More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
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20-02-2017, 07:25 AM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
The 10/42 apologetic is perhaps one of THE most fundamentally dishonest desperate clutching at straws arguments; on a par with presuppositionalism. More holes than Swiss cheese Imo.
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20-02-2017, 07:26 AM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
The "Jesus" ~ Caesar comparison is worthless anyway from any empirical standpoint.

It's like saying that there's better evidence supporting King Arthur's existence than there is Beowulf's existence.

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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20-02-2017, 08:14 AM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(19-02-2017 07:24 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  How do we know of Julius Caeser? A good number of ways. Least of all being that he left works behind him, most notably his Commentaries on The Gallic Wars.

Yea, but we don't know he wrote it, somebody could pretended to be a fictional Caesar writing the account, a point made likely by the fact that it's written in a third person narrative. Writers commonly pretended to be other people to gain recognition at that time.

Quote:Other sources including the surviving speeches by the Roman politician Cicero, the works by the Roman historians Sallust, Suetonius, and Plutarch, the coins baring his name and face, busts of him which survived, etc.

Fictional characters were also given speeches as well. Most likely Ceaser originated as a myth of a God king, and attributed sayings and feats. We also have coins of non-existing God-kinds as well.

Likely much of we have regarding Ceaser was created by the Roman religions cult of Empire, interweaving mythological elements, with fictional realistic elements, to produce what we have now.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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20-02-2017, 08:27 AM (This post was last modified: 20-02-2017 07:16 PM by The Organic Chemist.)
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
Why does this not post in it's entirety?

(20-02-2017 08:14 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(19-02-2017 07:24 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  How do we know of Julius Caeser? A good number of ways. Least of all being that he left works behind him, most notably his Commentaries on The Gallic Wars.

Yea, but we don't know he wrote it, somebody could pretended to be a fictional Caesar writing the account, a point made likely by the fact that it's written in a third person narrative.

See the gospels. The exact same thing can be said.

(20-02-2017 08:14 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Writers commonly pretended to be other people to gain recognition at that time.

See half of Paul's epistles, James, Peters, Revelation.....

(20-02-2017 08:14 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Fictional characters were also given speeches as well. Most likely Ceaser originated as a myth of a God king, and attributed sayings and feats. We also have coins of non-existing God-kinds as well.

Likely much of we have regarding Ceaser was created by the Roman religions cult of Empire, interweaving mythological elements, with fictional realistic elements, to produce what we have now.

Now apply this to Jesus. Also, are you saying Caesar is fictional?

"If we are honest—and scientists have to be—we must admit that religion is a jumble of false assertions, with no basis in reality.
The very idea of God is a product of the human imagination."
- Paul Dirac
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20-02-2017, 08:42 AM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(20-02-2017 08:27 AM)The Organic Chemist Wrote:  Also, are you saying Caesar is fictional?

No i'm just saying there's no evidence that Caesar existed. That I have no choice, but to except the default position, and that is to lack a belief.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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20-02-2017, 08:47 AM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
I recommend reading Nailed by David Fitzgerald. Great book on the lack of evidence for Jesus and how, as another poster mentioned, some of the historical writings on Jesus were tweaked later on. So yeah, Fitzgerald pretty much rips all of that to shreds.

"Let the waters settle and you will see the moon and stars mirrored in your own being." -Rumi
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20-02-2017, 08:48 AM (This post was last modified: 20-02-2017 08:52 AM by jennybee.)
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(20-02-2017 08:42 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(20-02-2017 08:27 AM)The Organic Chemist Wrote:  Also, are you saying Caesar is fictional?

No i'm just saying there's no evidence that Caesar existed. That I have no choice, but to except the default position, and that is to lack a belief.

Edit--I think I misread your post. Smile No coffee yet.

"Let the waters settle and you will see the moon and stars mirrored in your own being." -Rumi
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20-02-2017, 09:44 AM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(20-02-2017 08:42 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(20-02-2017 08:27 AM)The Organic Chemist Wrote:  Also, are you saying Caesar is fictional?

No i'm just saying there's no evidence that Caesar existed. That I have no choice, but to except the default position, and that is to lack a belief.

When you jesus freaks can produce 1/1000th of the evidence for the existence of your precious godboy then, and only then, can you complain about this presumed paucity of evidence for Caesar. Until then, I must regard you as just another blind religious asshole.

Atheism is NOT a Religion. It's A Personal Relationship With Reality!
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20-02-2017, 09:47 AM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(20-02-2017 09:44 AM)Minimalist Wrote:  When you jesus freaks can produce 1/1000th of the evidence for the existence of your precious godboy then, and only then, can you complain about this presumed paucity of evidence for Caesar. Until then, I must regard you as just another blind religious asshole.

Who said I was complaining? I don't care if a godboy named Caesar existed, I'm just pointing out that we have no evidence that he did, and I guess that makes me an asshole.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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20-02-2017, 09:50 AM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(19-02-2017 06:45 PM)of the gray Wrote:  So I was talking to my super Christian dad, and he said there is more evidence that Jesus existed than Caesar. I really do not believe this is true at all, but I realized I actually haven't done much close research on this exact topic, so I was wondering if anyone could point me to any good places to research or if anyone has any comments on this. Thank you.
More circular logic for Jesus than Caesar, certainly. Drinking Beverage
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