New EU memeber
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30-06-2013, 11:25 AM
New EU memeber
Finally, that day is here. Dodgy Croatia is joining the European Union in a few hours. I wonder will I ever feel anything different, good or bad? Will this affect me or will things stay the same? I kinda have a feeling nothing is going to change here, EU or no EU...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accession_o...pean_Union

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-23118035

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/30...25025.html

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30-06-2013, 11:39 AM
RE: New EU memeber
(30-06-2013 11:25 AM)Filox Wrote:  Finally, that day is here. Dodgy Croatia is joining the European Union in a few hours. I wonder will I ever feel anything different, good or bad? Will this affect me or will things stay the same? I kinda have a feeling nothing is going to change here, EU or no EU...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accession_o...pean_Union

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-23118035

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/30...25025.html

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Why on earth would you willingly join that disaster? The EU is going down in flames, the Euro is most likely not going to see the next decade and all you are going to get for joining is debt payments for subsidized members.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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30-06-2013, 11:44 AM
RE: New EU memeber
I know, right! But heeeey, everybody is joining, so here we go as well...

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30-06-2013, 11:51 AM
RE: New EU memeber
Hi Croatia, welcome to the "club"

See those guys over their, they belong to the ESM, im sure you will be getting acquainted with them very soon.

Take a seat, let me take your coat... and your hat.... oh and also whats left of your democracy as you fit into binding rules and regulations.

What do you mean you just joined for trade partnerships??? I dont think so somehow.

For no matter how much I use these symbols, to describe symptoms of my existence.
You are your own emphasis.
So I say nothing.

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30-06-2013, 12:02 PM
RE: New EU memeber
(30-06-2013 11:39 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Why on earth would you willingly join that disaster? The EU is going down in flames, the Euro is most likely not going to see the next decade and all you are going to get for joining is debt payments for subsidized members.

A European customs and trade union was always a good idea. There are problems with the monetary union as implemented, but that does not make it a bad idea either.

The EU is the only way for Europeans to maintain any global relevance into the next century.

(30-06-2013 11:51 AM)bemore Wrote:  oh and also whats left of your democracy as you fit into binding rules and regulations.

Rules and regulations which are decided on by the elected European parliament, and the European council which is itself composed of delegates from the elected national governments?

Sounds... really undemocratic, there...
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30-06-2013, 12:11 PM
RE: New EU memeber
(30-06-2013 12:02 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(30-06-2013 11:39 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Why on earth would you willingly join that disaster? The EU is going down in flames, the Euro is most likely not going to see the next decade and all you are going to get for joining is debt payments for subsidized members.

A European customs and trade union was always a good idea. There are problems with the monetary union as implemented, but that does not make it a bad idea either.

The EU is the only way for Europeans to maintain any global relevance into the next century.

(30-06-2013 11:51 AM)bemore Wrote:  oh and also whats left of your democracy as you fit into binding rules and regulations.

Rules and regulations which are decided on by the elected European parliament, and the European council which is itself composed of delegates from the elected national governments?

Sounds... really undemocratic, there...

A trade union is a good idea yes but the EU is not that. It is a bulky unwieldy incredibly unpopular (to it's own members) mega bureaucracy that is currently imploding. The problem is Europe wants to maintain it's disproportional power to the rest of the world and that is not going to happen long term. The Eu is the worst of all worlds and will not survive much longer the way things are going.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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30-06-2013, 12:36 PM
RE: New EU memeber
(30-06-2013 12:11 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  A trade union is a good idea yes but the EU is not that. It is a bulky unwieldy incredibly unpopular (to it's own members) mega bureaucracy that is currently imploding. The problem is Europe wants to maintain it's disproportional power to the rest of the world and that is not going to happen long term. The Eu is the worst of all worlds and will not survive much longer the way things are going.

It's been "imploding" since, what, 2008? 2009? Seems to be holding up pretty well regardless...

Petty nationalist fearmongering has produced populations which fundamentally do not understand what it is or does. If anything will doom it, that will.
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30-06-2013, 12:40 PM
RE: New EU memeber
(30-06-2013 12:36 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(30-06-2013 12:11 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  A trade union is a good idea yes but the EU is not that. It is a bulky unwieldy incredibly unpopular (to it's own members) mega bureaucracy that is currently imploding. The problem is Europe wants to maintain it's disproportional power to the rest of the world and that is not going to happen long term. The Eu is the worst of all worlds and will not survive much longer the way things are going.

It's been "imploding" since, what, 2008? 2009? Seems to be holding up pretty well regardless...

Petty nationalist fearmongering has produced populations which fundamentally do not understand what it is or does. If anything will doom it, that will.

Rome took almost 500 years to finish imploding, and as to the nationalists I think they have the true measure of the EU. Its a fundamentally flawed Idea that can exist only during good times but whenever anything comes along and disrupts the free flow of money and trade it has no recourse.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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30-06-2013, 12:46 PM
RE: New EU memeber
(30-06-2013 12:40 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Its a fundamentally flawed Idea that can exist only during good times but whenever anything comes along and disrupts the free flow of money and trade it has no recourse.

But that simply doesn't make any sense.

Does the United States only work during good times?

I have yet to see any argument against the EU that is not just small-minded "but... but NATIONALISM! FREEDOM! um... GERMANY BAD!".
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30-06-2013, 01:01 PM
RE: New EU memeber
(30-06-2013 12:46 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(30-06-2013 12:40 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Its a fundamentally flawed Idea that can exist only during good times but whenever anything comes along and disrupts the free flow of money and trade it has no recourse.

But that simply doesn't make any sense.

Does the United States only work during good times?

I have yet to see any argument against the EU that is not just small-minded "but... but NATIONALISM! FREEDOM! um... GERMANY BAD!".

Ah you have come across the crux of the problem. No Nation is willing to Cede its Sovereignty to the EU and without absolute say in how the situation is handled you get piecemeal and ineffective response. Lets use the German demand of absolute Austerity as a perfect example.

Austerity does not work economically, it is treating a gunshot wound with a cannonball. The only member of the EU that wants to go down that proven horrible road is Germany but since the EU is not effective Germany can veto any other solution and basically take it's ball and go home.

Now a Nation of equal size to the EU (Canada or America for example) does not have this problem since it does not need to cede it's authority to a central extra-governmental power. The US responded to the crisis with a bailout and then a stimulus (not a large enough one but still better than the alternative) and has actually come out ahead of Europe because of this.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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