Moderates
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
14-08-2013, 11:40 PM
RE: Moderates
I'm a moderate...more or less....but honestly I don't see anything wrong with it.


[Image: mrhanky.jpg]

Wind's in the east, a mist coming in
Like something is brewing and about to begin
Can't put my finger on what lies in store
but I feel what's to happen has happened before...


Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
15-08-2013, 01:23 AM
RE: Moderates
(14-08-2013 11:35 PM)BryanS Wrote:  To this day, respectable opinions on both sides of the question debate whether dropping nukes was the right call.

Using defenceless and untouched civilians cities as testing grounds for new WMDs are not "respectable" opinions. They're crimes against humanity. The Nazis claims of mass murder for a greater good were not acceptable then, and weapons testing or posturing to the USSR were not acceptable then either. Dodgy

As for "partisan politics" being on equal footing because they both "feel" right- There's evidence for which policies work, and which are detrimental to society ... but not detrimental to some few key people who push those policies.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
15-08-2013, 07:46 AM
RE: Moderates
(15-08-2013 01:23 AM)PoolBoyG Wrote:  
(14-08-2013 11:35 PM)BryanS Wrote:  To this day, respectable opinions on both sides of the question debate whether dropping nukes was the right call.

Using defenceless and untouched civilians cities as testing grounds for new WMDs are not "respectable" opinions. They're crimes against humanity. The Nazis claims of mass murder for a greater good were not acceptable then, and weapons testing or posturing to the USSR were not acceptable then either. Dodgy

As for "partisan politics" being on equal footing because they both "feel" right- There's evidence for which policies work, and which are detrimental to society ... but not detrimental to some few key people who push those policies.


The argument is that the use of atomic weapons shortened the war and saved net lives, not 'weapons test' or 'posturing'.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Chas's post
15-08-2013, 08:37 AM
RE: Moderates
I really don't understand the term "moderate", beyond it describing either a morally corrupt individual, or group, or a pretentious and naive individual, or group.

If you have a left-right distinction, you are either on the left and support the revolution for abolishing whatever institution you view as unjustified, or on the right and support whatever institution regardless of whether you think it is justified.

A centrist, or specifically moderate left-leaning, would be a person who is either not understanding the revolution or opposition to the institution, using moderate as a way to gain political support or lacking the moral courage to fully stand up for what (they believe) is right. The (moderate) right-leaning version of that would kind of be contradicting themselves in a way, by not seeing any thing unjust about the institution, while seeing a need to fix problems likely resulting from the institution, or they could just be blatantly bad people by understanding that there is an unjust institution but supporting it any way, maybe because the institution was beneficial to them, however, feeling bad/guilty about it and thus providing support to others.

If the left was pretty effectively suppressed, moderates could be seen as those between right and center. That would leave people who were seemingly taking position because they felt it made them seem more sensible or reasonable, to gain in politics or just because they didn't understand an issue enough to make a decision toward either side.

I really don't know. It seem as if it would be easy to describe what would lead someone to be moderate, but pretty difficult to describe what that person (a moderate) is or believes.

The Paradox Of Fools And Wise Men:
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
15-08-2013, 09:26 AM
RE: Moderates
Moderate could refer to the total average of their ideologies.
You might ask people which side they're on in different aspects, like government, economy, social areas, religion, etc etc etc, and they may give different left/right answers for each one that averages out to be right in the middle.
I would say that qualifies as a "moderate" in the general sense.

This is of course assuming that you don't think a person has to answer left or right for everything at the same time.
I hope you don't think because, well, it doesn't work that way.
It's like those people who think that given a sexual preference quiz that the only answers are straight or gay. Binary. Because that's not how it really works, and it would be pretty ignorant to think it does.

[Image: ae1n9c.jpg]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
15-08-2013, 09:55 AM
RE: Moderates
(15-08-2013 08:37 AM)TrulyX Wrote:  I really don't understand the term "moderate", beyond it describing either a morally corrupt individual, or group, or a pretentious and naive individual, or group.

If you have a left-right distinction, you are either on the left and support the revolution for abolishing whatever institution you view as unjustified, or on the right and support whatever institution regardless of whether you think it is justified.

A centrist, or specifically moderate left-leaning, would be a person who is either not understanding the revolution or opposition to the institution, using moderate as a way to gain political support or lacking the moral courage to fully stand up for what (they believe) is right. The (moderate) right-leaning version of that would kind of be contradicting themselves in a way, by not seeing any thing unjust about the institution, while seeing a need to fix problems likely resulting from the institution, or they could just be blatantly bad people by understanding that there is an unjust institution but supporting it any way, maybe because the institution was beneficial to them, however, feeling bad/guilty about it and thus providing support to others.

If the left was pretty effectively suppressed, moderates could be seen as those between right and center. That would leave people who were seemingly taking position because they felt it made them seem more sensible or reasonable, to gain in politics or just because they didn't understand an issue enough to make a decision toward either side.

I really don't know. It seem as if it would be easy to describe what would lead someone to be moderate, but pretty difficult to describe what that person (a moderate) is or believes.

It, of course also depends on the political situation they are in. I will take my views as an example. I am a left leaning pro-socialist liberal in America I am on the far left of the mainstream spectrum (remember of course that America breaks much further to the right than Europe).

Now lets say I were to move to Sweden (a life goal of mine actually) in that context I am probably now a centrist or possibly even a conservative due to my strong sense of Personal Freedom (I don't believe the government should be able to regulate what you do to yourself ie: drugs etc...) I am also a hardline Freedom of Speech person and no I don't care about who is offended by speech protecting it is the single most important responsibility of a government.

So lets move the locale again and say I were to pop up in the United Arab Emirates I am now a radical leftist and probably on a government list. Notice my views are consistent I have just changed the majority around me. So being a Moderate or a centrist just means you are in agreement with the majority of your fellow citizens.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Revenant77x's post
15-08-2013, 04:51 PM
RE: Moderates
(15-08-2013 09:55 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  It, of course also depends on the political situation they are in. I will take my views as an example. I am a left leaning pro-socialist liberal in America I am on the far left of the mainstream spectrum (remember of course that America breaks much further to the right than Europe).

Now lets say I were to move to Sweden (a life goal of mine actually) in that context I am probably now a centrist or possibly even a conservative due to my strong sense of Personal Freedom (I don't believe the government should be able to regulate what you do to yourself ie: drugs etc...) I am also a hardline Freedom of Speech person and no I don't care about who is offended by speech protecting it is the single most important responsibility of a government.

So lets move the locale again and say I were to pop up in the United Arab Emirates I am now a radical leftist and probably on a government list. Notice my views are consistent I have just changed the majority around me. So being a Moderate or a centrist just means you are in agreement with the majority of your fellow citizens.

I understand that a political spectrum can become restricted within a certain society, where certain revolutionary views are not prominent. If left-wing views are prominent in a society, you would have a revolution on your hands, that would include uprisings, possibly or likely war. The left in societies has to be repressed/suppressed in some way, in societies, if it comes up as an issue. Either by force and propaganda, by implementing left-wing ideas but maintaining a right-wing society while comprising the revolution and disregarding the concerns, or by some combination.

Looking at your views, they don't really make sense. With regard to the entire left-right, looking at economic, social and governmental, where do you stand? Use moderate with libertarian/anarchist vs. authoritarian/statist (governmental), liberal vs conservative (social) and Marxist vs capitalist (economic), to describe your views. If you are (at all) moderate on a certain aspect, or different from one aspect to another, give the logic/reasoning behind it.

You said left-leaning which implies moderate, and also you said you were for the goverment not interfering, but only in a specific regard, which also implies moderate, to an extent. So, if you could explain your views and how you justify/reason them, that would help me out with understanding.

The Paradox Of Fools And Wise Men:
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
15-08-2013, 04:54 PM
RE: Moderates
I dont really have a title for myself.

"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use." Soren Kierkegaard
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
15-08-2013, 05:00 PM
RE: Moderates
(15-08-2013 09:26 AM)LostLocke Wrote:  This is of course assuming that you don't think a person has to answer left or right for everything at the same time.
I hope you don't think because, well, it doesn't work that way.
It's like those people who think that given a sexual preference quiz that the only answers are straight or gay. Binary. Because that's not how it really works, and it would be pretty ignorant to think it does.

I couldn't see how the question of straight vs. gay, would be analogous to one with a general sense of moderate.

I could see it on an issue though. If you look at the US and slavery: Our Founding Fathers were bisexual on slavery. That turned out well. It prevented a civil war, for example, so that was good.

You would have to answer for your consistency, and provide the applicable reasoning and logic, if you wanted to be left on one issue and right on another. Sticking with the same example: being for equality of rights of men, but mistreating other men/denying them rights, is a contradiction; one justification was racism. Also, being against the rule of a king and/or totalitarian regime, but for the rule of the wealthy and privileged, would require some sort of justification; that usually involves god and/or Ayn Rand and/or you're lazy, I'm better than you, shut the fuck up.

(15-08-2013 09:26 AM)LostLocke Wrote:  Moderate could refer to the total average of their ideologies.
You might ask people which side they're on in different aspects, like government, economy, social areas, religion, etc etc etc, and they may give different left/right answers for each one that averages out to be right in the middle.
I would say that qualifies as a "moderate" in the general sense.

And how would that work? Give an example.

The Paradox Of Fools And Wise Men:
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
16-08-2013, 06:57 AM
RE: Moderates
(15-08-2013 05:00 PM)TrulyX Wrote:  
(15-08-2013 09:26 AM)LostLocke Wrote:  Moderate could refer to the total average of their ideologies.
You might ask people which side they're on in different aspects, like government, economy, social areas, religion, etc etc etc, and they may give different left/right answers for each one that averages out to be right in the middle.
I would say that qualifies as a "moderate" in the general sense.

And how would that work? Give an example.
It works by..... averaging. Huh
You do know what averaging is right?

If you ask them their position on 10 different aspects, and they respond with liberal on 5 of them and conservative on 5 of them, that averages to 0, or right in the middle. You wouldn't say they're on the left or the right, so the general label would be moderate.

[Image: ae1n9c.jpg]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: