My worst nightmare
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30-05-2016, 11:20 AM
RE: My worst nightmare
(30-05-2016 11:02 AM)BnW Wrote:  I went through this with my in-laws recently. They were living in a golf course community in Florida that they could not longer afford to be at and were being subsidized by their daughters (and their husbands) and the amount of money were were all laying out was starting to get out of control. A collective decision was made that they would sell their house and move some place cheaper. The problem is they were in their 80s and we all had concerns about moving them some place where they were completely on their own. My in-laws, entirely on their own, came up with the idea of moving to an "independent living" facility and the place they chose to go could be converted to assisted living should the need arise (and if they don't run out of money). They found a place they liked, my wife's sisters and I ran the numbers and read all the paperwork, and once they found a unit we helped them sell their house.

Last October it became time to pack up the house. Suddenly my mother-in-law starts telling people her children were putting her in a home. My wife went down to help them pack up and move and it was really stressful. Once it became real my MiL didn't want to go and made this all her children's fault and idea. But, it wasn't our idea. Not directly at least.

I suppose on some level we put them in a position where they had no choice. But, we collectively could no longer afford their lifestyle. This was the best of all the options and none of them were great. They have been there for close to 8 months now and they have adjusted made friends, and seem to be ok. It depends who you ask. If you ask my one sister-in-law, they love it and are doing great. But, my mother-in-law is never quite as enthusiastic about the place when my wife and I talk to her.

There are no good answers. I'm only 47 and hopefully won't have to deal with this for a long, long time, but I fully understand Dom's post. I pride myself on being self sufficient. I think having to rely on other people like that would kill me. And, I'm sure I'm not alone in that. This is all consistent with a theory I have: getting older sucks. The common response to that is "it beats the alternative" but at some point I'm not convinced it does.

This is truth in a nutshell.

I saw this movie, vvvvv, when it first came out, this was the most moving part for me. Right in the theater, as I was crying, I said. I want that option towards the end.
I still feel the same, even more so.





This should be a thing right now. It's decent, it's humane and it should be a right for all humans.

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30-05-2016, 11:22 AM
RE: My worst nightmare
One of my aunts (a very independent lady, who loves her own house, gardens, pets), carefully planned, (space, screening, many other things). She has a long time family friend's daughter (who is going to school, responsible, etc etc). She gives her a place to stay, in exchange for certain help, as the needs come up. It's a win/win. My aunt gets to stay in her home, and the student saves a bunch of money. A possibility.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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30-05-2016, 12:36 PM
RE: My worst nightmare
(30-05-2016 11:22 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  One of my aunts (a very independent lady, who loves her own house, gardens, pets), carefully planned, (space, screening, many other things). She has a long time family friend's daughter (who is going to school, responsible, etc etc). She gives her a place to stay, in exchange for certain help, as the needs come up. It's a win/win. My aunt gets to stay in her home, and the student saves a bunch of money. A possibility.

Yes, carefully planned is the key here. There are a lot of horror stories about elderly people, who obviously are physically not strong anymore, being abused by care takers, or swindled out of all their money and so on. Trust is much more difficult to come by for the elderly since they can't defend themselves very well.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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30-05-2016, 01:03 PM (This post was last modified: 30-05-2016 01:09 PM by carol.)
RE: My worst nightmare
(30-05-2016 07:48 AM)Dom Wrote:  Now that I am getting older (how the fuck did that happen?) my worst fear is not being able to care for myself.

The thought of an "assisted living facility" scares the shit outta me. The "community" aspect of it does most of all. The thought of "activities" with a group of people you have not chosen to be with makes me shudder.

As introvert and as a person who has been independent all her life, I love my life as it is now. I do what I want, I answer to no one. I happen to enjoy the simple things in life, so I can afford to spoil myself. I keep the hours I want, read, play on the PC, play in my flower garden, grow veggies and fruit and play with my dogs. I watch nature a lot. It's fun and peaceful.

The thought that in just 10 years time I might find myself in a situation where I need daily help terrifies me. As introvert, an assisted living facility is pretty much as scary as things can get. Complete dependence, forced socialization and exposure to possible elder abuse is so horrific a thought to me that I may very well choose the big exit if any of this were ever to actually loom on the horizon.

I know there are some people who love such places, they thrive on socializing and prefer being taken care of to independence. I am not one of them.

There is really no point to make this post, other than perhaps raising awareness about the issue. Don't assume you know what's best for your parents. Listen to them - because assisted living is a life sentence. Nobody ever leaves alive. And while I am sure there are some good places, elder abuse thrives in some of them, too.

Personally, I'll likely hire private in house help if and when that becomes necessary. If I can't afford that somehow, I will choose to exit, rather than conclude my so far very interesting and exciting life by wasting away in some institution. That is just no way to end a life well lived.

How about independent units in supportive housing? Each person has a single apartment ( one small pet is allowed, so are cars)and are free to do as they please, however, they have workers who come in ( completely up to you when and how often) to assist. The nice part is that they are good at checking in on you daily if requested, help with cleaning and shopping. My daughter lives in one, complete freedom to do as she wishes but care when asked for or needed. Lots of elderly people are there too. I am an introvert tooSmile

The biology of mind bridges the sciences - concerned with the natural world - and the humanities - concerned with the meaning of human experience. Eric Kandel
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30-05-2016, 01:06 PM
RE: My worst nightmare
Thanks for sharing your fears, it's not an easy conversation but it's a necessary one. My fiance's mother took care of her mother for many years and she died almost 3 years ago. During the end it was very difficult for her and she complained about it constantly but it was better than a nursing home. After her mother died she told us she never wanted to live like that, being taken of by her kids, she made it clear she would rather live in assisted care. I didn't see how that was better but she did have to hand feed her mother, bathe her, move her physically from her wheelchair to her bed, etc. It was a lot of work and professionals may just be better.

I don't know what will happen but I know her two sons want to take care of her but she's refusing to even consider it, she's in her early 60's and still healthy and active but we'll see. I know it's a tough choice but it's a personal one that must be respected. There are pros and cons for both sides.

Around here we have a lot of senior apartments, the rent is low, there are common areas you can use to watch TV, play games, etc. with your neighbors but it's not forced, it's totally voluntary and the staff will only check in if it's necessary, it's a good middle ground for older people who don't need around the clock care and they can still have their privacy and have friends and family over to visit whenever they want. I wouldn't mind it myself once I get older but we'll see, I just try to stay healthy and hope for the best.

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30-05-2016, 01:10 PM
RE: My worst nightmare
My grandmother was in an independent retirement home for years, residents could opt for a meal plan or just have a room to crash in between trips -- there was a cafe too. Residents could cook some meals in the resident kitchen or heat up a meal in the microwave in their room. She even had her own washer and dryer unit, or she could pay extra to have them do her wash. The housekeeping service was weekly, they'd dust, tidy up. They had loads of activities but no one forced participation. You could have your own bed and furniture -- but if it was larger you were responsible for your own sheets. If you had a twin bed, they'd change your bedding weekly.

The place also graduated to assisted living, where they could manage medications, meals were provided etc. but they didn't go further than that and that cost was huge. Basically it's like hiring a private nurse on top of the other living expenses.

When it became clear that she couldn't stay there (she basically stopped taking her medications) we had to move her to another place, because she simply couldn't afford the 6k a month to stay there with a nurse.

She was moved into a good assisted place, where her medications were managed and she could go to meals or eat in her room. She didn't mind it too much during baseball season because she was glued to her tv anyway, but then she was Dx'd with dementia and had to move yet again to their memory ward.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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30-05-2016, 01:23 PM
RE: My worst nightmare
Well, I am not leaving my house, gardens or dogs. They'll have to carry me out of here.

I spent a life time creating this environment for me, and I did keep old age in mind when I built this house. It is small and very manageable, everything is super convenient.

Your grandma's life towards the end is totally what I am afraid of - starting out with the loss of everything I worked for but keeping a modicum of freedom, turning into a dependent situation and ending up totally defenseless with Alzheimer and having missed the opportunity to exit. Because once you are under supervision, there is no way out. The more miserable you get, the less opportunity you have to escape the misery.

I will avoid that at all cost, should my path ever point in that direction.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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30-05-2016, 01:26 PM
RE: My worst nightmare
Also, I should add, get with an attorney and work out a good DNR including who makes the call if you can't.

Many people are hesitant to sign one, because they're wrongly afraid that if they pass out nothing will be done. That's not really the case. You can have directives in place for many scenarios. With my grandmother if the doctors believed whatever was recoverable, her DNR didn't go into place unless that changed.

It can be very useful in the case of stroke, heart issues...etc.

A good friend of hubby's has one that says if he goes into a coma (he's a diabetic) after a certain time passes they're to pull the plug and let him go.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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30-05-2016, 01:33 PM
RE: My worst nightmare
I worked in home health care for 20+ years. I had to stop working to care for my mom, and my dad when he became ill. My parents had been married for 48 years, and I know how much it meant for them to be able to stay in their home, and also to be able stay together. I hope that I will be so lucky as to be able to stay in my home if and when I need assistance, I really feel people are so much happier, and overall better off, with home care vs. institutionalized care.

I wish more people cared about the earth as much as they care about who they believe created it
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30-05-2016, 01:39 PM
RE: My worst nightmare
(30-05-2016 09:52 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  I hope I drop dead hiking a nice trail.

That's a nice thought... I mean instant and fatal... not starvation or animal attack.
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