Moderate Muslims
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17-03-2015, 10:58 AM
Moderate Muslims
I'm new to TTA so bear with me. I assume TTA doesn't share the media taboo on discussing religion - no, of course not - Blush There's a term that has crept into usage; 'moderate Muslim' that no Muslim I ever met either agrees with or wants to be called. I know why the term has been coined. It's there so that religion doesn't have to answer to criticism. It's the 'extremists' who want to kill the infidel, right? Moderate religious people are tolerant and reasonable, right? Wrong. Most Muslims agree with the killing - as Sam Harris says, it's a death cult religion. All religion is preoccupied with the end of the world. All religion is insane. There's no such thing as moderate insanity.Angel
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17-03-2015, 12:05 PM
RE: Moderate Muslims
A Shiite who runs out of bullets.

.......................................

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17-03-2015, 12:46 PM
RE: Moderate Muslims
(17-03-2015 10:58 AM)Kitson Wrote:  Wrong. Most Muslims agree with the killing - as Sam Harris says, it's a death cult religion.
I have some Muslim friends. They don't seem to be interested in killing people. They worry about their bills so they go to work and pay their taxes, they worry about their children's future, so they put effort into getting them into decent schools. For the most part they are "normal" people. They do have a belief in an imaginary invisible god, but so do some Christian friends that I have and some Indian friends that I have well they have a belief in many gods. But we all are friends, we all work and pay taxes and we all worry about our kids futures.
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17-03-2015, 01:04 PM
RE: Moderate Muslims
That sounds reasonable. Do you or even they know what parts of their religion they believe? As Sam Harris points out in End of Faith, the Koran is pretty clear on what to do with the 'infidel'. 'Rendering unto Caesar' is fine but I'm a tad concerned with the rest of it...
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17-03-2015, 01:25 PM
RE: Moderate Muslims
(17-03-2015 10:58 AM)Kitson Wrote:  I'm new to TTA so bear with me. I assume TTA doesn't share the media taboo on discussing religion - no, of course not - Blush There's a term that has crept into usage; 'moderate Muslim' that no Muslim I ever met either agrees with or wants to be called. I know why the term has been coined. It's there so that religion doesn't have to answer to criticism. It's the 'extremists' who want to kill the infidel, right? Moderate religious people are tolerant and reasonable, right? Wrong. Most Muslims agree with the killing - as Sam Harris says, it's a death cult religion. All religion is preoccupied with the end of the world. All religion is insane. There's no such thing as moderate insanity.Angel

I really don't like talking in terms of labels, but moreso in terms of empathy, and selfishness. There are right center and left in ALL religions worldwide. Comparatively speaking the east has a bigger problem power wise being controlled by their right. Not as a matter of that power being the majority, but merely their right controlling power and social norms.

There most certainly are people living in or have migrated from the east that don't like the climate of the east. I think liberal Christians and liberal atheist as well as moderate and liberal Muslims in the west that want to defend muticulturalism with the horrible tactic of PC, but that is not just Muslims. But to say Arabs and and Muslims don't value Criticism in the east is a mistake, it is simply harder for them to be open. Much like it was for gays in America compared to now.

You have to remember the east has not had 200 years of secular law keeping theism on a leash. But the cracks are there. I have run into atheists from that part of the world online. They don't get much coverage, because of where they live or have families from, but the west doesn't cover them as much as they should because our right doesn't like it and our PC left thinks it is too mean.

https://www.facebook.com/exmna

https://www.facebook.com/exmuslims

https://www.facebook.com/IAAMT

https://www.facebook.com/Iran.Atheist.agnostic

Malala who while still believes I doubt she would tell the PC left in America it is ok to get violent when offended. And Ayaan Hirsi Ali now an atheist has lived under threat for criticizing Islam. Oh and I don't know if you know about Bill Maher having actor Ben Affleck on, but a lady from Pakistan sent Ben a letter saying she living in that Islamic community doesn't like the PC oppression.

The cracks are there, believe me.

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17-03-2015, 01:29 PM
RE: Moderate Muslims
Oh and while the west has it better, the right in the US constantly tries to turn back the clock.

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17-03-2015, 01:40 PM
RE: Moderate Muslims
If the end goal is a society in which rules are relatively consistent, and based on secular ideals rather than superstition, then even "moderates" are a threat. That goes not just for Muslims, but for Christians, Scientologists, or even Atheist anti-vaxers who think they're rational just because they don't believe in God.

But right now the bigger threat is the extremists, and tackling that threat requires cooperation from the moderates. Baby steps... starting with alliances (both within and outside of our own society) we know are ultimately doomed to failure.

'Murican Canadian
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17-03-2015, 01:56 PM
RE: Moderate Muslims
(17-03-2015 01:40 PM)yakherder Wrote:  If the end goal is a society in which rules are relatively consistent, and based on secular ideals rather than superstition, then even "moderates" are a threat. That goes not just for Muslims, but for Christians, Scientologists, or even Atheist anti-vaxers who think they're rational just because they don't believe in God.

But right now the bigger threat is the extremists, and tackling that threat requires cooperation from the moderates. Baby steps... starting with alliances (both within and outside of our own society) we know are ultimately doomed to failure.

You don't even have to talk about religion. I get down on Che supporters as well as Ayn Rand supporters as well as any religion. Nothing humans do, public or private should ever be left to it's own devices. I am not talking about a nanny state, just an anti monopoly concept. Once you take anything in life to a blind loyalty level with no checks on it you are sure to lead to a lopsided state. Religion worldwide is the biggest distraction to the real problem, global corporatism.

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17-03-2015, 06:50 PM
RE: Moderate Muslims
Thread moved to politics.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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17-03-2015, 07:10 PM
RE: Moderate Muslims
(17-03-2015 10:58 AM)Kitson Wrote:  I'm new to TTA so bear with me. I assume TTA doesn't share the media taboo on discussing religion - no, of course not - Blush There's a term that has crept into usage; 'moderate Muslim' that no Muslim I ever met either agrees with or wants to be called. I know why the term has been coined. It's there so that religion doesn't have to answer to criticism. It's the 'extremists' who want to kill the infidel, right? Moderate religious people are tolerant and reasonable, right? Wrong. Most Muslims agree with the killing - as Sam Harris says, it's a death cult religion. All religion is preoccupied with the end of the world. All religion is insane. There's no such thing as moderate insanity.Angel

Not only what you say, but we have the Shiite and Sunnis hating each other.
I do not know of Moslims expressly questioning the Koran.
There may be some... Who Knows?
There are Christians who claim to be progressive (Progs) and also Christian process
theologians.......... Check out Progressivechristians.com.au
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