Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
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17-01-2014, 07:11 AM
RE: Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
(17-01-2014 05:45 AM)IndianAtheist Wrote:  Either way you should refrain yourself from making generalizations.

You're not at all innocent of that, either.

(17-01-2014 05:45 AM)IndianAtheist Wrote:  Atheism is just a lack of belief&faith in anything supernatural nothing else.

So rather than saying atheism is not a belief system, what you mean to say is that atheism does not believe in the supernatural. That's a completely different state of affairs.

(17-01-2014 05:45 AM)IndianAtheist Wrote:  As an agnostic atheist i make no claims that a God possibly cannot exist at all.

But you absolutely hold to beliefs of some kind that are rooted in your agnostic atheist worldview, correct?

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17-01-2014, 07:29 AM
RE: Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
(17-01-2014 07:11 AM)maklelan Wrote:  You're not at all innocent of that, either.
Even then that doesn't give you a free warrant to make sweeping generalizations.
Quote:So rather than saying atheism is not a belief system
Well let's not deviate on this.. yes atheism is not an active belief system that's exactly what i meant to say.
Quote:But you absolutely hold to beliefs of some kind that are rooted in your agnostic atheist worldview, correct?
Nope... just lack of belief.

Dreams/Hallucinations/delusions are not evidence
Wishful thinking is not evidence
Disproved statements&Illogical conclusions are not evidence
Logical fallacies&Unsubstantiated claims are not evidence
Vague prophecies is not evidence
Data that requires a certain belief is not evidence
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17-01-2014, 07:37 AM
RE: Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
(17-01-2014 07:29 AM)IndianAtheist Wrote:  Nope... just lack of belief.

You're playing high school-level semantic games, here. No human being that has ever existed has ever lacked belief, and just identifying yourself as "agnostic atheist" stakes a claim to a certain constellation of beliefs. Those beliefs may reject other beliefs, but they are beliefs nonetheless, no matter how bad you want to claim you hold to no beliefs.

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17-01-2014, 07:57 AM
RE: Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
Question at the end, if you want to skip the exec. summary.


(16-01-2014 07:24 PM)maklelan Wrote:  ...
I think it's time for you all to lay off a bit. Obviously you're dealing with a pretty new member of the Church who's not speaking from a perspective of particularly informed cultural and racial awareness.
...
I have no doubt she's an honest, sincere, and loving person who harbors no ill will toward members of other ethnicities, and is just sharing what she assumes to be the standard interpretation of the literature.
...

Similarly, I have no doubt that she's an honest, sincere and loving person.

So I am wondering (not too hard) what has gone awry here.

I have no plans to do a full root cause analysis (RCA) because well, y'know... not without a purchase order ... but I think we can make some educated guesses given the hints on previous threads.

I am becoming more and more convinced (confirmation bias, maybe) that religion is not a virus, as some make out, but an addiction (see link post #2).

The missionaries of old and of latter days seem to differ in no way from the cigarette salespersons targeting the poor, the weak, the vulnerable and the under-educated.

Alla, in a self-confessed vulnerable state has been mind-slaved by someone she sees as an authority. She is the victim and the missionary is the pusher.

You said:

(06-01-2014 10:32 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(06-01-2014 10:25 AM)maklelan Wrote:  ...
Yes, there are far too many tragedies committed every year in the name of religion, and that's a big problem that I am constantly fighting against.
...
...
I'd be happy to join you in that fight.

... and when I replied as above, I was not sure whether you were referring to a personal internal battle or whether you were some sort of church official trying to remove the vilest elements of your sect from within.

But my offer is genuine, either way.

So the question:
Are you the only one trying to prevent these tragedies?
If not, can you please tell me what is being done, internally, to correct these abuses / prevent future abuses like this.

Thanks

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17-01-2014, 08:01 AM
RE: Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
(17-01-2014 07:37 AM)maklelan Wrote:  stakes a claim to a certain constellation of beliefs.
Oh i see what you're getting at.. Laughat By your logic not believing in something is a set of belief ? lol

Dreams/Hallucinations/delusions are not evidence
Wishful thinking is not evidence
Disproved statements&Illogical conclusions are not evidence
Logical fallacies&Unsubstantiated claims are not evidence
Vague prophecies is not evidence
Data that requires a certain belief is not evidence
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17-01-2014, 08:03 AM
RE: Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
(17-01-2014 07:57 AM)DLJ Wrote:  So the question:
Are you the only one trying to prevent these tragedies?
If not, can you please tell me what is being done, internally, to correct these abuses / prevent future abuses like this.

Thanks

To which abuses and tragedies do you refer? Certainly not to the conversion you antagonistically and naively characterized above as victimization and "mind-slaving." That's just the kind of anti-cult pseudo-psychology that was so thoroughly and vehemently rejected by the scientific community back in the late eighties and early nineties.

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17-01-2014, 08:08 AM
RE: Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
(17-01-2014 08:01 AM)IndianAtheist Wrote:  Oh i see what you're getting at.. Laughat By your logic not believing in something is a set of belief ? lol

This is a silly and naive game you're playing in an attempt to assert transcendence over the whole notion of belief, and therefore distance yourself from the cognitive deficiencies you think comprise religious thought. Despite your assertions, you demonstrably do not hold to a mere absence of belief about religion. You have asserted judgment after judgment about religion and religious people, which by very definition constitutes belief. There is no cognitive no man's land where you can just prance around in the flowers and say you suspend all judgment and therefore lack all belief or conviction. You either have to say "No comment" about absolutely everything or you have to stake a claim to a belief. The instant you come down on one side or another on anything, you're holding to a belief.

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17-01-2014, 08:25 AM
RE: Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
(17-01-2014 01:57 AM)Chippy Wrote:  --Given that you can't spell "pompous" (and don't understand what the fallacy of ad hominem actually is) I am guessing your threshold for what is "pompous" is set quite low (and probably includes people that spell pompous).

That's ironic. Chippy using an ad hominem attack to accuse the Rev of an ad hominem fallacy.

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17-01-2014, 08:27 AM
RE: Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
Believing is choosing to consider something to be factual even though one does not know it is factual.

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Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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17-01-2014, 08:31 AM
RE: Mormonism: A White Supremacy Cult? (answer: yes)
(17-01-2014 06:37 AM)Anudist Wrote:  Though, I still find it perplexing that members can see this information, plus the myriad other facts poised against the LDS church, and still maintain the churches validity and sanctity.

It's simply not that simple.

And!

Lolz @ Vosur. Big Grin

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