Mother Teresa to be made a saint
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15-03-2016, 08:02 AM
RE: Mother Teresa to be made a saint
(15-03-2016 07:38 AM)Silly Deity Wrote:  Oh but I did, and I find the evidence provided by Dr Robin Fox and Dr Aroup Chatterjee compelling, providing as they do, first hand accounts of the conditions and management of the homes in question as well as illustrating the obscene imbalance between moneys donated to the Missionaries of Charity and that actually spent to care for the sick.

Cleary whatever money was donated was not used for Mother Theresa's extravagant life style or personal gain. And whatever criticism are to be leveled at the handling of the donations, or what's contributed directly to Missionaries of Charity, to evangelistic efforts of catholic church, etc... is more a criticism of catholic church, than Mother Theresa, who likely had very little to do with the allocation of those donations.

Clearly any christian organizations, is not going to be primarily interested in tending to poor and needy, but also to insure that the Gospel is preached. If you think people who believe this are despicable, than I guess there's a whole slew of kindhearted old christian woman to attach that label to.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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15-03-2016, 08:17 AM
RE: Mother Teresa to be made a saint
So all you gotta do to be sainted is spend your life torturing people and rejoicing in it....feels very catholic to me.
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15-03-2016, 08:23 AM
RE: Mother Teresa to be made a saint
(15-03-2016 07:15 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(15-03-2016 06:30 AM)ClydeLee Wrote:  And what is ones own description of oneself driven by, facts as well?

Does responding to claims saying, I know we bathed them and gave them medicine mean anything to anyone on earth? What does that inform you off, absolutely nothing. But even that, what does it account for if they did that to the detail she says. Does it mean they heated the water to healthy levels to actually do a good health aid? Were supplies of medicine and distribution of them clean? Were their food supply

We bathed, fed, and gave them medicine says absolutely nothing as point alone. Your quote mining out of your intentions, whatever it may be, too often is like this. It means literally nothing to any defense, point, or even relevance of just existing as an added flavor of text. If any bit of context is given, it's clearly how susan conroy has even more bias to her connection. It's her benefit and adoration of a person that can be seen just as untrustworthy as something done out of "contempt" yet she also had no logic in her response to what constitutes clean.

Uhm, no, it's about two contrasting pictures of a person, one painted by folks like Hitchens, and another painted by those who knew her. Hitchens works is entirely polemical, like the sort of works about Obama composed by Dinesh Desouza, it feeds a certain audience not so much interested in the truth, but whatever feeds their own angry prejudices. It's the stuff of caricatures.

Yes... that doesn't make either side less or more biased on that data. You're view comes out as if criticism is more biased than praise. Yeah and the reports of Obama by, idk... Rahm Emmanuel will also feed a certain audience.

The Hell's Angel view of Hitchens is a caricature as is the great and saintly view of Teresa. That as well is a caricature. The only thing different is perspective. The same concept of information gathering and bias based on that is used. That's my point about it, that you're not actually expressing how you consider these different.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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15-03-2016, 08:25 AM
RE: Mother Teresa to be made a saint
(15-03-2016 08:02 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(15-03-2016 07:38 AM)Silly Deity Wrote:  Oh but I did, and I find the evidence provided by Dr Robin Fox and Dr Aroup Chatterjee compelling, providing as they do, first hand accounts of the conditions and management of the homes in question as well as illustrating the obscene imbalance between moneys donated to the Missionaries of Charity and that actually spent to care for the sick.

Cleary whatever money was donated was not used for Mother Theresa's extravagant life style or personal gain. And whatever criticism are to be leveled at the handling of the donations, or what's contributed directly to Missionaries of Charity, to evangelistic efforts of catholic church, etc... is more a criticism of catholic church, than Mother Theresa, who likely had very little to do with the allocation of those donations.

So you're saying that she had no responsibility for what was being done with all that money? She had no responsibilities for the running of the religious order of which she was founder and its "Superior General"? That's quite an abdication.

(15-03-2016 08:02 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Clearly any christian organizations, is not going to be primarily interested in tending to poor and needy, but also to insure that the Gospel is preached. If you think people who believe this are despicable, than I guess there's a whole slew of kindhearted old christian woman to attach that label to.

And here we see the twisted morality of religion. Rather than tending to the poor and needy because that's the right thing to do, you're saying that it is of secondary importance to preaching to them. For my part I'm quite content to think such behaviour is despicable.

The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike
Excreta Tauri Sapientam Fulgeat (The excrement of the bull causes wisdom to flee)
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15-03-2016, 08:43 AM (This post was last modified: 15-03-2016 08:57 AM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Mother Teresa to be made a saint
This is seriously hilarious. The woman lost her faith and stated as much in her letters.

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007...-43.0.html
She wrote "That which I see in myself, I dare not name".

She had reached "spiritual maturity" (the "dark night of the soul" of John of the Cross, / Teresa of Avila.). Religion did nothing for her.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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15-03-2016, 09:02 AM (This post was last modified: 15-03-2016 09:09 AM by Tomasia.)
RE: Mother Teresa to be made a saint
(15-03-2016 08:25 AM)Silly Deity Wrote:  So you're saying that she had no responsibility for what was being done with all that money? She had no responsibilities for the running of the religious order of which she was founder and its "Superior General"? That's quite an abdication.

And you're telling me what, that you believe she was actively involved in how the catholic church allocated millions of dollars a year in donations? She's an employee of the catholic church, who made her into mascot, the face of their charitable wing. If you think the catholic church has an uneducated women who joined the order when she was 18, manage millions of dollars year in donations, you're kidding yourself.

Quote:And here we see the twisted morality of religion. Rather than tending to the poor and needy because that's the right thing to do, you're saying that it is of secondary importance to preaching to them. For my part I'm quite content to think such behaviour is despicable.

Yes, for most Christians, including myself, tending to the needs of poor is important obligations, but it's only secondary to spreading the Gospel. Nor are these aims mutually exclusive. A person concerned for my soul is likely to be concerned for my physical well being as well. It's to say a man does not live on bread alone.

I know plenty of individuals who devoted their lives to the evangelical mission, using a considerable amount of their own personal wealth, to build orphanages and churches, who go on crusades, feed the poor, for no personal gain, but fidelity to a cause they believe in wholeheartedly.

As far an atheists such yourself finding that morally despicable, that's an entirely worthless accusation from body of folks who believe morality is subjective anyways. Perhaps that makes you feel better about your own moral sanctity, to imagine yourself as morally superior to someone like Mother Theresa, but you're just kidding yourself.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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15-03-2016, 09:04 AM
RE: Mother Teresa to be made a saint
(15-03-2016 08:02 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Clearly any christian organizations, is not going to be primarily interested in tending to poor and needy, but also to insure that the Gospel is preached. If you think people who believe this are despicable, than I guess there's a whole slew of kindhearted old christian woman to attach that label to.

"Any" is a singular reference.
Do you think they pay premiums to "insure" that the gospel is preached ? Facepalm
"Whole slew" is plural, thus "women" would be the correct group.
Do you even English out there at Bible College ?
And you bitch about *his* writing.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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15-03-2016, 09:07 AM
RE: Mother Teresa to be made a saint
(15-03-2016 09:02 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(15-03-2016 08:25 AM)Silly Deity Wrote:  So you're saying that she had no responsibility for what was being done with all that money? She had no responsibilities for the running of the religious order of which she was founder and its "Superior General"? That's quite an abdication.

And you're telling me what, that you believe she was actively involved in how the catholic church allocated millions of dollars a year in donations? She's an employee of the catholic church, who made her into mascot, the face of their charitable wing. If you think the catholic church has an uneducated women who joined the order when she was 18, manage millions of dollars year in donations, you're kidding yourself.

Quote:And here we see the twisted morality of religion. Rather than tending to the poor and needy because that's the right thing to do, you're saying that it is of secondary importance to preaching to them. For my part I'm quite content to think such behaviour is despicable.

Yes, for most Christians, including myself, tending to the needs of poor is important obligations, but it's only secondary to spreading the Gospel. Nor are these aims mutually exclusive. A person concerned for my soul is likely to be concerned for my physical well being as well. It's to say a man does not live on bread alone.

I know plenty of individuals who devoted their lives to the evangelical mission, using a considerable amount of their own personal wealth, to build orphanages and churches, who go on crusades, feed the poor, for no personal gain, but fidelity to cause they believe in wholeheartedly.

As far an atheists such yourself finding that morally despicable, that's an entirely worthless accusation from body of folks who believe morality is subjective anyways. Perhaps that makes you feel better about your own moral sanctity, to imagine yourself as morally superior to someone like Mother Theresa, but you're just kidding yourself.

So you think starving people are receptive to your preaching ?
Laugh out load Laugh out load Laugh out load Laugh out load Laugh out load
Thanks for more of your self-righteous crap, yet again.
Do you masturbate to this stuff ? You clearly get off on it.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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15-03-2016, 09:09 AM
RE: Mother Teresa to be made a saint
(15-03-2016 07:41 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(15-03-2016 07:25 AM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  Please show me links to the hospitals she built.

None as far as I know. How much more expensive do you think it is to build a hospital, with trained medical staff, and doctors, equipment, and medication, as supposed to creating a hospice? How many hospices for the dying can be made for the cost of 1 hospital?

Are you seriously arguing that it is better to care for the dying, rather than treat the sick and allowing them (possibly) to live?

How much misery and sickness and death could have been prevented at a hospital in the slums of Calcutta?

She glorified poverty and misery and death.

She interfered in the abortion debates in Ireland.
She took money from the Haitian poor.

No one is arguing that she was the epitome of earthly evil. But any good works she did must be considered in the full context. Her motivations, her choices, the things she didn't do, all matter as much as what she did.

(15-03-2016 07:41 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Yea, because someone who took on a life of poverty, and devoted herself to building hospices for the dying, was spending on her own ends. She had another life outside of her order, that consisted on fancy furs, and exotic cars.

So you're arguing that she could have been worse?

She is being canonized as a saint. In her religion, that is the pinnacle of earthly "success". That qualifies as "her own ends".

Help for the living. Hope for the dead. ~ R.G. Ingersoll

Freedom offers opportunity. Opportunity confers responsibility. Responsibility to use the freedom we enjoy wisely, honestly and humanely. ~ Noam Chomsky
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15-03-2016, 09:13 AM
RE: Mother Teresa to be made a saint
(15-03-2016 09:02 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  As far an atheists such yourself finding that morally despicable, that's an entirely worthless accusation from body of folks who believe morality is subjective anyways. Perhaps that makes you feel better about your own moral sanctity, to imagine yourself as morally superior to someone like Mother Theresa, but you're just kidding yourself.

If morality is objective it applies to god as well as man.

Shall we discuss the atrocities attributed to god in the bible?

Shall we discuss the AIDS Holocaust caused by catholic policies in Africa?

How about the pedophilia scandals?

Please.

Lets talk about morality. Evil_monster

Help for the living. Hope for the dead. ~ R.G. Ingersoll

Freedom offers opportunity. Opportunity confers responsibility. Responsibility to use the freedom we enjoy wisely, honestly and humanely. ~ Noam Chomsky
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