Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
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27-03-2011, 07:01 PM
RE: Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
(27-03-2011 06:51 PM)ConditionYellow Wrote:  Corporations should have never been bailed out. Most true capitalists agree on this. Hell, most real people agree on this.

Of course they shouldn't have but the point is that they did.

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27-03-2011, 10:59 PM
RE: Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
I think in the eugenics movement the poor were sterilized to prevent poverty from spreading.
Are we returning to that insanity ?

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27-03-2011, 11:22 PM
RE: Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
(27-03-2011 10:59 PM)gaglamesh731 Wrote:  I think in the eugenics movement the poor were sterilized to prevent poverty from spreading.
Are we returning to that insanity ?

I wouldn't be surprised if a republicunt actually tried to propose such a bill...i'm not kidding

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28-03-2011, 09:05 PM
RE: Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
(27-03-2011 11:22 PM)sosa Wrote:  
(27-03-2011 10:59 PM)gaglamesh731 Wrote:  I think in the eugenics movement the poor were sterilized to prevent poverty from spreading.
Are we returning to that insanity ?

I wouldn't be surprised if a republicunt actually tried to propose such a bill...i'm not kidding

Sadly, I can tell you're not.

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29-03-2011, 12:35 AM
RE: Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
I was receiving food stamps while living with family and using a cell phone of theirs so as to have a phone in my attempt to get work. Had I not received food stamps I would not have had food. There are extenuating circumstances here. Yes I understand what abusing the system is, but any of these laws tend to fail to stop abusers and only punish those who don't. If you are bent on beating the system you're safer than the people who try to follow it. Government works because people want it to work and they follow the guidelines, all it takes to break a government is for the guidelines to not apply.

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29-03-2011, 03:38 PM
RE: Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
(27-03-2011 07:01 PM)sosa Wrote:  Of course they shouldn't have but the point is that they did.

Doesn't mean it's right. And we're not talking about Obama's bailouts. We're talking about the welfare system.

Unlike most of my Conservative Libertarian colleagues I'm not opposed to a welfare system in principle.

But the welfare system we have now is a bloated, abused parody of what it's supposed to be.

You can't tell me having 3rd, 4th, or even 5th generation welfare recipients in a single house isn't abusing the system.

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29-03-2011, 04:23 PM
RE: Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
(29-03-2011 03:38 PM)ConditionYellow Wrote:  You can't tell me having 3rd, 4th, or even 5th generation welfare recipients in a single house isn't abusing the system.

I think it's abusing the tax payers, but I don't think it's abusing the system. The system as it is set up pretty much ensures that you're going to have this scenario. To criticize the system for reaching its logical conclusion is completely unfair.

We make a deal with poor, mostly minority but some white, people in this country. We say we agree to give you poor schools, no jobs, high crime rates with minimal police protection, few opportunities to better yourselves, lots of drugs and we will throw in some money to keep you from starving in return you will keep your mouth shut and play the society whipping boy. That's the deal of welfare. It may not have been intended to be that when it started out but any program that supplements the need to be get a job or be responsible for yourself was pretty much assured of having this result. To blame the system for doing its job is just unfair.

For some reason instead of blaming the people responsible for this rat hole, we blame the people who are trapped in it, as if they want to be in this situation.

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29-03-2011, 09:26 PM
RE: Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
(29-03-2011 04:23 PM)BnW Wrote:  I think it's abusing the tax payers, but I don't think it's abusing the system.

Semantics, but yes.

(29-03-2011 04:23 PM)BnW Wrote:  We make a deal with poor, mostly minority but some white, people in this country.

Uh, yeah. About that. The vast majority of welfare recipients in the US are white. But this too is irrelivent.

(29-03-2011 04:23 PM)BnW Wrote:  We say we agree to give you poor schools, no jobs, high crime rates with minimal police protection, few opportunities to better yourselves, lots of drugs and we will throw in some money to keep you from starving in return you will keep your mouth shut and play the society whipping boy. That's the deal of welfare. It may not have been intended to be that when it started out but any program that supplements the need to be get a job or be responsible for yourself was pretty much assured of having this result. To blame the system for doing its job is just unfair.

First off, "we" (as in I) never agreed to this. The government was doing this on my behalf, and against my will, before I was born.

Second off, that's just ridiculous. Show me that in writing on some kind of mission statement or charter. Show me where that is even implied.

(29-03-2011 04:23 PM)BnW Wrote:  For some reason instead of blaming the people responsible for this rat hole, we blame the people who are trapped in it, as if they want to be in this situation.

Yes, because poor people never grow up to be successful.

It's that Jesse Jackson mentality of yours that "you will always be poor and nobody" that perpetuates this vicious welfare cycle. It's that exact type of mentality that is poison to anyone who wants to try make themselves better. People with that mentality telling kids "No, you can't!"

And frankly, it's sickening.

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30-03-2011, 04:25 AM
RE: Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
Poor people can grow up to be successful but the difficulty in doing so is excessively steep. I've been to poor schools in St. Louis the basic idea is here's what you need to know to get into the military. No one is really given the suggestion that they can do much of anything. Just shown how to do the simple stuff. Becoming successful is hard enough for people who aren't poor. There is a lot of extra crap to deal with along with a security blanket. If you spend years trying to get out of the system and everything fucks up there is still the system.

Most trailer parks and Section 8 areas are filled with people who are encouraged to be sexually active early. Many people in these situations have multiple kids while teenagers. It is very hard to deal with the hurdles of being poor and childcare when trying to make something of yourself. Most give up.

How much time have you spent in a trailer park or section 8 area Condition? If you stay there a while you'll see all the things keeping the young down when they try to break the cycle. It's really hard to be successful when no one shows you how.

And that agreement BnW mentioned is because nearly everyone has a dislike for the poor and states prejudice comments often. They are the most criticized group and easiest to blame. If a low income person manages a job they are ostracized in the work place as well. There are so many hurdles that saying you can't is a better encouragement than saying you can. Most people who break this cycle are rebelling against everything they hear.

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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30-03-2011, 05:16 AM
RE: Minnesota Republicans say: Poor people with money should be outlaws
(30-03-2011 04:25 AM)Lilith Pride Wrote:  How much time have you spent in a trailer park or section 8 area Condition?
Irrelevant. But because I know it's bound to come up again, I grew up (what I would consider) lower-middle class. In about 1987 or so my parents got a divorce. I lived with my mother, who then became poor. Not only only poor, but poor and an alcoholic. What little money we did get, she'd usually drink away.

I got tired of going to sleep hungry and so I got my first job when I was about 14.

We moved around a lot after my parents divorced. Usually living with relatives. But there was a time I lived in a trailer park for about a year.

Happy?

And living in a trailer park was nothing like you just described.

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