Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
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18-01-2014, 02:54 PM
RE: Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
(18-01-2014 02:50 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 10:20 AM)Alla Wrote:  When we do all we can to learn natural laws we become like Gods
I don't want to be like the Christian, Jewish or Muslim gods, they are evil cunts!
This is the choice that you are free to make. Thumbsup

English is not my native language.
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18-01-2014, 02:54 PM
RE: Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
(18-01-2014 02:43 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 02:33 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  If there is not suffering in the world then what is there left to overcome? Consider
nothing.

So suffering is needed to overcome suffering.
If there is no suffering, doesn't this just solve the whole problem?

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18-01-2014, 02:58 PM
RE: Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
(18-01-2014 02:54 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 02:43 PM)Alla Wrote:  nothing.

So suffering is needed to overcome suffering.
If there is no suffering, doesn't this just solve the whole problem?
yes.
yes, it does solve THIS problem but it doesn't solve another problem: you can not become all-knowing God.

English is not my native language.
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18-01-2014, 03:08 PM
RE: Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
(18-01-2014 02:52 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 02:44 PM)Timber1025 Wrote:  Alla, come on now! Do you really see how what you say can get folks here like me ticked off? Someone gave an example of a natural situation created by the supposed God, that brings horrible suffering and pain to countless innocent people and children, and you call being subject to these natural laws as a "blessing"!

Rethink and read this over and over until it clicks with you please...please!
Oh, I know how it sounds. When I have my trials I don't see them as great blessings or blessings at all. I am not looking forward to have new trials. I hope that next trial will be the easy one. I am weak mortal. And I am a chicken.
But when I do have trial I KNOW what I have to DO. And I see that I am learning something new and true. To learn something new and true is a blessing to me. Any knowledge of the truth is a blessing to me.
Most of the time I fully understand what I have learned when trial is over. Clap

OK so you know exactly how it sounds but have not given a satisfactory explanation. People do not know what to do when stricken with parasites or disease and the outcome is a painful death - not a learning experience. Your personal trials are just that, but don't talk about "looking forward to new trials" and "blessings" while the lungs of thousands of children become the home of a parasitic worm that tortures them to death.

“Truth does not demand belief. Scientists do not join hands every Sunday, singing, yes, gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! I believe in my heart that what goes up, up, up, must come down, down, down. Amen! If they did, we would think they were pretty insecure about it.”
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18-01-2014, 03:09 PM
RE: Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
(18-01-2014 02:58 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 02:54 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  So suffering is needed to overcome suffering.
If there is no suffering, doesn't this just solve the whole problem?
yes.
yes, it does solve THIS problem but it doesn't solve another problem: you can not become all-knowing God.

And since when is that a prerequisite? Since when is that a problem? It's a problem that only exists in your worldview.

"Behind every great pirate, there is a great butt."
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18-01-2014, 03:12 PM
RE: Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
Oh and to contribute to the OP - the most common explanation I get is that Satan character, or a byproduct of us sinning.

“Truth does not demand belief. Scientists do not join hands every Sunday, singing, yes, gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! I believe in my heart that what goes up, up, up, must come down, down, down. Amen! If they did, we would think they were pretty insecure about it.”
— Dan Barker —
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18-01-2014, 03:43 PM
RE: Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
(18-01-2014 03:09 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 02:58 PM)Alla Wrote:  yes.
yes, it does solve THIS problem but it doesn't solve another problem: you can not become all-knowing God.
And since when is that a prerequisite? Since when is that a problem?
since "from eternity to eternity"
(18-01-2014 03:09 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  It's a problem that only exists in your worldview.
I don't believe this opinion is true.

English is not my native language.
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18-01-2014, 03:48 PM
RE: Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
(18-01-2014 11:15 AM)Alla Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 11:05 AM)Baruch Wrote:  Read my starting post above - you didn't explain it.
The example of the bubonic plague - and many other examples, we cannot do something about it and its not directly humans fault.

Did we CREATE a treatment? Did we find a way to FIGHT this evil(enemy)?
If yes, then we are PROGRESSING.
To be a subject to trials/natural laws is a blessing. It gives us endless opportunities to progress and to be kind and compassionate to others.

Are you asking if we created a treatment for bubonic plague?
Not for fucking centuries, at least an effective one. And even now our treatments are ineffective after roughly 24 hours after initial symptoms.

And I'm pretty sure bubonic plague was never ever a 'blessing' to anybody, what with the diseases' habit of rotting your body from the inside and out.

The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
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18-01-2014, 03:49 PM
RE: Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
(18-01-2014 03:43 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 03:09 PM)undergroundp Wrote:  It's a problem that only exists in your worldview.
I don't believe this opinion is true.

"I don't believe this opinion is true". I guess can give this answer to any question possible without an argument and get away with it.

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18-01-2014, 03:50 PM
RE: Natural evil - whats the best theistic defence you have come across...?
(18-01-2014 03:43 PM)Alla Wrote:  I don't believe this opinion is true.

Of course not, because your cognitive dissonance is messing with how you perceive the truth.
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