More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
23-02-2017, 12:50 PM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(23-02-2017 11:59 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Sorry man, I don't comment on the reliability of a text, without familiarity with the text in question, and not merely based on the title.

Yeah, but here's the thing. It's not a "title" as you put it, but a genre. And understanding the basics of history this is taking you somewhere. Somewhere you fail to grasp, since you lack the basics of basics to understand that. It could be the Vita Mickey Mousiensis and it doesn't make any difference if you read it or not. The genre is what is important for a real evaluation.

That doesn't mean it doesn't tell you anything of value. It merely tells you what you have to observe when evaluating a certain text.

Three basic questions in the lead of all of that.

When?
Where?
Why?

Failing to grasp that you just read something, feel as if you like it and take it as fact. It's called being critical of your sources, since they aren't facts of days gone by but merely the perception of an author at a certain period in time and a certain environment.

In short, you lack everything to make heads or tail of what you read.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes abaris's post
23-02-2017, 01:02 PM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(23-02-2017 12:50 PM)abaris Wrote:  In short, you lack everything to make heads or tail of what you read.

So you have no actual objections to offer about any point I've made regarding NT history? Nada right ?

Or are you just gonna continue rambling about the Vita Caroli?

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
23-02-2017, 01:06 PM (This post was last modified: 23-02-2017 01:10 PM by abaris.)
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(23-02-2017 01:02 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  So you have no actual objections to offer about any point I've made regarding NT history? Nada right ?

Or are you just gonna continue rambling about the Vita Caroli?

I guess many have said that before, but you deserve the title of idiot. You didn't grasp one word of what I tried to explain.

And yes, I have lots of objections. And they're all included in what I said. If you had the reading comprehension, you would have noticed, since I explicitly said that our understanding of history isn't the same as it was 2000 years ago.

I can only laugh at people like you feeling as if they have to add something of value. Having zero understanding of what they're actually talking about.

But you go on, quoting me on one single book title, where I've already explained it was merely a test if you had some basic historical understanding. It only makes you more of an idiot.

And once again. The important part is Vita, not Caroli. Caroli is only the part where you've chosen to dig the hole in which you're standing deeper than it already was.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like abaris's post
23-02-2017, 01:27 PM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(23-02-2017 01:06 PM)abaris Wrote:  And yes, I have lots of objections. And they're all included in what I said. If you had the reading comprehension, you would have noticed, since I explicitly said that our understanding of history isn't the same as it was 2000 years ago.

So far you haven't raised a single objection to any point I've raised regarding NT history, you haven't even quoted any of those points, nor even presented even a modicum of a refutation for a single one of them. Actually you haven't even pointed to a single one of them that you disagree with.

You just been ranting on about Vita Caroli, and my lack of knowledge regarding it, but when you can actually refute any point I've raised regarding the historicity of Jesus, let me know. Maybe then I'll have something to take you seriously about.

Until then I'll just assume you're some dude who must be having a bad day.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
23-02-2017, 01:52 PM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(23-02-2017 01:27 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(23-02-2017 01:06 PM)abaris Wrote:  And yes, I have lots of objections. And they're all included in what I said. If you had the reading comprehension, you would have noticed, since I explicitly said that our understanding of history isn't the same as it was 2000 years ago.

So far you haven't raised a single objection to any point I've raised regarding NT history, you haven't even quoted any of those points, nor even presented even a modicum of a refutation for a single one of them. Actually you haven't even pointed to a single one of them that you disagree with.

You just been ranting on about Vita Caroli, and my lack of knowledge regarding it, but when you can actually refute any point I've raised regarding the historicity of Jesus, let me know. Maybe then I'll have something to take you seriously about.

Until then I'll just assume you're some dude who must be having a bad day.

You're denser than lead and just as smart.

He's not criticizing your lack of knowledge of a specific text, he's criticizing your inability to understand what genres are within history. And therefore he's pointing out that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about when it comes to the validity of sources when you don't even know basic information, like genres of sources.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like TheBeardedDude's post
23-02-2017, 02:13 PM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
Tomasina, the NT is a soup sandwich.
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
23-02-2017, 02:16 PM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(23-02-2017 01:52 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  He's not criticizing your lack of knowledge of a specific text, he's criticizing your inability to understand what genres are within history. And therefore he's pointing out that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about when it comes to the validity of sources when you don't even know basic information, like genres of sources.

Let see, the guy asked me whether I thought the Vita Corelli was reliable, and all I indicated was that I don't know enough about the text or it's history to comment on it's reliability one way or the other. That's it.

Then he just wanders off into a variety of tangents based on this single response to a question about the reliability of a 9th century biography on Charlemagne.

If he can't raise a single objection, refutation, or even indicate which points I've raised regarding NT history that he's disagreed with, then he's of no value to me. Just another angry dude needing to vent his spleen.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
23-02-2017, 02:22 PM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(23-02-2017 02:16 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  Let see, the guy asked me whether I thought the Vita Corelli was reliable, and all I indicated was that I don't know enough about the text or it's history to comment on it's reliability one way or the other. That's it.

Yes, the guy asked you that. And you stumbled into his trap. Constantly doubling down on your ignorance. The Caroli part was totally unimportant, the Vita part was all that mattered. In your doubling down you're just making more of a fool of yourself, since everyone with a shred of historical knowledge and critical source reception would have instantly caught on the word Vita. Vita, not Caroli. Which ultimately answers your question on the NT, since you aren't able to critically evaluate the text. You just read and believe it to be fact. That's what believers do. It doesn't provide any objective value though.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like abaris's post
23-02-2017, 02:24 PM
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(23-02-2017 02:16 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(23-02-2017 01:52 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  He's not criticizing your lack of knowledge of a specific text, he's criticizing your inability to understand what genres are within history. And therefore he's pointing out that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about when it comes to the validity of sources when you don't even know basic information, like genres of sources.

Let see, the guy asked me whether I thought the Vita Corelli was reliable, and all I indicated was that I don't know enough about the text or it's history to comment on it's reliability one way or the other. That's it.

Then he just wanders off into a variety of tangents based on this single response to a question about the reliability of a 9th century biography on Charlemagne.

If he can't raise a single objection, refutation, or even indicate which points I've raised regarding NT history that he's disagreed with, then he's of no value to me. Just another angry dude needing to vent his spleen.

We are all well aware of how you don't know what you're talking about. You don't have to keep typing the same ignorant drivel that shows that you don't understand Abaris' point about what a Vita is.

You're so dense you don't even understand people explaining the trap you fell into Laugh out load

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes TheBeardedDude's post
23-02-2017, 02:55 PM (This post was last modified: 23-02-2017 03:01 PM by Tomasia.)
RE: More evidence for Jesus than Caesar?
(23-02-2017 02:22 PM)abaris Wrote:  Yes, the guy asked you that. And you stumbled into his trap. Constantly doubling down on your ignorance. The Caroli part was totally unimportant, the Vita part was all that mattered.

I indicated that I don't know much about this particular biography on Charlemagne to comment on it's reliability, i.e how reliable of a biography on Charlemagne it was. You then went on some all caps rage twisting a response regarding reliability, to one about not knowing the genre, etc..

Quote:You just read and believe it to be fact. That's what believers do. It doesn't provide any objective value though.

Nice.

It's vaguely becoming clear, that I've become a projection of some fundie evangelical in your head. I don't believe everything in the Bible or NT is a fact, or that every detail, event and saying belonged to a historical Jesus. I accept a great deal of what secular, non-conservative historians and scholars on the subject have to say, or at least view many of their conclusions as entirely reasonable ones.

In fact when arguing about a historical Jesus, I routinely appeal to an atheist, Bart Ehrman.

What I think you did, is likely enter this thread quite late, read very little of anything I've actually posted on the topic, since you still have yet to indicate a single point I raised that you disagree with, and just thought your projection would stick, and work with your inane argument (if we even want to call it an argument) about the Vita Corali.

Quote:That's what believers do.

And there's about 2 billion of us believers around, doing all kinds of shit different than the other, not all of us are white evangelicals spun straight out of the bible belt, or identity with the sort of characters they are, or their histories. Some of us have our own.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: