My brush with religion.
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19-04-2011, 04:34 PM
My brush with religion.
This is my first post, after you read it, you can get the idea of where I'm coming from.

In the 1980s, I was a normal kid who did normal things. Family members were in the Boy Scouts, so I decided to sign up at the age of 8. At 8 years old, you don't know anything about the world, it's politics, anything really. (At 8 years old I thought dinosaurs were only on the Hawaii Islands).

A few months into the Boy Scouts, I was wondering why I had to 'pray' after I got a merit badge, or ate food, et al. Working on merit badges and having to pray afterwards was, uncomfortable to say the least. If I didn't say the prayer correctly I would be told I was going to go to hell because I didn't praise the lord for my work. All the other children prayed without questioning it. They were happy to know one day they will be with the 'lord'.. ugh. Makes my stomach turn.

About a year later, I had had enough. So, I started asking the wrong questions. I was asking why I had to pray. I was asking why all functions have to pay homage to the 'church' where my troop was located. I was told public schools don't teach god because public schools hate god. I didn't understand what they mean. So I told them I wasn't' going to pray anymore, and the Scout Leaders in my troop specifically said that if I didn't, they were going to kick me out. So, I quit. I was quitting because they don't want anyone who isn't a believer in the Boy Scouts, even after they said in the charter that they take all kinds of people, black, white, Asian, etc. But, they neglected to mention you have to be a christian.

Years later, circa 2000, I reflected a bit on it all. I was 8/9 years old, gullible, full of dreams, only to see them taken away by religion because I started to ask questions. I asked the wrong questions. The idea of a god didn't make sense to me because they tried to put it in terms that makes it difficult to understand. I wasn't religious growing up, the notion of god just wasn't something that my parent(s) talked about.

Asking questions is dangerous to people of religion. Religion wants you to obey and not question. Religion wants to indoctrinate children, so they have people in life to support their insane viewpoints.

Religion is indeed child abuse. Children are born atheist. Only after exposure to society, and brainwashing, they are accepted to one of the 30,000 different types of Christianity in the world. Telling someone they will be tortured for eternity is not giving them a choice out of their minds, but scaring them into believing.

Christians don't have free will. They attend church because they are scared of the consequences of not going (if you know what I mean).
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19-04-2011, 05:02 PM
RE: My brush with religion.
Welcome to the forum Monk.

So many cats, so few good recipes.
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19-04-2011, 05:29 PM
RE: My brush with religion.
Your opinions aren't too dissimilar from quite a few others here, and your experiences aren't unusual at all. Welcome to the forums (not that you need such opinions to be welcomed, if I may add).

"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason and intellect has intended us to forego their use." - Galileo

"Every man is guilty of all the good he did not do." - Voltaire
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19-04-2011, 07:20 PM
 
RE: My brush with religion.
I had a brush with religion. Then I changed over to a comb, and all better now. Tongue

Seriously though, during a rough patch some years ago I considered whether or not I could embrace the religion of my parents again, Christianity, and move forward at a better pace in my life.

I inherited their house and I live there still. In the library are the old family Bibles that my folks seemed to collect over the years, or inherit from those members of my Dad's side of the family.

I picked up a Bible and opened it at random to a passage and began to read, thinking perhaps since I was thinking along those lines I might find a "message" or "sign" that would let me know I might as well. It was Isaiah that I started reading. Interesting book, but especially so Isaiah 45:7.

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

It was a King James version, which is the version preferred by Fundamentalists and the only version, amid all those Bibles in the family library, that is at hand.

I remember reading that and thinking to myself, salvation from all that god created to be. How can I know this is all bullshit and live a lie in faith?

There's a passage in the Satanic Bible that says something to the effect, once a person knows the truth of something they can't truly live the falsehood.

And in matters of faith in a higher power, it's not only impossible in my opinion, to be imagined by the lower powers of human imagination, but it would also be impossible to fool a supreme consciousness to our own, by faking faith in what limited human intellect can only hope is true and out there taking a personal interest in puny them.

Before that conclusion, that helped close a lot of doors on the conflict I was having as well, I'd felt a tug toward the old way. Raised in the church from the time I was three , dragged there but present at least in body none the least, I realized I was living what is said to be the hard wiring of generational religious programming. I was feeling what it was, instead of simply hearing about that and giving it credence without any personal rationale.

So for no other reason perhaps, that may have been why I felt that urge to go back in that dire moment. As we often do return to the familiar in times of great personal conflict or stress.

There's a saying that goes, everything happens for a reason.
I think that's bullshit. Everything happens!
It's only the human ego and self-gratification reflex that has to attach a reason to it. As if all, is for our benefit. When really, we're just meat puppets, thinking we know it all, walking on two feet and not all that tall, but under the mistaken impression that not only are we in control of all that we survey, but something no one has ever seen much less proven, thinks we're the shit too.

Religion is just us, codified in our strictest image and likeness, imagining we have to be better than our deepest darkest self know we are, so that we'll feel better about shining a light into that ebony that whispers back when we least expect; you're only human.
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19-04-2011, 09:55 PM
RE: My brush with religion.
Ah, so YOU'RE the one. Every time I argue with theists, they always seem to have the idea that something traumatic happened to me as a child, like Jesus raped my mother. You actually DO have that traumatic childhood experience. They done took your Boy Scouts.

I grew up with Royal Rangers... which is basically Boy Scouts without the pretend secular facade. It was based in a church and we earned badges for knowing the bible AND survival.

"Ain't got no last words to say, yellow streak right up my spine. The gun in my mouth was real and the taste blew my mind."

"We see you cry. We turn your head. Then we slap your face. We see you try. We see you fail. Some things never change."
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19-04-2011, 10:58 PM (This post was last modified: 20-04-2011 01:51 PM by Observer.)
RE: My brush with religion.
[Image: My-brush-with-religion.jpg?imageSize=Med...ie-Brushie]

Welcome on the Forum Monk

Observer

Agnostic atheist
Secular humanist
Emotional rationalist
Disclaimer: Don’t mix the personal opinion above with the absolute and objective truth. Remember to think for yourself. Thank you.
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19-04-2011, 11:01 PM
RE: My brush with religion.
I was never religious though I was indoctrinated. Everyone around me was, and everything about life was god. When I was able to comprehend what was being said I rejected the Baptist church in an instant. My family was broken and my parents rarely had time for me. The ones who had time for me were cats and other animals. They were who I knew. My first human friend was a neighbor who liked to beat me up. That first suggestion that people are better than everything else made me so sick. I, as a 6 year old, couldn't stand any of their stories, but I did see them as living an easier life. Sometimes I wanted to be able to believe, I never prayed. When we were taught the pledge of allegiance I never said it. I grew up in the center of a religious community, and could not feel this was my place. I've lived my life that way, always seeing how much easier fitting in is but completely unable to. I couldn't even act male. I hear a lot about a difference between people who used to believe and stopped believing. How it's harder for them to accept. But, I don't see that as so true for those who were surrounded by religion all their life and never gave in. Religion is something I've always seen as the simple life and there are times it just seems desirable, but I've never been able to stomach it.

I didn't go to boy scouts, no one would drive me. I guess that's a good thing. I went to the YMCA camp though as far as childhood away from home traumas. I've never been violent, but things like churches enraged me as a kid and still do today. I look at them and the first thing I see is a bunch of people lording themselves over something else. Why take the easy way if it hurts others? I got in trouble as a kid often over this kind of stuff, but nothing changed my mind. I really do feel that the only thing religion offers someone is the ability to feel special.

My circumstances were special, but there was never a point in my life I didn't question. From the beginning I had needs that weren't met, and a family that didn't try much for anything. It's nice to have a place where questioning isn't answered by comments like "you're weird" or "you'll burn in hell". By the time I had gotten here I basically stopped talking about anything complex. This forum saved me from avoiding a large part of myself simply because I had no way to deal with it.

Welcome aboard =p

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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20-04-2011, 02:42 AM
RE: My brush with religion.
(19-04-2011 09:55 PM)Buddy Christ Wrote:  Ah, so YOU'RE the one. Every time I argue with theists, they always seem to have the idea that something traumatic happened to me as a child, like Jesus raped my mother. You actually DO have that traumatic childhood experience. They done took your Boy Scouts.

I grew up with Royal Rangers... which is basically Boy Scouts without the pretend secular facade. It was based in a church and we earned badges for knowing the bible AND survival.

Not really traumatic (now, but then..)

I was unmotivated by something I didn't understand. I silently wondered who made god, and who made the person who made god.

As a child, having someone manipulate you to believe that you will suffer if you don't do what they say is more or less like robbing a bank, or raping someone.

The boy scouts seem to be a paramilitary group of the church. If you give them guns, they are no different than the Knights Templar.
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20-04-2011, 05:29 AM
RE: My brush with religion.
Welcome to the forum Monk - nice first post! Big Grin

Cheers, Sean

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20-04-2011, 10:44 AM
 
RE: My brush with religion.
(19-04-2011 10:58 PM)The_observer Wrote:  [Image: My-brush-with-religion.jpg?imageSize=Med...ie-Brushie]

*Gushes* Sooooooo cute! I love bat's. I'm just letting you know I'm stealing that picture and using it as a signature on another forum. It's perfect!

OK, now I want to rub a bat's belly. Is that so wrong? *looks around* [Image: Batlaughing-GIF.gif]

And yes indeed, welcome to the forum Monk. Smile
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