My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
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12-03-2017, 03:10 AM
RE: My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
Hey check this out! A web game where you can actually beat up each other's non-existent gods and related characters.

http://www.adultswim.com/games/web/bible-fight

I have a website here which discusses the issues and terminology surrounding religion and atheism. It's hopefully user friendly to all.
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13-03-2017, 04:27 PM
My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
(11-03-2017 10:18 PM)Paleophyte Wrote:  When you're good you don't need to flaunt it.

True words. I suspect there was some latent misogyny at work with him too.





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15-03-2017, 06:39 PM
RE: My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
(09-03-2017 06:38 PM)Rachel Wrote:  He replied that he was a sophisticated atheist because he had read Aristotle, Aquinas, and Augustine and had rejected their teachings while still considering them valid.
Well hell, I must be even more "sophisticated" than that guy, because not only have I read those dudes (as much as I could stomach, anyway), but I've also read Anselm, Kierkegaard, and Müller and rejected them, too. Nyah! Tongue

Seriously, his is the sort of argument that I've frequently encountered in debates with paranormalists, who insist that one can't possibly have a valid reason for rejecting their woo, unless one has spent half a lifetime steeped to the eyeballs is their particular flavor of woo. It's the last refuge of the insecure.

That some people may actually have studied their woo (more than they have, in some cases) and rejected it, makes no impression whatsoever, because they aren't interested in discussion, only pontification. Witness how familiar with the Bible so many atheists are; in debates you can almost hear the pages turning as theists frantically look up passages they either never noticed or never read to begin with. And yet some of those same people will insist that you can't simply reject the Bible on the basis of what the Bible, itself, says -- no, first you have to know what Wright or Plantinga says about the Bible.

Utter baloney. It's not necessary to reinvent the wheel from scratch by tracing every already debunked or ridiculous claim back to its ancient bitter roots. That work has already been done, and it's time to move on. But some never will.


But, one point of clarification: you say this was one of your "favorite exchanges"? Yes

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15-03-2017, 08:49 PM
RE: My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
(12-03-2017 03:10 AM)Robvalue Wrote:  Hey check this out! A web game where you can actually beat up each other's non-existent gods and related characters.

http://www.adultswim.com/games/web/bible-fight

I was Satan and thrashed Jesus! Laugh out load

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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15-03-2017, 09:02 PM
My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
(15-03-2017 06:39 PM)Dr H Wrote:  But, one point of clarification: you say this was one of your "favorite exchanges"? Yes

Poor choice of words on my part. I should have said it was one of my most memorable exchanges.
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15-03-2017, 11:58 PM (This post was last modified: 16-03-2017 05:56 AM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
(12-03-2017 03:10 AM)Robvalue Wrote:  Hey check this out! A web game where you can actually beat up each other's non-existent gods and related characters.

http://www.adultswim.com/games/web/bible-fight


I prefer my god fighters 16-bit. Tongue

[Image: prage-genesis.jpg]


This game is an interesting bit of gaming history. The game was originally released in arcades in 1994, right between the release of Mortal Kombat II (1993) and Mortal Kombat 3 (1995). Much like the genre defining MK series, Primal Rage had two fighters squaring off with attack combos, special moves, and brutally gory fatalities. What really set MK apart at the time was it's impressive and unique graphics. Instead of using the traditional approach, painstakingly creating and animating sprite based artwork, the MK development team at Midway opted for a different approach. They instead had actors dress up as the characters, and filmed them performing. They then used this as the basis for their digitized fighters. The game was still 2D and still used sprites, but in MK those sprites were generated from still images of real people, rather than being pixel art or scans of drawings.

This of course spawned an entire cottage industry of 'me too' copy cats games, that followed Mortal Kombat in using digitized actors and over-the-top violence and gore to attract attention at arcades. Some games did try a different approach. 1994 also saw the release of both Killer Instinct and Donkey Kong Country, games that instead opted to use detailed high resolution 3D models as the basis for their sprite work. In effect, pre-rending the action on $20,000 custom graphics workstations (like those used on Jurrasic Park and The Abyss), to create a series of 2D images usable on much cheaper and less powerful tech. This gave the illusion of a highly detailed 3D graphics, while being able to present them on current mainstream 2D platforms, such as the Super Nintendo.


[Image: hqdefault.jpg]

^ Killer Instinct ^

[Image: orchid11.jpg]

^ A close up of the (at the time) high resolution model used to make the render for the character Orchid. ^


[Image: 33505-Donkey_Kong_Country_(USA)-14.jpg]

^ Donkey Kong Country ^

[Image: 25304-donkey-kong-country-snes-front-cover.jpg]

^ The game's cover, where they show the production high resolution models used as the basis for their sprite renders. ^


Primal Rage took a similar, but novel, approach to the same technique. They had a 2D fighting game with big monsters, so humans in costumes was out unless you wanted everybody looking like classic Toho Studios Godzilla. Instead they went with industrial models, in effect going the stop-motion animation (also sometimes called 'claymaytion' in this context) approach. In effect they followed in the footsteps of the classic Ray Harryhausen, who pioneedred such techniques in film with Jason and the Argonauts (1963) and Clash of the Titans (1981).

[Image: children-of-the-night.jpg][Image: clash8.jpg]

[Image: qfw28ee0ixrpcmp6nuuh.jpg]




[Image: 38449-primal-rage-sega-saturn-screenshot...ertigo.jpg]

^ Here is Vertigo, the Goddess of Insanity, one of the fighters in Primal Rage. ^


[Image: e1d0b36653e3075326af210537bce218.jpg]
[Image: matenagy_vertigo_painted1.png]

^ Models of Vertigo. ^

Now those are much more detailed fan created models, but it gives you an idea if what the originals may have looked like. But they would have been much less detailed, given the target resolution they were shooting for.


HOLY SHIT! I can't believe I actually found this. Here's an legit behind-the-scenes short produced by Time Warner Interactive (the owner of the game's arcade publisher, Atari), showing off the stop-motion techniques and the technology behind the development of Primal Rage. Remember that this is just a year after the release of Jurassic Park and the nascent beginnings of mainstream internet usage, so there was a market for people really interested in 'movie magic'. You know, in the days when CGI was expensive and used sparsely.






Why does any of this matter? Because it's my favorite god fighter. All of the monsters here are called 'gods' and worshiped as such within the game's story. Big Grin

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16-03-2017, 01:31 PM
RE: My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
(09-03-2017 06:38 PM)Rachel Wrote:  One of my favorite exchanges came during my time at Amazon. There was an insufferable twit there who constantly argued for a Christian perspective while proclaiming his intellectual superiority because he claimed to be an atheist.

After months of off-again and on-again exchanges, he stopped quoting Aristotle, Aquinas, and Augustine long enough to tell me that I had no business calling myself an atheist unless I had a theology degree and rejected it. That's when he called me a "naive atheist." I asked him what he meant by that. He replied that he was a sophisticated atheist because he had read Aristotle, Aquinas, and Augustine and had rejected their teachings while still considering them valid. But the bottom line was that I was naive because the god he didn't believe in was a more sophisticated god than the god I don't believe in. Make sense? Only to him.

Yeah, this is just pure intellectual snobbery.

I think it is good to read these guys, and to read into theology. It is good to read those things which you do not agree with. However simply holding a shitton of trivia does not make your arguments better, it simply gives you more perspective (provided you actually learn from that perspective).

Think of it this way, I can give you a lecture on the moral philosophy of harm. I can pontificate on the nature of utopia and the works of Camus. I can pummel you with big words to try and convey why it is wrong to punch someone. But I ask a five year old, who tells me that "it hurts when someone hits you." Is the argument of the child any less valid than mine? Of course not.

Learn to reason, learn HOW to think. It is not the volume of your bookshelf that matters, but what all those books have given you.
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16-03-2017, 01:40 PM
RE: My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
(10-03-2017 04:10 AM)Celestial_Wonder Wrote:  
(09-03-2017 06:38 PM)Rachel Wrote:  One of my favorite exchanges came during my time at Amazon. There was an insufferable twit there who constantly argued for a Christian perspective while proclaiming his intellectual superiority because he claimed to be an atheist.

After months of off-again and on-again exchanges, he stopped quoting Aristotle, Aquinas, and Augustine long enough to tell me that I had no business calling myself an atheist unless I had a theology degree and rejected it. That's when he called me a "naive atheist." I asked him what he meant by that. He replied that he was a sophisticated atheist because he had read Aristotle, Aquinas, and Augustine and had rejected their teachings while still considering them valid. But the bottom line was that I was naive because the god he didn't believe in was a more sophisticated god than the god I don't believe in. Make sense? Only to him.

Oh wow... because that has never happened on this forum before. On the side of atheists... even similar right down to the 'i'm more sophisticated than you because I've read this or studied that or got a degree in this.'

Its like Richard Dawkins, Richard Dawkins loves rocking other peoples boat, but when someone rocks his boat... that is how many people are here. They can dish it out, but they can't take it.
People doing that in these ways are pretty often derided here for being that way. The amount of also, specific oh you have to use atheist x way and agnostic x way because I follow the idea of this agnostic definition people are very agressively rude on their claims of what others must insist.

But I've read enough to know that if not for some mealy Pears, Augustine wouldn't of seen his youthful sin.

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16-03-2017, 02:22 PM
RE: My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
(15-03-2017 09:02 PM)Rachel Wrote:  
(15-03-2017 06:39 PM)Dr H Wrote:  But, one point of clarification: you say this was one of your "favorite exchanges"? Yes

Poor choice of words on my part. I should have said it was one of my most memorable exchanges.

Got it. Wink

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20-03-2017, 09:05 PM
RE: My non-existent god can beat up your non-existent god!
(15-03-2017 11:58 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(12-03-2017 03:10 AM)Robvalue Wrote:  Hey check this out! A web game where you can actually beat up each other's non-existent gods and related characters.

http://www.adultswim.com/games/web/bible-fight


I prefer my god fighters 16-bit. Tongue

[Image: prage-genesis.jpg]


This game is an interesting bit of gaming history. The game was originally released in arcades in 1994, right between the release of Mortal Kombat II (1993) and Mortal Kombat 3 (1995). Much like the genre defining MK series, Primal Rage had two fighters squaring off with attack combos, special moves, and brutally gory fatalities. What really set MK apart at the time was it's impressive and unique graphics. Instead of using the traditional approach, painstakingly creating and animating sprite based artwork, the MK development team at Midway opted for a different approach. They instead had actors dress up as the characters, and filmed them performing. They then used this as the basis for their digitized fighters. The game was still 2D and still used sprites, but in MK those sprites were generated from still images of real people, rather than being pixel art or scans of drawings.

This of course spawned an entire cottage industry of 'me too' copy cats games, that followed Mortal Kombat in using digitized actors and over-the-top violence and gore to attract attention at arcades. Some games did try a different approach. 1994 also saw the release of both Killer Instinct and Donkey Kong Country, games that instead opted to use detailed high resolution 3D models as the basis for their sprite work. In effect, pre-rending the action on $20,000 custom graphics workstations (like those used on Jurrasic Park and The Abyss), to create a series of 2D images usable on much cheaper and less powerful tech. This gave the illusion of a highly detailed 3D graphics, while being able to present them on current mainstream 2D platforms, such as the Super Nintendo.


[Image: hqdefault.jpg]

^ Killer Instinct ^

[Image: orchid11.jpg]

^ A close up of the (at the time) high resolution model used to make the render for the character Orchid. ^


[Image: 33505-Donkey_Kong_Country_(USA)-14.jpg]

^ Donkey Kong Country ^

[Image: 25304-donkey-kong-country-snes-front-cover.jpg]

^ The game's cover, where they show the production high resolution models used as the basis for their sprite renders. ^


Primal Rage took a similar, but novel, approach to the same technique. They had a 2D fighting game with big monsters, so humans in costumes was out unless you wanted everybody looking like classic Toho Studios Godzilla. Instead they went with industrial models, in effect going the stop-motion animation (also sometimes called 'claymaytion' in this context) approach. In effect they followed in the footsteps of the classic Ray Harryhausen, who pioneedred such techniques in film with Jason and the Argonauts (1963) and Clash of the Titans (1981).

[Image: children-of-the-night.jpg][Image: clash8.jpg]

[Image: qfw28ee0ixrpcmp6nuuh.jpg]




[Image: 38449-primal-rage-sega-saturn-screenshot...ertigo.jpg]

^ Here is Vertigo, the Goddess of Insanity, one of the fighters in Primal Rage. ^


[Image: e1d0b36653e3075326af210537bce218.jpg]
[Image: matenagy_vertigo_painted1.png]

^ Models of Vertigo. ^

Now those are much more detailed fan created models, but it gives you an idea if what the originals may have looked like. But they would have been much less detailed, given the target resolution they were shooting for.


HOLY SHIT! I can't believe I actually found this. Here's an legit behind-the-scenes short produced by Time Warner Interactive (the owner of the game's arcade publisher, Atari), showing off the stop-motion techniques and the technology behind the development of Primal Rage. Remember that this is just a year after the release of Jurassic Park and the nascent beginnings of mainstream internet usage, so there was a market for people really interested in 'movie magic'. You know, in the days when CGI was expensive and used sparsely.






Why does any of this matter? Because it's my favorite god fighter. All of the monsters here are called 'gods' and worshiped as such within the game's story. Big Grin

That's interesting stuff. I was a huge Primal Rage fan, being both a Mortal Kombat and dinosaur fan.

I also had the Vertigo and Diabo action figures. The toyline was pretty sweet.
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