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15-12-2011, 04:25 PM
NLP
What do you think of the so-called neuro-linguistic programming or NLP , guys ?

Thanks , appreciate
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15-12-2011, 04:55 PM
RE: NLP
Not much other than placebo effects and another way of taking money from gullible people.

Oh, no Hallucinations 4:11 says the 'gilded sheep should be stewed in rat blood' but Morons 5:16 contradicts it. (Chas)

I would never shake a baby unless the recipe requires it.
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15-12-2011, 08:12 PM
RE: NLP
It's been about 16 years since I worked on my master's in counseling, but back then the "Establishment's" view of NLP was that it's essentially like the skills a performing "mentalist" has. Practitioners of Neuro-Lingquistic Programming are really good at "reading" a person's mannerisms and then are able to use a form of hypnotic tone of voice and language to put their clients at ease, and on the verge of a "trance-lite" state.
It seemed like too much work to learn, so after I read Steve Lankton's "Practical Magic" I was pretty much done with trying to learn the method for myself.

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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16-12-2011, 01:15 PM (This post was last modified: 16-12-2011 01:22 PM by AbdelZ.)
RE: NLP
(15-12-2011 08:12 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  It's been about 16 years since I worked on my master's in counseling, but back then the "Establishment's" view of NLP was that it's essentially like the skills a performing "mentalist" has. Practitioners of Neuro-Lingquistic Programming are really good at "reading" a person's mannerisms and then are able to use a form of hypnotic tone of voice and language to put their clients at ease, and on the verge of a "trance-lite" state.
It seemed like too much work to learn, so after I read Steve Lankton's "Practical Magic" I was pretty much done with trying to learn the method for myself.

Please do elaborate on that , thanks , appreciate

Do u think for example that hypnosis does work either on oneself or on others ?

what about our free will then if hypnosis can make us or others do what we do not want , will or wish to do ?

Do u think there is some truth in what NLP says ?

It seems to me that some of what they say is common innate knowledge to all of us , to some extent at least ,they just try to surround that with so much vodoo mystery & hokus pokus

Besides : NLP seems to me too much inspired by atheistic buddhism like the fact that they believe in the 'fact ' that man is the only "creator " of his /her own reality = unnuanced bullshit , ignoring all those biological psychological social cultural ecological ideological "mechanisms " that shape our thought thus our behavior , ignoring the fact that we are relatively free , not absolutely free , stuff like that

Thanks, appreciate




(15-12-2011 04:55 PM)Malleus Wrote:  Not much other than placebo effects and another way of taking money from gullible people.

Yeah , very suggestive placebo stuff indeed for the most part at least : a lots of hokus-pokus thus , but there is some truth in NLP , i guess, that's why it's so attractive sometimes , especially for some desperate & burned out people i know : it's just that i do not feel attracted by it : i feel a lots of rejection & disgust in that regard , to be honest :

I just despise those kindda machiavellistic modern goroes who manipulate people that way for materialistic reasons

What do u think of that so-called law of attraction ? there is some truth in it , they just surround it with such new age vodoo haha mysteries & a lots of other bullshit

Thanks indeed , appreciate
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16-12-2011, 04:19 PM
RE: NLP
(16-12-2011 01:15 PM)AbdelZ Wrote:  What do u think of that so-called law of attraction ? there is some truth in it , they just surround it with such new age vodoo haha mysteries & a lots of other bullshit

Thanks indeed , appreciate

Ah yes, reminds me of that film "The Secret". Didn't they put that guy in jail for fraud? Good! Serves him right.

The "law of attraction" or to call it differently, the self-fulfilling prophecy does indeed work within reasonable limits.

If I wanted to be a tiny Chinese female champion in Gymnastics, I could try to use the law of attraction as much as I want, I'll still be a big, tall, Caucasian man whose most usual physical activity is walking.

The self-fulfilling prophecy works and it doesn't need mumbo-jumbo unless you have to trick yourself to get some motivation. That's where you placebo your way into fulfilling it. Unfortunately you also have to make some assholes rich and I strongly oppose that.

Oh, no Hallucinations 4:11 says the 'gilded sheep should be stewed in rat blood' but Morons 5:16 contradicts it. (Chas)

I would never shake a baby unless the recipe requires it.
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17-12-2011, 12:13 PM
RE: NLP
(16-12-2011 04:19 PM)Malleus Wrote:  
(16-12-2011 01:15 PM)AbdelZ Wrote:  What do u think of that so-called law of attraction ? there is some truth in it , they just surround it with such new age vodoo haha mysteries & a lots of other bullshit

Thanks indeed , appreciate

Ah yes, reminds me of that film "The Secret". Didn't they put that guy in jail for fraud? Good! Serves him right.

The "law of attraction" or to call it differently, the self-fulfilling prophecy does indeed work within reasonable limits.

If I wanted to be a tiny Chinese female champion in Gymnastics, I could try to use the law of attraction as much as I want, I'll still be a big, tall, Caucasian man whose most usual physical activity is walking.

The self-fulfilling prophecy works and it doesn't need mumbo-jumbo unless you have to trick yourself to get some motivation. That's where you placebo your way into fulfilling it. Unfortunately you also have to make some assholes rich and I strongly oppose that.

Yeah, u are absolutely right about that , i think the same way about the above mentioned stuff , i just needed some confirmation

I even watched " the secret " on http://www.topdocumentaryfilms.com ( great docus really there beside this one at least ) & commented on it under the same nick :
disgusting how they put it
The "law of attraction " just works indeed , to some extent at least , they just surround that with so much mystery & a lots of suggestive placebo hokus pokus stuff : i really despise those guys who manipulate people in order to get rich themselves
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17-12-2011, 12:32 PM
RE: NLP
(15-12-2011 04:25 PM)AbdelZ Wrote:  What do you think of the so-called neuro-linguistic programming or NLP , guys ?

Thanks , appreciate

There's a reason that Derren Brown keeps using it - he's an illusionist, not a magician of the dark arts. It should also be noted that Penn & Teller on one episode of "Fool Us" stated firmly that NLP was bullshit, and they'd be likely to know. Also, while hypnosis does seem to work with accepting audiences, it probably can't make a person act in a way that they aren't willingly going along with. The MythBusters tested it and found that the suggestion vividly came to mind when triggered (in the conscious mind, not subconscious) and didn't impel them to act against their will.

I don't know how Derren Brown does things like "The Heist" or "The Assassin", but I'm willing to bet - because he's an illusionist - that these things are illusions.

My girlfriend is mad at me. Perhaps I shouldn't have tried cooking a stick in her non-stick pan.
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17-12-2011, 01:43 PM
RE: NLP
(17-12-2011 12:32 PM)Starcrash Wrote:  
(15-12-2011 04:25 PM)AbdelZ Wrote:  What do you think of the so-called neuro-linguistic programming or NLP , guys ?

Thanks , appreciate

There's a reason that Derren Brown keeps using it - he's an illusionist, not a magician of the dark arts. It should also be noted that Penn & Teller on one episode of "Fool Us" stated firmly that NLP was bullshit, and they'd be likely to know. Also, while hypnosis does seem to work with accepting audiences, it probably can't make a person act in a way that they aren't willingly going along with. The MythBusters tested it and found that the suggestion vividly came to mind when triggered (in the conscious mind, not subconscious) and didn't impel them to act against their will.

I don't know how Derren Brown does things like "The Heist" or "The Assassin", but I'm willing to bet - because he's an illusionist - that these things are illusions.


I agree , i think those guys just misuse the fact that religion is not really in actually , so they try to get some inspirations from atheistic buddhism for example in the sense than man is " the only creator " or the "creator of his won reality " = bullshit , those guys misuse also the fact that modern psychology is mostly full of shit , including that materialistic neuro-psychology or the cognitive one that relies on the scientific facts of neuro-science while reducing man to just material processes , misuse the fact that materialism in exact sciences & in other sciences has failed to address the issue of man , no wonder thus

Well , take a look at this great book on the matter ( just ignora some of its racist aspects ) of French scientist nobel prize winner Alexis Carrel : "man the unknown ", you can download for free from scribd.com or from elsewhere

Thanks, appreciate
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18-12-2011, 12:52 AM
RE: NLP
(17-12-2011 12:32 PM)Starcrash Wrote:  
(15-12-2011 04:25 PM)AbdelZ Wrote:  What do you think of the so-called neuro-linguistic programming or NLP , guys ?

Thanks , appreciate

There's a reason that Derren Brown keeps using it - he's an illusionist, not a magician of the dark arts. It should also be noted that Penn & Teller on one episode of "Fool Us" stated firmly that NLP was bullshit, and they'd be likely to know. Also, while hypnosis does seem to work with accepting audiences, it probably can't make a person act in a way that they aren't willingly going along with. The MythBusters tested it and found that the suggestion vividly came to mind when triggered (in the conscious mind, not subconscious) and didn't impel them to act against their will.

I don't know how Derren Brown does things like "The Heist" or "The Assassin", but I'm willing to bet - because he's an illusionist - that these things are illusions.

Derren Brown doesn't use NLP:

Quote:Several authors have claimed that Brown uses neuro-linguistic programming (NLP) in his act which "consists of a range of magical 'tricks', misdirection and, most intriguing, setting up audiences to provide the response that he wishes them to provide by using subtle subliminal cues in his conversation with them."[37] In response to the accusation that he unfairly claims to be using NLP whenever he performs, Brown writes "The truth is I have never mentioned it outside of my book". Brown does have an off-stage curiosity about the system, and discusses it in the larger context of hypnotism and suggestion.[18][38] In his book "Tricks of the Mind" he mentions that he attended an NLP course with Richard Bandler, co-creator of NLP and mentor of Paul McKenna, but suggests that the rigid systems of body language interpretation employed by NLP are not as reliable as its practitioners imply. He also mentions the NLP concept of eye accessing cues as a technique of "limited use" in his book "Pure Effect".[39] The language patterns which he uses to suggest behaviours are very similar in style to those used by Richard Bandler and by the hypnotist from whom Bandler learned his skill, Milton H. Erickson. Brown also mentions in his book 'Tricks of the Mind' that NLP students were given a certificate after a four-day course, certifying them to practice NLP as a therapist. A year after Brown attended the class, he received a number of letters saying that he would receive another certificate, not for passing a test (as he discontinued practising NLP following the course), but for keeping in touch. After ignoring their request, he later received the new certificate for NLP in his mailbox, unsolicited.[40]

I know that wikipedia isn't the best source, but it gives a good description of the problems with NLP that Brown discusses in his books.
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18-12-2011, 02:08 PM
RE: NLP
(18-12-2011 12:52 AM)Mr.Samsa Wrote:  
(17-12-2011 12:32 PM)Starcrash Wrote:  
(15-12-2011 04:25 PM)AbdelZ Wrote:  What do you think of the so-called neuro-linguistic programming or NLP , guys ?

Thanks , appreciate

There's a reason that Derren Brown keeps using it - he's an illusionist, not a magician of the dark arts. It should also be noted that Penn & Teller on one episode of "Fool Us" stated firmly that NLP was bullshit, and they'd be likely to know. Also, while hypnosis does seem to work with accepting audiences, it probably can't make a person act in a way that they aren't willingly going along with. The MythBusters tested it and found that the suggestion vividly came to mind when triggered (in the conscious mind, not subconscious) and didn't impel them to act against their will.

I don't know how Derren Brown does things like "The Heist" or "The Assassin", but I'm willing to bet - because he's an illusionist - that these things are illusions.

Derren Brown doesn't use NLP:

Quote:Several authors have claimed that Brown uses neuro-linguistic programming (NLP) in his act which "consists of a range of magical 'tricks', misdirection and, most intriguing, setting up audiences to provide the response that he wishes them to provide by using subtle subliminal cues in his conversation with them."[37] In response to the accusation that he unfairly claims to be using NLP whenever he performs, Brown writes "The truth is I have never mentioned it outside of my book". Brown does have an off-stage curiosity about the system, and discusses it in the larger context of hypnotism and suggestion.[18][38] In his book "Tricks of the Mind" he mentions that he attended an NLP course with Richard Bandler, co-creator of NLP and mentor of Paul McKenna, but suggests that the rigid systems of body language interpretation employed by NLP are not as reliable as its practitioners imply. He also mentions the NLP concept of eye accessing cues as a technique of "limited use" in his book "Pure Effect".[39] The language patterns which he uses to suggest behaviours are very similar in style to those used by Richard Bandler and by the hypnotist from whom Bandler learned his skill, Milton H. Erickson. Brown also mentions in his book 'Tricks of the Mind' that NLP students were given a certificate after a four-day course, certifying them to practice NLP as a therapist. A year after Brown attended the class, he received a number of letters saying that he would receive another certificate, not for passing a test (as he discontinued practising NLP following the course), but for keeping in touch. After ignoring their request, he later received the new certificate for NLP in his mailbox, unsolicited.[40]

I know that wikipedia isn't the best source, but it gives a good description of the problems with NLP that Brown discusses in his books.

Thanks , buddy , for the tip even though wiki is no real credible source i will take a closer look at anyway
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