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14-03-2014, 10:39 AM
RE: Medical advice
(14-03-2014 10:15 AM)theophilus Wrote:  Why do you include chiropractors and osteopaths in this group?

theophilus,

There is no scientific basis for chiropractic or osteopathic medicine, both of which claim that most illnesses have their origins in "disorders of the spine and musculoskeletal system" and that manipulation of these organs can cure or ameliorate diseases.

Studies have shown that these modalities are useful to treat chronic pain syndromes, but for not much else.

Osteopathic doctors are becoming more mainstream with many abandoning the basic assumptions of their system and embracing a more scientific view of medicine - good news!

Doc
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14-03-2014, 10:43 AM
RE: Medical advice
(14-03-2014 10:39 AM)docskeptic Wrote:  
(14-03-2014 10:15 AM)theophilus Wrote:  Why do you include chiropractors and osteopaths in this group?

theophilus,

There is no scientific basis for chiropractic or osteopathic medicine, both of which claim that most illnesses have their origins in "disorders of the spine and musculoskeletal system" and that manipulation of these organs can cure or ameliorate diseases.

Studies have shown that these modalities are useful to treat chronic pain syndromes, but for not much else.

Osteopathic doctors are becoming more mainstream with many abandoning the basic assumptions of their system and embracing a more scientific view of medicine - good news!

Doc

I would hesitate to call chiropractors charlatans on the lines of Homeopics simply because they do help with at least 1 thing. It is when they go beyond that thing that they get into trouble.

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14-03-2014, 10:48 AM
RE: Medical advice
(14-03-2014 10:34 AM)docskeptic Wrote:  
(14-03-2014 10:24 AM)itsnotmeitsyou Wrote:  I have a 2 part question about pro-biotic pills. My wife started buying them recently because her mom told her we should be taking them for our mild digestive issues. Keep in mind that her mom is a Reiki Master as well. Dodgy

So, my first part is: Do they actually do anything or are they just destroyed by the digestive system.

Second part is this: If they are worthless, is there any risk or harm involved with them. She claims her indigestion has gotten better since starting them. If they're harmless as a placebo, whatever. If they're potentially harmful, I'd like to get her to stop.


itsnotmeitsyou,

Probiotics may be helpful in conditions like Irritable Bowel Syndrome, antibiotic related diarrhea and possibly Clostridium difficlie colitis.

The bacteria are not destroyed by the gut. There is documentation that probiotics may be helpful.

They are not harmful and may be continued. Yogurt or other similar probiotic laced products may be a useful alternative.

Doc

Thanks. I was a bit skeptical due to the advice coming from a woman who thinks she can wave her hands over someone and heal headaches and most of the info I found online was either "THIS STUFF CURES CANCER!!11!!" or "Total BS, waste of money."

Excuse me, I'm making perfect sense. You're just not keeping up.

"Let me give you some advice, bastard: never forget what you are. The rest of the world will not. Wear it like armor, and it can never be used to hurt you." - Tyrion Lannister
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14-03-2014, 11:33 AM
RE: Medical advice
I'd be interested to hear if you have any knowledge or opinions of IPT (Insulin Potentiation Therapy). It's listed under the quackwatch site, however I have a friend who's wife had a small melanoma who sought out this treatment. The firsthand accounts of those from the clinic who had been on IPT after traditional treatments had failed them were pretty amazing.

Also, to my uneducated mind, the science behind it seems simple and logical. Thoughts?

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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14-03-2014, 11:36 AM
RE: Medical advice
(14-03-2014 10:07 AM)docskeptic Wrote:  Full Circle's thread got me thinking. There are some really weird and questionable medical practices out there. I would lump chiropractic medicine, osteopathic medicine and homeopathy together in there. In addition there is a host of other similar practices-reiki, ayurvedic, aromatherapy, etc. which all fall in the woo category.

As an allopath, I would only consider treatments that have scientific validation or are based on reasonable scientific assumptions.

If people within the TTA community have questions about anything medical related, please feel free to post them (or PM me if confidentiality is desired) and I'll do my best to answer your questions as fully and honestly as I can. I'm sure Mark Fulton and any other medical professionals in the forum would not mind jumping in as well.

Let me take this opportunity to once again introduce quackwatch.com to the TTA community. It's a comprehensive database of questionable medical practices, maintained by Stephen Barrett, MD, an unsung hero of the skeptic community.

Doc

Thanks for starting this thread. I have a huge problem with chiropractors. I prefer to call them Chiroquackters. At any rate, wouldn't it be just as well to have a good massage instead? My understanding it that the cracking one hears at the chiropractors is the same as cracking ones knuckles. It does nothing.

What's your opinion of acupuncture?

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Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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14-03-2014, 11:47 AM
RE: Medical advice
Great thread Doc!

Other than getting you to write that book in the same vein as your classroom thread this is almost as useful Angel

Seriously, with your expertise in medicine it'll be a great way to expose quackery.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
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14-03-2014, 11:48 AM
RE: Medical advice
(14-03-2014 11:33 AM)evenheathen Wrote:  I'd be interested to hear if you have any knowledge or opinions of IPT (Insulin Potentiation Therapy). It's listed under the quackwatch site, however I have a friend who's wife had a small melanoma who sought out this treatment. The firsthand accounts of those from the clinic who had been on IPT after traditional treatments had failed them were pretty amazing.

Also, to my uneducated mind, the science behind it seems simple and logical. Thoughts?

Evenheathen,

I would avoid this. The "science" behind it is highly doubtful to say the least. The supporters claim that inducing a low blood sugar with insulin "opens up the receptors" on cancer cells and make them more sensitive to chemotherapy allowing doctors to use lower doses of medication, with less side effects as a consequence.

There is no scientific basis for this claim. Moreover, the side effects of hypoglycemia can be dangerous, occasionally even fatal.

Here's the American Cancer Society's stand on the treatment, "Despite supporters' claims that insulin potentiation therapy has been well researched, no scientific studies that show safety and effectiveness have been published in available peer-reviewed journals. These claims cannot be verified."

Hope that helps!

Doc
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14-03-2014, 11:54 AM
RE: Medical advice
Chick #1 today was showing me stuff about what foods are best for me with my particular blood group (she and I are both A+).

Pleasingly, these were foods I like (red meat etc.).

Another blood group got all the white meat (i.e. fish and to be honest, they can keep it).

Then we went off and had Sushi.

Yummy.

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14-03-2014, 12:03 PM
RE: Medical advice
(14-03-2014 11:48 AM)docskeptic Wrote:  Evenheathen,

I would avoid this. The "science" behind it is highly doubtful to say the least. The supporters claim that inducing a low blood sugar with insulin "opens up the receptors" on cancer cells and make them more sensitive to chemotherapy allowing doctors to use lower doses of medication, with less side effects as a consequence.

There is no scientific basis for this claim. Moreover, the side effects of hypoglycemia can be dangerous, occasionally even fatal.

Here's the American Cancer Society's stand on the treatment, "Despite supporters' claims that insulin potentiation therapy has been well researched, no scientific studies that show safety and effectiveness have been published in available peer-reviewed journals. These claims cannot be verified."

Hope that helps!

Doc

My understanding is that it works just like a PET scan does. Cancer cells love sugar, so why wouldn't it work similarly?

From here, http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/154877.php

Quote:When it is inside the radiotracer will go to areas inside the body that use the natural chemical. For example, FDG (fluorodeoxyglucose - a radioactive drug) is tagged to glucose to make a radiotracer. The glucose goes into those parts of the body that use glucose for energy. Cancers, for example, use glucose differently from normal tissue - so, FDG can show up cancers.

If you can target cancer cells with a radiotracer by manipulating glucose levels, why wouldn't it also work with chemo?

(I'm not advocating this treatment, BTW. Just interested in a solid viewpoint having listened to my friend rave on about it for a while now)

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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14-03-2014, 12:10 PM
RE: Medical advice
(14-03-2014 10:39 AM)docskeptic Wrote:  
(14-03-2014 10:15 AM)theophilus Wrote:  Why do you include chiropractors and osteopaths in this group?

theophilus,

There is no scientific basis for chiropractic or osteopathic medicine, both of which claim that most illnesses have their origins in "disorders of the spine and musculoskeletal system" and that manipulation of these organs can cure or ameliorate diseases.

Studies have shown that these modalities are useful to treat chronic pain syndromes, but for not much else.

Osteopathic doctors are becoming more mainstream with many abandoning the basic assumptions of their system and embracing a more scientific view of medicine - good news!

Doc

I have seen a chiropractor for some back issues and the visits seem to ahve done the trick. The one I saw did give me the speal of all the stuff they can fix, but I did not believe him. I view the disciplie as more of a physical theropy than medical treatment.
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