Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
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23-06-2017, 12:03 AM
RE: Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
I have a question: this lawsuit will hopefully go nowhere as it's frivolous right? So... these legal costs, that only big companies can afford to pay... does that essentially mean that if you're rich you just sue poor people who have a complaint, because they won't afford the legal costs regardless if they're in the right? IOW this Murray fuckhead's way of shutting down dissent is to sue people without just cause? There's only justice for people who can afford the legal costs?

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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23-06-2017, 01:41 AM
RE: Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
(23-06-2017 12:03 AM)morondog Wrote:  I have a question: this lawsuit will hopefully go nowhere as it's frivolous right? So... these legal costs, that only big companies can afford to pay... does that essentially mean that if you're rich you just sue poor people who have a complaint, because they won't afford the legal costs regardless if they're in the right? IOW this Murray fuckhead's way of shutting down dissent is to sue people without just cause? There's only justice for people who can afford the legal costs?

The American court system is so fucked up.
Often what happens is it comes down purely to money. If it costs more to draw it out than to just settle people will just settle no matter if they're guilty or not. This is how patent trolls work for example. They're lawyers who will attain weak bad patents cheap but use them to sue people and because of the expense of going to court against these lawyers/lawyer is so expensive most companies will simply just pay the patent troll out a settlement.
This is how people like Murray operate too. They sue people because they're a big company and they're hoping that they can draw the process out so long that it costs the other party so much they have to settle. Even the threat is usually enough to make people settle.

Likewise, poor people convicted of petty crimes such as weed possession just plead guilty because the lawyer fees are too expensive. A lot of people do this that aren't even guilty, they literally plead guilty to a crime they didn't commit because they can't afford a lawyer to defend them. Then they have to go to a bail bond agent who is effectively a loan shark. BUT paying the bail bond agent fees is cheaper than hiring a lawyer. And these people can't afford to go to jail for even like 14 days because they'll lose their job so they're forced to go to bail bonds agent.

'Murica!


Trust me, Commonwealth and European countries have much much much better systems. The American court system is stupidly broken, both criminal and civil. The criminal section is heavily biased towards rich people and the civil is blatantly abused by people like Murray.

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23-06-2017, 03:23 AM
RE: Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
(23-06-2017 12:03 AM)morondog Wrote:  I have a question: this lawsuit will hopefully go nowhere as it's frivolous right? So... these legal costs, that only big companies can afford to pay... does that essentially mean that if you're rich you just sue poor people who have a complaint, because they won't afford the legal costs regardless if they're in the right? IOW this Murray fuckhead's way of shutting down dissent is to sue people without just cause? There's only justice for people who can afford the legal costs?
To my understanding:

If you run out of money, you can ask for legal aid (depending on your country) although that doesn't cover everything, so you could represent yourself, which means you'd have to do so against a rich person lawyer...and you'd have less chance of winning, even if you are in the right.

So essentially yes, Rich people = for the win, Poor people = Boo-urns.

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23-06-2017, 03:23 AM
RE: Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
(23-06-2017 01:41 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  
(23-06-2017 12:03 AM)morondog Wrote:  I have a question: this lawsuit will hopefully go nowhere as it's frivolous right? So... these legal costs, that only big companies can afford to pay... does that essentially mean that if you're rich you just sue poor people who have a complaint, because they won't afford the legal costs regardless if they're in the right? IOW this Murray fuckhead's way of shutting down dissent is to sue people without just cause? There's only justice for people who can afford the legal costs?

The American court system is so fucked up.
Often what happens is it comes down purely to money. If it costs more to draw it out than to just settle people will just settle no matter if they're guilty or not. This is how patent trolls work for example. They're lawyers who will attain weak bad patents cheap but use them to sue people and because of the expense of going to court against these lawyers/lawyer is so expensive most companies will simply just pay the patent troll out a settlement.
This is how people like Murray operate too. They sue people because they're a big company and they're hoping that they can draw the process out so long that it costs the other party so much they have to settle. Even the threat is usually enough to make people settle.

Likewise, poor people convicted of petty crimes such as weed possession just plead guilty because the lawyer fees are too expensive. A lot of people do this that aren't even guilty, they literally plead guilty to a crime they didn't commit because they can't afford a lawyer to defend them. Then they have to go to a bail bond agent who is effectively a loan shark. BUT paying the bail bond agent fees is cheaper than hiring a lawyer. And these people can't afford to go to jail for even like 14 days because they'll lose their job so they're forced to go to bail bonds agent.

'Murica!


Trust me, Commonwealth and European countries have much much much better systems. The American court system is stupidly broken, both criminal and civil. The criminal section is heavily biased towards rich people and the civil is blatantly abused by people like Murray.

That's seriously fucked up.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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23-06-2017, 09:21 PM (This post was last modified: 24-06-2017 02:33 AM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
(23-06-2017 01:41 AM)earmuffs Wrote:  
(23-06-2017 12:03 AM)morondog Wrote:  I have a question: this lawsuit will hopefully go nowhere as it's frivolous right? So... these legal costs, that only big companies can afford to pay... does that essentially mean that if you're rich you just sue poor people who have a complaint, because they won't afford the legal costs regardless if they're in the right? IOW this Murray fuckhead's way of shutting down dissent is to sue people without just cause? There's only justice for people who can afford the legal costs?

The American court system is so fucked up.
Often what happens is it comes down purely to money. If it costs more to draw it out than to just settle people will just settle no matter if they're guilty or not. This is how patent trolls work for example. They're lawyers who will attain weak bad patents cheap but use them to sue people and because of the expense of going to court against these lawyers/lawyer is so expensive most companies will simply just pay the patent troll out a settlement.
This is how people like Murray operate too. They sue people because they're a big company and they're hoping that they can draw the process out so long that it costs the other party so much they have to settle. Even the threat is usually enough to make people settle.

Likewise, poor people convicted of petty crimes such as weed possession just plead guilty because the lawyer fees are too expensive. A lot of people do this that aren't even guilty, they literally plead guilty to a crime they didn't commit because they can't afford a lawyer to defend them. Then they have to go to a bail bond agent who is effectively a loan shark. BUT paying the bail bond agent fees is cheaper than hiring a lawyer. And these people can't afford to go to jail for even like 14 days because they'll lose their job so they're forced to go to bail bonds agent.

'Murica!


Trust me, Commonwealth and European countries have much much much better systems. The American court system is stupidly broken, both criminal and civil. The criminal section is heavily biased towards rich people and the civil is blatantly abused by people like Murray.

Sadly, it's a bit more mundane than just 'people cannot afford lawyers'. In a criminal case, a lawyer will be provided to you. No guarantee on how competent or overloaded they may be or how vigorously they'll defend you, but you do get one. Civil cases, such as defamation, are entirely different. The American model is pay-as-you-go, and few case types allow for the seeking of trial fees for the winner. While the UK has more liberal fee seeking, that's offset by how much easier it is to sue for libel in the UK; so much so that the UK is notorious for frivolous libel litigation.

Many of the working poor simply plead guilty because they otherwise cannot afford an extended court case. When you're trying to hold down multiple part time jobs to make ends meet, pleading guilty as a means to avoid showing up in court might be the only way to keep your job.

Welcome to the Fuck-Barrel.




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23-06-2017, 11:28 PM
RE: Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
Oliver will have a fucking field day with these jackasses....just like Bill Maher did with that fuckhead Trump.

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09-08-2017, 09:40 AM
RE: Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
The ACLU (American Civil Liberties Union) of West Virginia has filed a amicus brief in the case.

It is, quite possibly, the best amicus brief ever.


Here is the brief itself in PDF format, which you can read in all of its snarky legal glory.

Or you can listen to another attorney read it out loud to you if you prefer.




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09-08-2017, 12:07 PM
RE: Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
(09-08-2017 09:40 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  The ACLU (American Civil Liberties Union) of West Virginia has filed a amicus brief in the case.

It is, quite possibly, the best amicus brief ever.


Here is the brief itself in PDF format, which you can read in all of its snarky legal glory.

Or you can listen to another attorney read it out loud to you if you prefer.




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09-08-2017, 03:45 PM (This post was last modified: 09-08-2017 04:20 PM by Shai Hulud.)
RE: Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
III. Anyone can say "Eat Shit Bob!".

Oh EK, this brief is gloriously wonderful. Thank you for posting it.

Edit: Saved the PDF and printed it. So using this in my 101 class next semester when we get to the courts.

Need to think of a witty signature.
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09-08-2017, 07:44 PM
RE: Murray Energy sues John Oliver (Yes, that John Oliver)
The most important words in that superb ACLU brief are "... plaintiff sanctioned". If there were any sanctions levied in the long sequence of failed prior lawsuits they were obviously not enough. Perhaps there's a ceiling on such sanctions so they could never be enough, but if there is no ceiling, or the ceiling is beyond Murray's reach, I hope the court does all it can to cripple Murray financially, and in making sanction prohibits Murray from using his companies' coffers, or his companies' insurance policies to pay. A wretch like that should not be left in a position to be able to keep wreaking hell on people and institutions who can't defend themselves.

I wondered how any attorney would even attempt such an action and immediately realized that this lawsuit was not filed as a contingency case. Murray's lawyers get paid up front regardless of outcome. So long as they don't break any actual laws they'll happily represent Murray for any action Murray demands of them. You can be sure their contract with Murray makes it crystal clear Murray alone will bear all costs of any sanction. In the meantime Murray's loss of treasure paying their invoices helps everybody: it drains Murray, keeps the law offices solvent, and puts Murray's follies onto the public stage.
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