change their minds, then we have to change rules along with them. That's just how it works. Sometimes people's will gets overruled, but lately, that will was the will they were trying to force on other people against their will. Ironic, isn't it?

Just out of curiosity, Heywood, how many adoptive children do you have? Did you choose healthy or disabled child/children? Medical care can run into the millions for a severely disabled child, but I'm sure your church can pick up some of the tab. I'm assuming you're over 18, so I'm assuming you have at least 1 adoptive child (in addition to any of your own children). I suppose I would expect you to have 2 or 3 if you're married with a family. (By the way, if you actually have adoptive children of your own living with you [who are not your partner's children], my respect for you will absolutely skyrocket.)
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10-08-2016, 07:03 AM
RE: Marco Rubio...no abortions for Zika infected pregnant women.
(10-08-2016 03:56 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Do not kill another human unless you absolutely have too.

I agree with this.

What's off is your definition of a human being, and your sense of responsibility for the future of a fetus you forced to be born into this world.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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