Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
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07-08-2014, 09:22 PM
Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
So my thread asked questions about the interpretation of Scripture and I responded to the Apologist with some of these answers and the mod destroyed my thread. That is one reason why I wish there were more Theists here Sad so I could actually debate them without fear of a ban.

Had a thread that went something like this:


No one can see God:
"No man hath seen God at any time." (JOH 1:18)
"And he said, Thou canst not see my face; for there shall no man see me and live." (EXO 33:20)
"And the Lord spake to Moses face to face, as a man speaketh to his friend." (EXO 33:11)
"For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved." (GEN 32:30)
"Whom no man hath seen nor can see." (1TIM 6:16)

The Apologists response was, "actually in the original translation it wasn't face but his hip or back" I said well than, my Bible lied to me. If translation produces falsehood, how do I ever know if it is a false translation? Mistranslation/ lie; Potatoe/ patatoe

"And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham." (GEN 22:1)
"Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God; for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man." (JAS 1:13)

Wish I remember what he said. Something like God wont tempt us with more than we can handle. People are responsible for the evil in the world not God

What a crock of horseshit! God is responsible for the sins of Adam and Eve. He is responsible for the Serpent getting into the garden because He made the serpent and with his permissive will, willed the Serpent to tempt them. He made a tree knowing in advance that they would eat it of it and therefore He is responsible for their sin.

If I leave my child in a room with the most delicious candy and tell him/her if you eat that you will die and the child eats it and dies, who's at fault. Plus it seems to me like Adam and Eve were semiretarded making their culpability less and God's behavior of setting them up for failure, that much more appalling.

JO1 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
JO1 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

How silly

2KI 24:8 Jehoiachin was eighteen years old when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem three months.
2CH 36:9 Jehoiachin was eight years old when he began to reign, and he reigned three months

He said it was a mistranslation. So, once again, I can't trust an English Bible.

When is the second coming?
MAT 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.MAR 13:30 Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.
LUK 21:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.


Wish I could remember what he said to that. Anyhow, it still goes to show how the Bible misleads people.

There is no document in the History of mankind that has been misunderstood/misinterpreted as much as the Bible.
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07-08-2014, 09:25 PM
RE: Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
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08-08-2014, 05:56 AM
RE: Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
Christian forums aren't for debating.
Dissenting opinions are the devils work.
Thought everyone knew that.
Burn heathen burn. Do not fill our minds with facts
Fact is a four letter curse word on a christian forum
Be gone with you devil spawn. God couldn't or wouldn't delete your thread so a Mod must.

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08-08-2014, 06:12 AM
RE: Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
(07-08-2014 09:22 PM)Wicked Clown Wrote:  So my thread asked questions about the interpretation of Scripture and I responded to the Apologist with some of these answers and the mod destroyed my thread. That is one reason why I wish there were more Theists here Sad so I could actually debate them without fear of a ban.

And you were also banned at atheist forum/com. That's because you are a TROLL.

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08-08-2014, 09:26 AM (This post was last modified: 08-08-2014 09:29 AM by Addai.)
RE: Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
As a Christian I might take a conceptual stab at your general OP wicked.


While I believe in the Divine Inspiration of Scripture, unlike many fundamentalists etc.
I also believe that the scriptures are a human product.
A point that can not be stressed enough.....



Anyway as a human product their are issues that come in to play.

1) Their are issues of culture and genre. i.e. - The Hebrews are a radically different culture than modern industrialized Americans and Europeans. They tend to think and express themselves much different than we do.

2) Their are also issues language and translation and such. Their are lots of issues especially how to translate something. i.e. Should you translate a phrase in the most literal and exact way possible, even for things that are idiomatic and not readily understood by a different culture or audience (for the sake of veracity to the original text)? Or should you translate the idiom to another expression that conveys its meaning but is entirely different than what the original text might say?

3) Besides that there are other issues and problems. i.e. There are some things in the Greek text of the NT that I believe are mistranslations of Aramaic expressions and of course when copying the Bible multiple times by hand their is always the chance of a copyist error.



In terms of the difference between one text saying "person X" saw God faces to face, While another says "Nobody has seen God face to face". I would have to put it down to two different uses of terms and expressions. Namely the first post would be speaking of or alluding to "seeing God in all his glory" while the second would be describing something called a theophany. (see link below).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theophany


Hope that helps and take care. Smile
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08-08-2014, 09:37 AM
RE: Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
(08-08-2014 09:26 AM)Addai Wrote:  As a Christian I might take a conceptual stab at your general OP wicked.


While I believe in the Divine Inspiration of Scripture, unlike many fundamentalists etc.
I also believe that the scriptures are a human product.
A point that can not be stressed enough.....



Anyway as a human product their are issues that come in to play.

1) Their are issues of culture and genre. i.e. - The Hebrews are a radically different culture than modern industrialized Americans and Europeans. They tend to think and express themselves much different than we do.

2) Their are also issues language and translation and such. Their are lots of issues especially how to translate something. i.e. Should you translate a phrase in the most literal and exact way possible, even for things that are idiomatic and not readily understood by a different culture or audience (for the sake of veracity to the original text)? Or should you translate the idiom to another expression that conveys its meaning but is entirely different than what the original text might say?

3) Besides that there are other issues and problems. i.e. There are some things in the Greek text of the NT that I believe are mistranslations of Aramaic expressions and of course when copying the Bible multiple times by hand their is always the chance of a copyist error.



In terms of the difference between one text saying "person X" saw God faces to face, While another says "Nobody has seen God face to face". I would have to put it down to two different uses of terms and expressions. Namely the first post would be speaking of or alluding to "seeing God in all his glory" while the second would be describing something called a theophany. (see link below).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theophany


Hope that helps and take care. Smile
So you're admitting that, due to issues of cultural differences, language, and translation, the Bible can't be trusted. Got it. Drinking Beverage

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08-08-2014, 10:36 AM
RE: Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
Nope quite to the contrary. The Bible is very reliable when compared to other ancient and classical works of its era. i.e. when you compare Biblical manuscripts to ones from texts from Homer, Julius Cesar, Aristotle etc. It's just that it is not as perfect etc. as some would allege.
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08-08-2014, 11:11 AM (This post was last modified: 08-08-2014 11:14 AM by Simon Moon.)
RE: Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
(08-08-2014 09:26 AM)Addai Wrote:  As a Christian I might take a conceptual stab at your general OP wicked.


While I believe in the Divine Inspiration of Scripture, unlike many fundamentalists etc.
I also believe that the scriptures are a human product.
A point that can not be stressed enough.....



Anyway as a human product their are issues that come in to play.

1) Their are issues of culture and genre. i.e. - The Hebrews are a radically different culture than modern industrialized Americans and Europeans. They tend to think and express themselves much different than we do.

2) Their are also issues language and translation and such. Their are lots of issues especially how to translate something. i.e. Should you translate a phrase in the most literal and exact way possible, even for things that are idiomatic and not readily understood by a different culture or audience (for the sake of veracity to the original text)? Or should you translate the idiom to another expression that conveys its meaning but is entirely different than what the original text might say?

3) Besides that there are other issues and problems. i.e. There are some things in the Greek text of the NT that I believe are mistranslations of Aramaic expressions and of course when copying the Bible multiple times by hand their is always the chance of a copyist error.



In terms of the difference between one text saying "person X" saw God faces to face, While another says "Nobody has seen God face to face". I would have to put it down to two different uses of terms and expressions. Namely the first post would be speaking of or alluding to "seeing God in all his glory" while the second would be describing something called a theophany. (see link below).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theophany


Hope that helps and take care. Smile


So....

The all powerful, all knowing creator of the universe wants to communicate the most important message ever to his beloved creation. A message that, if we get it wrong, will cause us to be punished for eternity.

And the best he could come up with is to appear to one of the most uneducated, illiterate peoples on the planet? Knowing they would fail to record this message for decades or centuries, in a language that he would know would die out, be prone to mistranslations, edits, additions, copying errors, with later fallible people choosing which of his inspired texts to include or leave out, etc.

Sounds like a pretty inept deity to me.

So, if you admit that the Bible is a human product, and you admit that there are mistranslations, cultural and language differences, copying errors, etc, how do you know any of the supernatural god claims aren't wrong?
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08-08-2014, 12:25 PM
RE: Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
(08-08-2014 10:36 AM)Addai Wrote:  Nope quite to the contrary. The Bible is very reliable when compared to other ancient and classical works of its era. i.e. when you compare Biblical manuscripts to ones from texts from Homer, Julius Cesar, Aristotle etc. It's just that it is not as perfect etc. as some would allege.

That's hilarious. Big Grin

It's difficult to see how you could be more wrong. Facepalm

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08-08-2014, 12:36 PM
RE: Mod destroyed my thread at Christian site. Fuck Christian forums
Quote:Nope quite to the contrary. The Bible is very reliable when compared to other ancient and classical works of its era.


IOW, you don't know what you are talking about.

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