My dad never wants to see me again...
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06-02-2017, 12:11 PM (This post was last modified: 06-02-2017 12:23 PM by jennybee.)
RE: My dad never wants to see me again...
I'm sorry your dad is being this way. He is truly missing out because not only are you his beautiful daughter, but I can also tell just from the short time I've known you, that you are a truly wonderful person.

I really hope your dad comes around. I think the best thing you can wish for your child is that they are happy. It's sad that thanks to religion and "traditional" society, people put "following in line" in front of their and/or someone else's happiness. You have every right to be hurt. I'm wondering though, since your dad is an educated man, if talking to an expert in the trans community (psychiatrist etc.) could help him to understand things better? It could also be that this is still a bit of a shock for him and he is still processing everything.

As far as further dialogue with him, I think taking the high road is better. Don't give him any ammunition. Just live your life and be happy. Show him you are still the same person, just with different packaging. If he still can't accept it, you gotta do you. You can't live your life for anyone else. We get one life to live, so live it on your own terms. You have every right to be happy and be your true self.

No matter what happens, you always have us for support Emma, and we think you are a beautiful, amazing person Heart
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06-02-2017, 12:17 PM
RE: My dad never wants to see me again...
I'm so sorry Emma. For what it's worth, I think your reply to him was perfect. I hope he softens up over time, but even if not, I'm glad you're standing firm in who you are.
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06-02-2017, 12:20 PM
RE: My dad never wants to see me again...
(06-02-2017 12:05 PM)Emma Wrote:  
(06-02-2017 12:00 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  I would also take the high ground, but send him :

"1 Corinthians 13

13 If I speak in the tongues[a] of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast, but do not have love, I gain nothing.

4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 [b]It does not dishonor others
, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10 but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. 11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. 12 For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

I'm sure he is embarrassed and thinks these events is a failure, especially considering the horrible environment he chose to work in.

I've thought of half a dozen ways that I could confront his hypocrisy, but I think it's just not worth it. It will only make him more stubborn and dug in. He's convinced he's in the right, and no scripture from me will change that. It would have to come from someone he respects. And I'm not counted among those people.

I play out scenarios in my head of things I could say and how he would respond, over and over and over. It's a constant argument in my head right now.

The most important thing is that YOU accept yourself and live your own life. He's responsible for his. You could just send pictures, cards and flowers, etc etc like you reject the rejection ... and go forward as if he never rejected you, each one always with the "motto" *family means unconditional love* ... what he does or does not do is his problem.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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06-02-2017, 12:29 PM
RE: My dad never wants to see me again...
(06-02-2017 12:11 PM)jennybee Wrote:  I'm sorry your dad is being this way. He is truly missing out because not only are you his beautiful daughter, but I can also tell just from the short time I've known you, that you are a truly wonderful person.

I really hope your dad comes around. I think the best thing you can wish for your child is that they are happy. It's sad that thanks to religion and "traditional" society, people put "following in line" in front of their and/or someone else's happiness. You have every right to be hurt. I'm wondering though, since your dad is an educated man, if talking to an expert in the trans community (psychiatrist etc.) could help him to understand things better? It could also be that this is still a bit of a shock for him and he is still processing everything.

As far as further dialogue with him, I think taking the high road is better. Don't give him any ammunition. Just live your life and be happy. Show him you are still the same person, just with different packaging. If he still can't accept it, you gotta do you. You can't live your life for anyone else. We get one life to live, so live it on your own terms. You have every right to be happy and be your true self.

No matter what happens, you always have us for support Emma, and we think you are a beautiful, amazing person Heart

Thank you Jenny, that means a lot to hear. Heart
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06-02-2017, 12:30 PM
RE: My dad never wants to see me again...
(06-02-2017 12:20 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(06-02-2017 12:05 PM)Emma Wrote:  I've thought of half a dozen ways that I could confront his hypocrisy, but I think it's just not worth it. It will only make him more stubborn and dug in. He's convinced he's in the right, and no scripture from me will change that. It would have to come from someone he respects. And I'm not counted among those people.

I play out scenarios in my head of things I could say and how he would respond, over and over and over. It's a constant argument in my head right now.

The most important thing is that YOU accept yourself and live your own life. He's responsible for his. You could just send pictures, cards and flowers, etc etc like you reject the rejection ... and go forward as if he never rejected you, each one always with the "motto" *family means unconditional love* ... what he does or does not do is his problem.

That's a really good idea. I like that... I've never really done cards and stuff, but maybe it's time to start. Smile
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06-02-2017, 12:35 PM
RE: My dad never wants to see me again...
Emma,

I think you're absolutely right to decide to let him have the last word (for now), as difficult as this may be. He may very well never come around to acceptance, especially since he's surrounded by people who reinforce his ways of thinking and will punish him socially and professionally if he changes those ways.

What you can tell yourself in this situation is that you did the best you could to be open to a relationship without compromising your own identity. That's not enough to stop it from hurting like all fuck, though. I hope you have a good support system that will help you through the pain.

A final thought that occurred to me is that one reason his reaction is so over the top is that somewhere under all the bluster, he's convinced that he did something to you while you were growing up..something so bad that you reacted by rejecting your father's worldview and gender. While this would be a completely misguided idea, it's a terrible thing for any parent to think, that they led their child to a decision that will damn them. He seems to be punishing himself as well as you, and that's why I suggest it as a possibility. If he's coming from a place of pain and panic, maybe eventually these will fade and he'll be able to resume a relationship on terms that work for you.
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06-02-2017, 12:36 PM
RE: My dad never wants to see me again...
(06-02-2017 12:30 PM)Emma Wrote:  
(06-02-2017 12:20 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  The most important thing is that YOU accept yourself and live your own life. He's responsible for his. You could just send pictures, cards and flowers, etc etc like you reject the rejection ... and go forward as if he never rejected you, each one always with the "motto" *family means unconditional love* ... what he does or does not do is his problem.

That's a really good idea. I like that... I've never really done cards and stuff, but maybe it's time to start. Smile

My sister was mad at me once. I did it. Flowers for every occasion. Eventually they break down. Tongue

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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06-02-2017, 01:28 PM
RE: My dad never wants to see me again...
If it were me, I'd probably just tell him that I was sorry he felt that way, but if he ever changed his mind he knew where I was. Just to keep that door open (if that's what you want).

Sent from my ALE-L21 using Tapatalk
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06-02-2017, 01:31 PM (This post was last modified: 06-02-2017 01:40 PM by Mr. Boston.)
RE: My dad never wants to see me again...
I'm the father of 2 young sons; or at least 2 human beings born with penises and testicles. Whether this is the gender they ultimately identify with or not remains to be seen. They both seem "all boy" at age 20 months and age 6 years, but who knows?

I'm a liberal guy. I'm for everybody's RIGHT to express their gender, sexuality, or any other attribute in the way they feel most comfortable. But I think there's a big difference between assenting to some concept on the theoretical or societal level, and reacting to it when it appears in your own family. I like to think I would be as open minded and respectful as my children deserve for me to be. But I can understand why other parents might struggle.

In the end your time on this earth with your children is limited. Why waste ANY of it on whether you're each meeting the other's notion of who and what you are? LOVE EACH OTHER!!!

When a child is born, you wish nothing but the best for them. You hope they don't have to struggle unfairly. You hope they're happy and healthy. You hope they're curious and confident, and they make friends well. You hope they're loyal and selfless but also nobody's fool. You try to steer them where you can but you have to trust them enough to let them figure out certain things for themselves. I think the best you can hope for is that they have the confidence in themselves to figure out as much as they can on their own, and the confidence in YOU to be able to come to you for help or perspective if they're overwhelmed by something.

A child's growth and development is an ongoing discovery - it's a learning process for parent and child alike. Every day you discover more and more about your kids. It could be something trivial like they prefer strawberry jam to grape jelly. It could be something monumental like they believe in certain things or they love certain kinds of people. There will always be surprises - some of which may force you a little out of your comfort zone but it's who they ARE. It's all good and meaningful and important.

If one of my sons comes to me one day and reveals that he's gay, or bisexual, or transgender, or some other non-binary gender or sexual expression I can't see how there's any way to take it BESIDES being just one more detail about who they are, one more attribute that makes them unique and special and their OWN PERSON! It should all be cause for celebration! But, that doesn't mean it won't take a period of adjustment.

Of all the nefarious tricks religion pulls I think one of the very worst is this notion that we should define who others are, what kind of people they are able to be as the result of some ancient dogma. I can't imagine being so tied to one set of (completely unproven!) philosophical ideas that I would put up a barrier between myself and my children in order to protect the idea. How monstrous!
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06-02-2017, 01:41 PM
RE: My dad never wants to see me again...
(06-02-2017 11:20 AM)Emma Wrote:  Gonna be a bit of a rant. But I want to get this off my chest.

I haven't talked to my father for a year as of last Christmas. The Christmas before we sat in a Starbucks on Marco Island, Florida. And while there we argued about the fact that I'm trans. To him, he'll only ever have a son. No matter what medical, legal, social, or emotional changes take place. He'll never consider me Emma.

We were able to deal with the fact that I'm an atheist. It led to several long debates and discussions about the existence of God. He could handle that, even in his ultra-conservative mind. He's a professor at Liberty University and a former Navy chief, for any who want to know. He's not a stupid man. He's just obstinate and hates LGBTQ people. And he can't deal with the fact that I fall in that acronym.

Lately I've been in the process of updating my documents with my new legal name. I needed a new passport, as that's one of the highest documents you can get to prove your identity in the US. It's ID at the federal level. About a week ago, I texted him to ask him for his DOB and birth place, required for my passport. First time I've really tried opening the lines of communication since the Starbucks blow-up.

More than a week lapsed and then he finally messaged me with this:
Quote:Remember that you father in heaven, and on earth with love you forever. I will be here if you decide to return, but will love you regardless of where you are. You will always be my #deadname# in my heart. #dob# #birthplace# Love, your dad.

This set me off, because I haven't gone anywhere. In fact, I actually did try talking to him once in early 2016 after the Starbucks blow-up. I called him and tried chatting with him, but he was mostly stoic and wouldn't answer but with one or two words. So I gave up. Some fucking "love"...

I replied with:

Quote:Thanks for getting back to me, but I already got the information I needed. I've gone nowhere, however I won't answer to my dead-name any longer. Please do contact me when you are willing to offer me enough basic respect to refer to me as I prefer. Best wishes, Emma

I had asked my mom for the info. They are long divorced, so I'm lucky she remembered. I had figured my dad was just going to completely ignore me.

He responded with this:

Quote:Won't happen son. I never had a daughter and nothing in the entire universe can change that fact, not even your choice to alter what you can on paper, by surgery, or by hormones. I will give you the basic respect of telling you the truth, no matter what you choose to hear. Do not come and visit me when I am dying or dead unless it is as #deadname#

My dad has completely rejected me. Given me a condition that I cannot meet. The old me is gone. He will never return. I didn't stay as the old me for my wife, and I'm sure as fuck not going to do it for my ass-hole of a dad.

I'm careening between wanting to sob and being so angry that I just think of everything I want to say in response. But I think I will let him have that last word. Maybe it will weigh on him over the years. He's the one who loses out in this deal. I'm not missing anything- a dad that forces his will upon me. No. No longer. He's the one who is losing his child. Pushing her away because of his own bigoted beliefs.

Fuck him.

If you do reply to him. I would keep it very short, repeat what he said and say how disappointed you are. You will always love him and will honor his request to stay away. But I wouldn't email him. I would send him a card -- something pretty. Maybe he'll toss it away, but handwritten things are harder to ignore. Also on the return address don't put any name, but do sign the card as Emma.

Because you're correct, he is the one losing a child.

Can I also say as a mom, this kind of shit really upsets me? I'm tempted to ask for his address so I can tell him what an oaf he's behaving like. A parents love should be unconditional and should never have restrictions placed on it regarding gender or sexual orientation.

Hug and Heart


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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