Morrowind
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17-03-2012, 01:05 PM
Morrowind
I got Morrowind for the X-box a long long time ago at Walmart for just 10$... that was the best value for 10$ I ever got. In Morrowind you could do almost anything you wanted, you actually had more freedom than you did in Skyrim or Oblivion, they've really been cutting edges in the Elder Scrolls series lately, they need another Morrowind, where you can levitate, have more character detail, more armor detail, a good story line, an epic landscape. In Skyrim I fear that all they worried about was graphics. They again cut edges, so things that you could once do in Oblivion, you could not do any more. It reflects more of a fallout design than an Elder Scrolls design.

Bethesda! Bethesda! Lama sabachthani?
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17-03-2012, 01:19 PM
RE: Morrowind
I think that is the problem with all modern games. The newer they get the more they are dumbed down, err sorry, streamlined, and made to look pretty. The earlier RPGs are much more complex and engaging, but I guess there's a huge player base out there that doesn't want complexity and just wants eye-candy and killing stuff. I see the same thing in the Dragon Age series and even the Mass Effect series.
I am not at all optimistic about the future of RPG games. And yet for some reason I keep buying them.
I have a feeling I am part of the problem.

"But the point is, find somebody to love. Everything else is overrated." - HouseofCantor
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17-03-2012, 07:12 PM
RE: Morrowind
(17-03-2012 01:19 PM)Smooshmonster Wrote:  I think that is the problem with all modern games. The newer they get the more they are dumbed down, err sorry, streamlined, and made to look pretty. The earlier RPGs are much more complex and engaging, but I guess there's a huge player base out there that doesn't want complexity and just wants eye-candy and killing stuff. I see the same thing in the Dragon Age series and even the Mass Effect series.
I am not at all optimistic about the future of RPG games. And yet for some reason I keep buying them.
I have a feeling I am part of the problem.

Yeah... I got Oblivion for the PC and I'll probably get Morrowind for the PC shortly to, Oblivion wasn't as good as Morrowind but it was still alright, and a few mods could make it a lot better.
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21-03-2012, 07:15 AM
RE: Morrowind
Meh... Morrowwind is pretty good, but it's pretty buggy and broken.

Don't even try to shoot things with a bow and arrow on the Xbox version.

Also, the Xbo... x... ver... sio... n... is... so... sl... ow...

[Image: dog-shaking.gif]
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21-03-2012, 10:21 AM (This post was last modified: 21-03-2012 10:29 AM by kineo.)
RE: Morrowind
As they spend more time, effort, and money on graphics they spend less time, effort, and money on gameplay flexibility. This has been very true for the Elder Scrolls saga. Daggerfall predates Morrowind and is far more flexible than even Morrowind is. The world was much much larger, many more quests and an incredibly rich story with lots of different ways to play the game. It makes Skyrim and Oblivion look like Super Mario World. But it looks horrible by today's standards.

The Elder Scrolls series is without a doubt on a dumbing down course. But the games are still excellent games with rich content, especially in comparison to other games released around the same time as each of the individual games.

I liked Morrowind more than Oblivion and I'm sort of undecided about whether I like Skyrim more or less than Oblivion.
I got curious about the world sizes in each of the games- and check it out.

Skyrim is the upper-left, Morrowind is upper-right, and Oblivion on the bottom. About a forth of the Oblivion world is inaccessible, while almost all of the Morrowind and Skyrim worlds are so all three are roughly the same playable world size. And get this- they are less than one-thousandth the size of the Daggerfall world size.

[Image: mPobe.jpg]

Quote:The playable area is roughly the same as the one in Morrowind and Oblivion and less than one thousandths of Daggerfall's size.
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21-03-2012, 10:38 AM
RE: Morrowind
I'd never seen daggerfall before, only ever heard of it. Looked it up just now and while I'm sure the gameplay was legendary... It's fucking wolfenstein.
Which wouldn't really bother me except for the fact that the gameplay I was watching had the character traversing an area in the dark. I don't know how the guy ha any idea where he was going. It was just black and then all of a sudden there were lights from a town.
I couldn't play that.

"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." -Jim Morrison
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21-03-2012, 10:39 AM (This post was last modified: 21-03-2012 10:43 AM by kineo.)
RE: Morrowind
More interesting world-size comparisons (not that it makes better games, but I found it fascinating today):

[Image: uBWCz.jpg]

[Image: xJU7Q.jpg]
(21-03-2012 10:38 AM)lucradis Wrote:  I'd never seen daggerfall before, only ever heard of it. Looked it up just now and while I'm sure the gameplay was legendary... It's fucking wolfenstein.
Which wouldn't really bother me except for the fact that the gameplay I was watching had the character traversing an area in the dark. I don't know how the guy ha any idea where he was going. It was just black and then all of a sudden there were lights from a town.
I couldn't play that.

I can't speak from personal experience honestly. I didn't play it and I can't make myself play it either... I'm too spoiled by today's graphics and character controls. I've tried to play it a number of times, but it requires Dos (DosBox) and the controls are my biggest struggle, it's not smooth in the slightest.

My wife played it for a long time, and she loved it. In its day, it was definitely legendary.

But the larger point, I guess, it that it really highlights the dumbing down of games. If they could remake Daggerfall as a modern game... well then now we're talkin'.
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21-03-2012, 10:55 AM
RE: Morrowind
I think in a lot of instances Dumbing Down would be the correct way to define what they are doing, but sometimes I think refining fits better.

One thing I will not concede is that the vast majority of games have gotten very easy.
I remember once during my gaming haydays, sitting there with a buddy and kicking his ass at some game. Just brutalizing him. And suddenly he was hit with the desire to old school it up. I assumed it was due to the embarrassment of being defiled so greatly.

Anyhow, we drag out the old nintendo and pop in some kid ikarus.

Nope, can't play that game anymore, it's too hard. So out comes double dragon... not sure how we played these games without cheat codes...
Next is contra.... totally forgot that one hit kills and the screen keeps moving...
Feeling feeble we desperately chuck in Mario Brothers, thinking it was the easiest... it's like he's moving on ice all the time. Slide slide slide. .. jesus. So we retired the old systems. For a while anyways.

Also on size of maps, while interesting, I've played almost all of those games and I'd have to say it's not the size of the map but what you do with it.

"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." -Jim Morrison
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21-03-2012, 11:01 AM
RE: Morrowind
I totally agree on the size of the maps- I just found it fascinating. I knew Daggerfall was larger- but I had no idea just how much larger it really is than the other Elder Scrolls games.

I also agree on game refinement. In a lot of ways they've found what makes games more fun and less frustrating. But in many other ways they've just found new frustrations along with that. Big Grin

Graphics don't make the game fun, but they do contribute to it being a more pleasant and immersing experience.
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21-03-2012, 02:19 PM
RE: Morrowind
I should have never have made this thread... Now I miss Morrowind even more, download a few mods for it, make it more beautiful... have a hayday. I don't know anything about Daggerfall, that was a different generation than me. But Morrowind, Oblivion (with mods), are my goddesses of games. They're the slow games that allow you to think while you play, I like those games.
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