Near Death/Out of body experiences.
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27-09-2015, 12:09 PM
Near Death/Out of body experiences.
The pastor at my wife's church just wrote a book called Imagine Heaven where he's trying to prove NDE's through a biblical lense. He's starting a series of six sermons on his findings today. I've seen studies and debates about this issue and since I'm on this website its obvious I think the NDE thing is bs. What I find most revealing about his book is the people he chose to write a blurb praising it were all apologists (including Lee Strobel) and a couple of philosophy professors from Biola and Liberty University, big time evangelical colleges so its obvious he's not treating this as a real book of "scientific" facts.

Just curious if there is any resource out there that any of you know of debunking these things for real? Any help is appreciated.
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27-09-2015, 12:59 PM
RE: Near Death/Out of body experiences.
As brains desaturate of oxygen, they fire in strange ways. Rats have NDEs. Are THEY experiencing Jebus. Angel
http://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots...xperiences
Too bad he wasted his life and his time with bs.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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27-09-2015, 03:02 PM
RE: Near Death/Out of body experiences.
Great article. Thanks Bucky!
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27-09-2015, 05:48 PM
RE: Near Death/Out of body experiences.
(27-09-2015 12:09 PM)Rkane819 Wrote:  Just curious if there is any resource out there that any of you know of debunking these things for real? Any help is appreciated.

Well, there probably isn't going to be much to debunk, really. Arguing that near-death experiences are visions of Heaven is an argument doomed to fail, as it assumes the existence of entities not in evidence to explain what is, at best, an unknown. As I have said many times in a certain other thread, unknowns are not evidence of anything. That's rather why they are unknowns. Near-death experiences could just as easily be "evidence" for alien mind-projections stealing away human consciousness when you die so that you may be consumed by Azathoth as it could be for Heaven.

Concerns about unknowns aside, near-death experiences have essentially been proven to be nothing other than the brain hallucinating as it starts to short-circuit due to... well, whatever it is that's making it die. Usually, that means oxygen deprivation. Aside from the fact that this is a very straightforward explanation that fits all the evidence in hand, there have also been a number of studies aimed at discerning whether or not there is anything paranormal occurring which have turned up nothing.

Probably the most well-known of these is the AWARE study, which placed concealed images on high shelves and other places out of view from the tables in places like doctor's offices, emergency rooms, and operating theaters. Many near-death experience accounts include things like floating up out of the body, or something similar; if this actually occurred, someone would probably notice the pictures.

No one did, obviously. You can read more about it here, and you can find other, similar studies via a quick Google search.

Spoiler alert: their results are negative.

"Owl," said Rabbit shortly, "you and I have brains. The others have fluff. If there is any thinking to be done in this Forest - and when I say thinking I mean thinking - you and I must do it."
- A. A. Milne, The House at Pooh Corner
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27-09-2015, 06:51 PM
RE: Near Death/Out of body experiences.
Well, there probably isn't going to be much to debunk, really. Arguing that near-death experiences are visions of Heaven is an argument doomed to fail.
[/quote]

I suppose "debunk" was the wrong word but you get my drift. Thanks so much for the link, I'll definitely read that one!
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27-09-2015, 07:23 PM
RE: Near Death/Out of body experiences.
I “died “ once, nearly died twice in the past 13 months. Nothing, zilch, nada.
Tell him to fuck himself.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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27-09-2015, 07:34 PM
RE: Near Death/Out of body experiences.
I died, got reincarnated, and then went to the grave of my former self who believed in heaven and I danced on his grave in joy of proving him wrong.

Tell them that fucked up shit. They are stupid enough to believe it.

Tongue

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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27-09-2015, 07:59 PM (This post was last modified: 27-09-2015 08:22 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Near Death/Out of body experiences.
Why is it people who report NDEs always do so in cultural and language terms with which they have personal experience ? It's never anything totally unique. It's always something extraordinary, yet something they have some experience of. Westerners always hear Western music, and harmonics. Why is heaven ALWAYS "just as they expect" ? LMAO.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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27-09-2015, 08:18 PM
RE: Near Death/Out of body experiences.
(27-09-2015 07:34 PM)Free Wrote:  They are stupid enough to believe it.

Tongue

The irony. Weeping

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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27-09-2015, 08:20 PM
RE: Near Death/Out of body experiences.
(27-09-2015 07:59 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Why is it people who report NDEs always do so in cultural and language terms with which they have personal experience ? It's never anything totally unique. It's always something extraordinary, yet something they have some experience of. Westerners always hear Western music, and harmonics. Why heaven ALWAYS "just as they expect" ? LMAO.

It depends on their system of deeply entrenched fears and beliefs.

Whatever becomes firmly entrenched deeply in their "subconsciousness" is borne out through the fear of death as it it naturally happens. When conciousness is lost- which happens immediately- all that remains is the subconscious, and within that are the deepest beliefs, including religious, and the darkest fears.

If one deeply believes they will go to paradise, that strong belief will manifest itself. If another has a deeply scared belief in hell, he may see the devil manifested in his subconscious. Others who sorely missed loved ones who passed away will see them.

All this indicates to me that our emotional system is what causes the deepest most subconscious memories, with memories of fear, sorrow, and hope being foremost in what etches deepest into our psyche.

How can anyone become an atheist when we are all born with no beliefs in the first place? We are atheists because we were born this way.
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