Mass shootings every single day!
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17-12-2012, 04:09 PM
RE: Mass shootings every single day!
I believe the issue is about both the lack of psychiatric care and poorly formed gun laws corrupted by the NRA. There are multiple causes, and all need to be addressed.

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17-12-2012, 04:09 PM
RE: Mass shootings every single day!
(17-12-2012 04:07 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(17-12-2012 01:44 PM)Phaedrus Wrote:  What are you talking about? What the hell is "magazine cartridge size"? Size of the magazine? Both the AR-15 and M16 take standard STANAG magazines with a capacity between 10 and 30, and up to 100 (though those usually suck and are unreliable). Size of the cartridge fired? They fire .223 and 5.56x45mm respectively, which are actually basically identical. 5.56 is specced to take a slightly higher pressure. An M16 will fire either .223 or 5.56x45mm equally well, and with a changed upper can fire almost any round conceivable. A well-built (not knock-off quality) AR-15 will fire both rounds equally as well, and again can fire almost anything if you change out the upper.


So you're wrong on both counts, whichever you were thinking of.


Here's the difference, Logica.

An M16, if you put the selector switch to "Burst" will fire three rounds when you pull the trigger (unless it's an M16A1 from the 70s, in which case it will fire full automatic).

An AR-15 does not have a "Burst" mode and will only ever fire one round when you pull the trigger.


I am well aware of the difference. I said that the AR 15 is an assault rifle, an extremely generic term from what I understand. If I am incorrect, I apologize for my arguing about classification.

However, I'd like to get back to the point of my argument. I see no real need to posses such a weapon.
An AR-15 is an excellent varmint rifle, useful for woodchucks, coyotes, etc.

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17-12-2012, 04:14 PM
RE: Mass shootings every single day!
(17-12-2012 04:09 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(17-12-2012 04:07 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  I am well aware of the difference. I said that the AR 15 is an assault rifle, an extremely generic term from what I understand. If I am incorrect, I apologize for my arguing about classification.

However, I'd like to get back to the point of my argument. I see no real need to posses such a weapon.
An AR-15 is an excellent varmint rifle, useful for woodchucks, coyotes, etc.
If you are hunting, use a hunting rifle.

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17-12-2012, 04:16 PM
RE: Mass shootings every single day!
(17-12-2012 04:09 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  I believe the issue is about both the lack of psychiatric care and poorly formed gun laws corrupted by the NRA. There are multiple causes, and all need to be addressed.
We already have very strong gun control laws, but there is weak enforcement.

Some of the objections that have been raised, like converting a rifle to fully automatic, are already illegal and carry heavy penalties.

The guns that were used in the Newtown shooting were stolen from the mother. Illegal.
She did not have them locked up. Illegal.
He wasn't licensed but took them, transported them, shot people. All illegal.

We need real health care in the U.S. that includes mental health services; we need a healthier society.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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17-12-2012, 05:02 PM
RE: Mass shootings every single day!
(17-12-2012 04:16 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(17-12-2012 04:09 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  I believe the issue is about both the lack of psychiatric care and poorly formed gun laws corrupted by the NRA. There are multiple causes, and all need to be addressed.
We already have very strong gun control laws, but there is weak enforcement.

Some of the objections that have been raised, like converting a rifle to fully automatic, are already illegal and carry heavy penalties.

The guns that were used in the Newtown shooting were stolen from the mother. Illegal.
She did not have them locked up. Illegal.
He wasn't licensed but took them, transported them, shot people. All illegal.

We need real health care in the U.S. that includes mental health services; we need a healthier society.
I don't believe anything but handguns and hunting rifles should be available.

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17-12-2012, 05:07 PM
RE: Mass shootings every single day!
(17-12-2012 05:02 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  
(17-12-2012 04:16 PM)Chas Wrote:  We already have very strong gun control laws, but there is weak enforcement.

Some of the objections that have been raised, like converting a rifle to fully automatic, are already illegal and carry heavy penalties.

The guns that were used in the Newtown shooting were stolen from the mother. Illegal.
She did not have them locked up. Illegal.
He wasn't licensed but took them, transported them, shot people. All illegal.

We need real health care in the U.S. that includes mental health services; we need a healthier society.
I don't believe anything but handguns and hunting rifles should be available.
Define hunting rifle.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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17-12-2012, 05:10 PM
RE: Mass shootings every single day!
^rifle that could be used to hunt.

When you are courting a nice girl an hour seems like a second. When you sit on a red-hot cinder a second seems like an hour. That's relativity.

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17-12-2012, 05:14 PM
RE: Mass shootings every single day!
(17-12-2012 05:02 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  I don't believe anything but handguns and hunting rifles should be available.
Why handguns? Those were specifically made for killing humans. Most animals won't let you get close enough to be effective with a handgun - you'd be better off with a bow and arrow. Or a crossbow. Handguns don't have the stopping power to save you from the larger, dangerous animals that come close enough to eat you - don't think you'll take down a grizzly or a crocodile with a .38 special.

The entire idea behind handguns was to create a gun small enough for your pocket (though people quickly turned to holsters). Something you can easily carry everywhere you go, conceal if you need to, and use at fairly short range (short compared to most other projectile weapons). You know, like when you want to shoot other humans, say, in a classroom.

Sure, it's harder to fire off hundreds of rounds with a Beretta, but at 15 per mag and 3-4 mags in your pocket, you're still good for dozens of deaths if you can shoot halfway straight.

I'm not saying I'm for unrestricted access to all firearms. Nor am I for draconian gun control. But I am saying, I'd rather try to protect myself from a kid sneaking daddy's hunting rifle into the classroom than try to protect myself from a kid sneaking daddy's AK-47 into the classroom - one of those is much, much, much easier to see coming while there is still time to do something to prevent the bloodbath.

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17-12-2012, 05:21 PM
RE: Mass shootings every single day!
(17-12-2012 05:10 PM)Xinoftruden Wrote:  ^rifle that could be used to hunt.
So everything from a .22LR squirrel killer to a .45-70 bear stopper and everything in-between. Semi-automatics are used for hunting too, you know; AR-15s and Mini-14s are very popular truck guns if you need to scare off / kill a pack of coyotes, and the Ruger 10/22 is popular for small game hunting.

E 2 = (mc 2)2 + (pc )2
614C → 714N + e + ̅νe
2 K(s) + 2 H2O(l) → 2 KOH(aq) + H2 (g) + 196 kJ/mol
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17-12-2012, 05:22 PM
RE: Mass shootings every single day!
dammit forgot the wink emoticon (I use it for sarcasm)

When you are courting a nice girl an hour seems like a second. When you sit on a red-hot cinder a second seems like an hour. That's relativity.

You cannot successfully determine beforehand which side of the bread to butter.
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