Morals, Christianity, Atheism
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18-11-2014, 04:46 PM
RE: Morals, Christianity, Atheism
(18-11-2014 04:26 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(18-11-2014 04:13 PM)Stuffed_Assumption_Meringue Wrote:  A couple of pages back a demographic breakdown of the American prison population as a way of demonstrating that athiests are more moral than christians. I do disagree with the position and I do take issue with the importance of the stated figure; 0.02% of the prison population are athiests.

That .02% is the self-identified atheist population in US prisons. Self-identified atheist in the US population as whole hovers at .07% currently.

Atheists when speaking of the general population tend to include the unaffiliated to fluff their numbers, but at the same time excluding them from the prison survey use for the .02% figure. Once the unaffiliated prison population is included the number hovers at about 20% the last I remember.

Both of those numbers are off by an order of magnitude.

[Image: rNyTbDJ.png]

Please tell us where that 20% number came from.

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18-11-2014, 04:47 PM
RE: Morals, Christianity, Atheism
(18-11-2014 04:41 PM)unfogged Wrote:  I said that the obligations would likely overlap significantly but not be identical. Every person does not participate in society to the same extent or in the same way so naturally every person can have a unique set of obligations.

Name a moral obligation that you have, that someone such as your neighbor might not have.
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18-11-2014, 04:48 PM
RE: Morals, Christianity, Atheism
(18-11-2014 04:26 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(18-11-2014 04:13 PM)Stuffed_Assumption_Meringue Wrote:  A couple of pages back a demographic breakdown of the American prison population as a way of demonstrating that athiests are more moral than christians. I do disagree with the position and I do take issue with the importance of the stated figure; 0.02% of the prison population are athiests.

That .02% is the self-identified atheist population in US prisons. Self-identified atheist in the US population as whole hovers at .07% currently.

Atheists when speaking of the general population tend to include the unaffiliated to fluff their numbers, but at the same time excluding them from the prison survey use for the .02% figure. Once the unaffiliated prison population is included the number hovers at about 20% the last I remember.

First of all, genius, you're off by a factor of 100.
0.02 % is two hundredths of *one percent*. 2.00 % is "two percent".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_atheism

Secondly, who gives a shit what the percentage is in the US ? The US is one of the most uneducated countries in the world, and comes in far down the list in those who accept (for example), that the Theory of Evolution is true.

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18-11-2014, 04:48 PM
RE: Morals, Christianity, Atheism
(18-11-2014 04:38 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  Atheists tend to conveniently leave this category out when speaking of the prison population, though they conveniently use them when speaking of their own numbers as a whole.

I agree that the "atheists are under-represented in prison" claims do not make a good argument. The stats do show that theists certainly aren't under-represented either though.

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18-11-2014, 04:50 PM
RE: Morals, Christianity, Atheism
(18-11-2014 04:48 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(18-11-2014 04:26 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  That .02% is the self-identified atheist population in US prisons. Self-identified atheist in the US population as whole hovers at .07% currently.

Atheists when speaking of the general population tend to include the unaffiliated to fluff their numbers, but at the same time excluding them from the prison survey use for the .02% figure. Once the unaffiliated prison population is included the number hovers at about 20% the last I remember.

First of all, genius, you're off by a factor of 100.
0.02 % is two hundredths of *one percent*. 2.00 % is "two percent".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_atheism

Secondly, who gives a shit what the percentage is in the US ? The US is one of the most uneducated countries in the world, and comes in far down the list in those who accept (for example), that the Theory of Evolution is true.

I don't recall the exact numbers but I believe those who accept evolution falls into the 40% range only? Maybe... but that makes USA out of all considered Industrialized nations, 2nd lowest... take that Turkey!

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18-11-2014, 04:57 PM
RE: Morals, Christianity, Atheism
(18-11-2014 04:46 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(18-11-2014 04:26 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  That .02% is the self-identified atheist population in US prisons. Self-identified atheist in the US population as whole hovers at .07% currently.

Atheists when speaking of the general population tend to include the unaffiliated to fluff their numbers, but at the same time excluding them from the prison survey use for the .02% figure. Once the unaffiliated prison population is included the number hovers at about 20% the last I remember.

Both of those numbers are off by an order of magnitude.

[Image: rNyTbDJ.png]

Please tell us where that 20% number came from.

It's not there apparently, since it cuts of the rest of info from the survey, mainly the unknowns: 18381/93112 = 19.7%. Here's the full one:

http://www.holysmoke.org/icr-pri.htm

22% in the Texas prison survey:

http://www.adherents.com/misc/adh_prison.html
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18-11-2014, 04:57 PM
RE: Morals, Christianity, Atheism
(18-11-2014 04:47 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  Name a moral obligation that you have, that someone such as your neighbor might not have.

I am obligated to keep the brakes on my vehicle in working condition. My neighbor has no vehicle and does not drive.

I still do not understand how you define obligation.

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18-11-2014, 05:00 PM
RE: Morals, Christianity, Atheism
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This is what I saw somewhere about US polls .. (involves comparison with GB too)

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18-11-2014, 05:03 PM
RE: Morals, Christianity, Atheism
(18-11-2014 04:46 PM)Chas Wrote:  Both of those numbers are off by an order of magnitude.

[Image: rNyTbDJ.png]

Please tell us where that 20% number came from.

That chart is the "known" or declared religious affiliations. The next line on the page shows the unknown count. How many of the unknowns are religious or not is impossible to say.

What I dislike most about the claim is that it is normally self-declared and I would expect atheists in prison to self-identify as theists in order to avoid problems and possibly influence treatment. I don't trust that the theist numbers aren't inflated because of that.

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18-11-2014, 05:03 PM
RE: Morals, Christianity, Atheism
[quote='Bucky Ball' pid='687756' dateline='1416350918']


First of all, genius, you're off by a factor of 100.
0.02 % is two hundredths of *one percent*. 2.00 % is "two percent".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_atheism [.quote]

Opps, one too many zeros, it should be .2%.
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