My conversion...
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06-02-2014, 10:40 AM
RE: My conversion...
(06-02-2014 10:28 AM)Drich Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 10:19 AM)Chas Wrote:  Conversion? No, I think not. You already believed in a god.

This is just as presuppositional as the rest of your crap.

would you taunt God? would you dare Him to send you to hell? No God= No Hell = No reason not to taunt or make fun of.

Now ask that of someone who Believes in God even if they claim to be an atheist.

I can't follow your mental gymnastics. If you don't believe in something how can you blame that something on all your troubles???

I'm sure your story sounds great to Christian types. No doubt....Of course we're talking about people who believe in talking snakes and zombies....


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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06-02-2014, 10:46 AM
RE: My conversion...
(06-02-2014 10:34 AM)Dom Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 09:18 AM)Drich Wrote:  (back story up to this point) I had lived a hard life up to that point and I was angry with God. I blamed him for everything bad that happened to me. Then I thought I had found a fatal flaw in Christianity. It had to do with Hell. I thought it was so stupid to threaten the dead with Hell. I mean how can one burn a spirit? Then I started with the taunts and challenges to God because I knew if He existed He couldn't be all that He was cracked up to be if He was sending spirits/ghosts to a lake of fire.

I use to stop breathing while I slept, and I remember one time I was a sleep, but realized I was fairly lucid, but at the same time I could not wake, Which was an issue because I had stopped breathing.. Then I realized I was no longer in my room but at my judgment. I saw a being and immediately fell flat on the ground before Him and he told me not to be afraid and to rise and follow him. I did, to a line of people.(not a long line maybe 10) I saw Jesus welcoming people by name, and again I fell flat on the ground, and my life's events started to recount in my Head. (Before He even got to me)

When He told my neighbor Welcome my good and faithful servant, I knew right then, that was a close as I would ever come to hearing those words spoken to me, then the regret/deep despair begin to sink in. All of scripture made sense, and I knew then my life did not measure up to the standards of being a member of the body. At that point there was nothing I could say. No defense for what i did.

I was helped up and for the briefest of moments I saw in His eyes a glimmer, of what of an eternity of Love with Him could have been, then I saw heart break and disappointment in Him, Then I heard "away from me you wicked servant, I never knew you.."

My heart dropped, Then I pleaded: Lord lord give me one more chance..I fell to His feet and clinched as tightly as I could. swearing allegiance and love. I just needed another chance to prove it.

then either the ground gave way or I was thrown into the pit. I just remember falling into a black nothingness, as I traveled away from the light I felt myself being consumed by this Black almost like Hot tar. It was not fire but it invoked the same response as being burned. The panic and hysteria of being consumed lit every nerve ending as if it was being burned by the hottest flame. I could see nothing but heard a great yelling and many many groans of pain from every direction, But only bearly because of my own groans, and screams. (Through all of that I had a sense that these laments were not all human.) All the while falling and being in a great state of panic and pain. Fire, panic and pain are not even strong enough words to describe the intensity of the experience.

That's why when i talk to people about Hell I say the reason the bible uses fire to describe hell it is because Being consumed by fire is the closest thing we can relate to when we are thrown into the void of Hell. Even so fire doesn't even come close. If given the choice I would rather be burned for an eternity by what we know to be fire than experience "Hell fire" ever again.

As the last glimmer of the light was fading The reality of eternity began to set in and all hope quickly faded away. I saw the next step of my journey, and that was in the face of increasing despair, the luxury of the control we have over minds, was soon to be taken from me as well...

It was then I felt a hand grab me, and I began to ascend. the being that pulled me out of the pit told me that this was Only Gates of Hell and what I experiences was only a glimmer of what was to come. He told me that the rest of "this life" was my second Chance that I had asked for, and warned me that all that I experienced awaits me, if I did not know Jesus.

When I awoke I had sweat an outline of my entire body into my mattress and through my comforter.

The experience of Hell didn't change my life. It was the glimmer of an eternity with the one I love with all of my being did. I realized that Hell is not an incentive for Heaven. Hell is simply the absents of God and all that He created. Being members of Creation We literally burn with desire to be apart of it and with God.

This is what prompts me to ask people, If the descriptions of Heaven and Hell were somehow confused in the Past, and Heaven was a fiery pit (But God lived there.) And Hell was what we know to be Paradise, but God was absent, then would you still want to goto Heaven (The Fiery pit) and burn forever with God?

Those who seek Heaven as their just reward or Choose Heaven because they fear Hell don't understand what Heaven is.

Heaven is being with God no matter what it looks like.

Cute story, now make sure you get that non breathing thing fixed by your doc, you need oxygen flowing to your brain to think clearly.

If that's even true....I think he whipped up a good story to regale his believer friends....and thought he'd repeat it here.

Dom let me ask you something, you've been a non-believer a long time, have you ever blamed god on your problems?


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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06-02-2014, 10:47 AM
RE: My conversion...
(06-02-2014 10:40 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 10:28 AM)Drich Wrote:  would you taunt God? would you dare Him to send you to hell? No God= No Hell = No reason not to taunt or make fun of.

Now ask that of someone who Believes in God even if they claim to be an atheist.

I can't follow your mental gymnastics. If you don't believe in something how can you blame that something on all your troubles???

I'm sure your story sounds great to Christian types. No doubt....Of course we're talking about people who believe in talking snakes and zombies....

It's simple Mom was a christian. (later in life. she started out buddhist.) Dragged me to church a few dozen times. bad stuff happened i hated God for it. then started to question God. Found what I thought was proof there could be no God. Then slowly started to test my anti theism, got no response went into all out rebellion, still nothing then started to taunt God. In in a sense was A/S/K-ing in reverse.
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06-02-2014, 10:54 AM
RE: My conversion...
(06-02-2014 10:46 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 10:34 AM)Dom Wrote:  Cute story, now make sure you get that non breathing thing fixed by your doc, you need oxygen flowing to your brain to think clearly.

If that's even true....I think he whipped up a good story to regale his believer friends....and thought he'd repeat it here.

Dom let me ask you something, you've been a non-believer a long time, have you ever blamed god on your problems?

I posted this in a dreams section of a christian forum at one point and it was talked about and forgotten, out side of that Atheist and Family are the only ones i have ever shared this with.
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06-02-2014, 10:57 AM
RE: My conversion...
(06-02-2014 10:47 AM)Drich Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 10:40 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  I can't follow your mental gymnastics. If you don't believe in something how can you blame that something on all your troubles???

I'm sure your story sounds great to Christian types. No doubt....Of course we're talking about people who believe in talking snakes and zombies....

It's simple Mom was a christian. (later in life. she started out buddhist.) Dragged me to church a few dozen times. bad stuff happened i hated God for it. then started to question God. Found what I thought was proof there could be no God. Then slowly started to test my anti theism, got no response went into all out rebellion, still nothing then started to taunt God. In in a sense was A/S/K-ing in reverse.

You can't blame something you don't believe to exist on your problems. The simple truth is that you were a believer. You wanted to believe and needed your own brand of proof. The dream was nothing more than your brain's way of rationalizing what you knew deep down to believe.

Yes, mental gymnastics.

Shoo fly.


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

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06-02-2014, 11:00 AM
RE: My conversion...
(06-02-2014 10:26 AM)Drich Wrote:  ...And God can't use lucid dreams for what reason? Do you have scripture? Or this this just a matter of antifaith for you?

In truth God uses Dreams all the time. joseph, Daniel, John of Patmos to name a few...

Ever heard of Occam's razor?

It is a technique that has proven its usefulness.
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06-02-2014, 11:03 AM
RE: My conversion...
(06-02-2014 10:57 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 10:47 AM)Drich Wrote:  It's simple Mom was a christian. (later in life. she started out buddhist.) Dragged me to church a few dozen times. bad stuff happened i hated God for it. then started to question God. Found what I thought was proof there could be no God. Then slowly started to test my anti theism, got no response went into all out rebellion, still nothing then started to taunt God. In in a sense was A/S/K-ing in reverse.

You can't blame something you don't believe to exist on your problems. The simple truth is that you were a believer. You wanted to believe and needed your own brand of proof. The dream was nothing more than your brain's way of rationalizing what you knew deep down to believe.

Yes, mental gymnastics.

Shoo fly.

no true scotsman much??
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06-02-2014, 11:06 AM
RE: My conversion...
Wait a sec.

*YOU* have a nightmare, and because of that *I* am supposed to start believing all that garbage?

Not how it works, son.

We have enough youth. How about looking for the Fountain of Smart?
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06-02-2014, 11:08 AM
RE: My conversion...
(06-02-2014 11:00 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 10:26 AM)Drich Wrote:  ...And God can't use lucid dreams for what reason? Do you have scripture? Or this this just a matter of antifaith for you?

In truth God uses Dreams all the time. joseph, Daniel, John of Patmos to name a few...

Ever heard of Occam's razor?

It is a technique that has proven its usefulness.

This isn't the razor but it is probably what your thinking of no?

"when you have two competing theories that make exactly the same predictions, the simpler one is the better."
http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/physics/Ge...occam.html

That said, what makes you think that there are two competing theories that make the exact same conclusions?
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06-02-2014, 11:11 AM
RE: My conversion...
(06-02-2014 10:46 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(06-02-2014 10:34 AM)Dom Wrote:  Cute story, now make sure you get that non breathing thing fixed by your doc, you need oxygen flowing to your brain to think clearly.

If that's even true....I think he whipped up a good story to regale his believer friends....and thought he'd repeat it here.

Dom let me ask you something, you've been a non-believer a long time, have you ever blamed god on your problems?


Lol, nope, no one there to blame but myself.

Or maybe Chas..... Tongue

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