Nature vs Nurture
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07-06-2013, 04:44 PM
RE: Nature vs Nurture
(07-06-2013 10:33 AM)bbeljefe Wrote:  
(07-06-2013 10:25 AM)I and I Wrote:  What is an asexual heterosexual?

A heterosexual who feels no interest in engaging in sex. Asexual doesn't mean a person doesn't prefer one gender over another, it means they choose not to participate in sex. There are both hetero and homosexual couples who are also asexual.

Quote:You are stating that homosexuality can be determined regardless of ones behavior or desires. I am asking how would one go about proving this.

You're confusing the context of determine. I don't mean that we can determine it, I mean it is determined during development through a combination of nature and environmental influence... just like everything else about human personalities/traits is determined.

Right, and how would someone go about proving this very big causal leap to prove that hormone levels are a cause of homosexuality? In order to be attracted to something or someone, doesn't the person have to actually see or know of the person? How does a fetus for example have any sexual orientation at all?
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07-06-2013, 05:00 PM
RE: Nature vs Nurture
(07-06-2013 04:44 PM)I and I Wrote:  
(07-06-2013 10:33 AM)bbeljefe Wrote:  A heterosexual who feels no interest in engaging in sex. Asexual doesn't mean a person doesn't prefer one gender over another, it means they choose not to participate in sex. There are both hetero and homosexual couples who are also asexual.


You're confusing the context of determine. I don't mean that we can determine it, I mean it is determined during development through a combination of nature and environmental influence... just like everything else about human personalities/traits is determined.

Right, and how would someone go about proving this very big causal leap to prove that hormone levels are a cause of homosexuality? In order to be attracted to something or someone, doesn't the person have to actually see or know of the person? How does a fetus for example have any sexual orientation at all?

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

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07-06-2013, 05:01 PM
RE: Nature vs Nurture
(07-06-2013 04:44 PM)I and I Wrote:  How does a fetus for example have any sexual orientation at all?

That's a silly question, obviously the fetus isn't thinking about sex. It has the blueprints for sexual orientation and won't know it for likely years.

Besides, it's not hetero or homo, there is a curve and people sit on different spots on that curve.

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07-06-2013, 05:07 PM
RE: Nature vs Nurture
Have a look here:

http://storymind.com/mental_relativity/101.htm

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07-06-2013, 05:22 PM
RE: Nature vs Nurture
(07-06-2013 05:01 PM)Dom Wrote:  
(07-06-2013 04:44 PM)I and I Wrote:  How does a fetus for example have any sexual orientation at all?

That's a silly question, obviously the fetus isn't thinking about sex. It has the blueprints for sexual orientation and won't know it for likely years.

Besides, it's not hetero or homo, there is a curve and people sit on different spots on that curve.

How do four gay guys sit on a stool? turn it upside down


Drinking Beverage

What blueprint are you referring to? We have blueprints to make a hand, but that doesn't mean these blueprints determine what hand we write with. There is no way to look at someones DNA or hormone levels alone to come to a conclusion about whether or not someone is gay.
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07-06-2013, 05:59 PM (This post was last modified: 07-06-2013 06:02 PM by Chas.)
RE: Nature vs Nurture
(07-06-2013 05:22 PM)I and I Wrote:  
(07-06-2013 05:01 PM)Dom Wrote:  That's a silly question, obviously the fetus isn't thinking about sex. It has the blueprints for sexual orientation and won't know it for likely years.

Besides, it's not hetero or homo, there is a curve and people sit on different spots on that curve.

How do four gay guys sit on a stool? turn it upside down


Drinking Beverage

What blueprint are you referring to? We have blueprints to make a hand, but that doesn't mean these blueprints determine what hand we write with. There is no way to look at someones DNA or hormone levels alone to come to a conclusion about whether or not someone is gay.

It is not their hormone levels. It is the effects on brain development in utero of the local levels of various biochemicals.

Here's a primer that you could have found had you even tried.

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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07-06-2013, 06:01 PM
RE: Nature vs Nurture
(07-06-2013 05:22 PM)I and I Wrote:  
(07-06-2013 05:01 PM)Dom Wrote:  That's a silly question, obviously the fetus isn't thinking about sex. It has the blueprints for sexual orientation and won't know it for likely years.

Besides, it's not hetero or homo, there is a curve and people sit on different spots on that curve.

How do four gay guys sit on a stool? turn it upside down


Drinking Beverage

What blueprint are you referring to? We have blueprints to make a hand, but that doesn't mean these blueprints determine what hand we write with. There is no way to look at someones DNA or hormone levels alone to come to a conclusion about whether or not someone is gay.

Read the link I posted. I just put it in simpler words.

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07-06-2013, 06:03 PM
RE: Nature vs Nurture
Obviously not simple enough.

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07-06-2013, 06:36 PM
RE: Nature vs Nurture
So if prenatal hormone levels can determine sexual orientation, these hormone levels can be measured and then a conclusion can be made whether or not that fetus will be homosexual or not correct?
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08-06-2013, 04:56 AM
RE: Nature vs Nurture
(07-06-2013 06:36 PM)I and I Wrote:  So if prenatal hormone levels can determine sexual orientation, these hormone levels can be measured and then a conclusion can be made whether or not that fetus will be homosexual or not correct?

It isn't about gross hormone levels that you can do a blood test for. It is the distribution of chemicals, the gradients across the fetus. DNA drives a complex process of turning on and off production of chemicals based on the local concentrations of other chemicals. Only parts of it are well-understood.

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