New Testament History revisited
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21-10-2016, 08:54 PM (This post was last modified: 21-10-2016 09:01 PM by Deltabravo.)
RE: New Testament History revisited
Bucky, the Old Testament is cooked up crap.

I just look at shit and say, "looks like shit I saw somewhere else"

You on the other hand, have made a career out of examining and trying to get us all to take an interest in it.

My "big idea" Bucky, is that morality is derived from reason and that , oddly, Christianity has a moral basis. Beyond that, I have very little interest in religion.

I suppose this forum is about people "supporting" each other in their exit from religion, their deconversion. Is that right?

So, tell us, please, what is your experience of being raised in Christianity? Did you go to Sunday School? Did you learn about Jesus riding into Jerusalem on a donkey and children watching him from up a tree? What did you think the first time you had the Sermon on the Mount read to you? What was your reaction to the crucifixion and the resurrection? What was your view about the miracles? What were you told and what did you think about the Three Kings who visited Jesus' birth?
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21-10-2016, 09:17 PM
RE: New Testament History revisited
I assume that the reason I get such a reaction here is that by drawing comparisons between the "hallmarks" of Jesus' Jewishness, it shows up how "un-Jewish" he was. lol

Combine this with a historian at the time or thereabouts of Jesus, ie., Josephus, saying that the Jews came from Armenia, ie., the area of Sanliurfa in Turkey, and that they left Egypt and set up in Herusalem...this causes a real problem for Jewish history and politics, because now the trend seems to be to say that Jews always lived in Judea. Well, yes, that's probably right, because when the Armenians invaded Egypt, they didn't move their entire population there, nor were they goat-herds. The Old Testament is about a feudal monarchical line of pedaristic, mysogynistic, phallus worshipping thugs who drifted around the Near East terrorizing people until their much hated civilization collapsed and they fell under Roman governance. Rome, then fell under the equally unpleasant Roman "god-Emperorrs", the Claudians. They also collapsed under Nero leaving a vacuum of power and a quick succession of Emperors resulting in Vespasian becoming the Emperor after defeating the "Jews". Presumably this was an important feat. ???

Of course, these are historical questions. This either happened or it didn't. There's no reason to get het up about it unless you see it as part of a national narrative, which I don't. I am happy to throw ideas around about ancient times and they don't affect me. I don't rely on for my own sense of self-worth on attachment to a national group who have to justify their existence by reference to being desended from God. Nor do I equate my religion with my ethnicity. Nor do I care about my ethnicity because, frankly, after Brexit, as far as I am concerned 52% of my "people" have shown they are racists and morons.
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21-10-2016, 10:34 PM
RE: New Testament History revisited
(21-10-2016 09:17 PM)Deltabravo Wrote:  I assume that the reason I get such a reaction here is that by drawing comparisons between the "hallmarks" of Jesus' Jewishness, it shows up how "un-Jewish" he was. lol

Wrong. your stupidity causes a problem for no one, as you never provide any references.

Quote:Combine this with a historian at the time or thereabouts of Jesus, ie., Josephus, saying that the Jews came from Armenia, ie., the area of Sanliurfa in Turkey, and that they left Egypt and set up in Herusalem...this causes a real problem for Jewish history and politics, because now the trend seems to be to say that Jews always lived in Judea.

Josephus simply repeated the entire, now debunked by archaeology, history of the Hebrews, as outlined in the OT. He is totally unreliable with respect to origins. He had no way to verify anything. Maybe some day, you'll actually take a class, or something.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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21-10-2016, 10:37 PM
RE: New Testament History revisited
(21-10-2016 08:54 PM)Deltabravo Wrote:  Bucky, the Old Testament is cooked up crap.

I just look at shit and say, "looks like shit I saw somewhere else"

You on the other hand, have made a career out of examining and trying to get us all to take an interest in it.

My "big idea" Bucky, is that morality is derived from reason and that , oddly, Christianity has a moral basis. Beyond that, I have very little interest in religion.

I suppose this forum is about people "supporting" each other in their exit from religion, their deconversion. Is that right?

So, tell us, please, what is your experience of being raised in Christianity? Did you go to Sunday School? Did you learn about Jesus riding into Jerusalem on a donkey and children watching him from up a tree? What did you think the first time you had the Sermon on the Mount read to you? What was your reaction to the crucifixion and the resurrection? What was your view about the miracles? What were you told and what did you think about the Three Kings who visited Jesus' birth?

I know what the OT is, and what it is not. The ignorant likes of you is in no position to tell me anything, about anything. No one cares what your fictional position on anything is. It's based on nothing but your insane dot-connecting, ignorant, rambling chain of consciousness.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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21-10-2016, 10:52 PM
RE: New Testament History revisited
Still no citations. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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22-10-2016, 04:51 AM (This post was last modified: 22-10-2016 04:54 AM by Deltabravo.)
RE: New Testament History revisited
Chas, you poor man.

You obviously have a science background. Moral, political and social discourse is not limited by what is in peer reviewed works. We have something called "free speech" and "freedom of conscience".

It works like this. If a person reads a book like the New Testament, and wants to comment on the incongruity of Jesus walking on water, healing the sick, raising the dead and being resurrected with the Old Testament and its description of Judaism, as essentially a long trail of barbaric, feudal, mysogynistic, pederasts then one is entitled to ask these questions. If these people were waiting for a messiah, one might think that a peace preacher like Jesus would be the last thing they expected. No?

I mean, seriously, guy. Have you done LSD or something?

You seem to think that discussion in Humanities and Social Sciences faculties involves citing peer reviewed works. It's not physics, man. It's open season in any liberal arts course and in life, to say whatever you like, openly and freely. You appear to me to have such a limited and narrow view of academic discourse that you only say something which is backed by a peer reviewed work.

The problem with that is that up until recently, all discourse in liberal arts fields has been dominated by religious thinkers, even in areas outside religion. I don't know if you noticed this.

What are you thinking? That we as atheists should restrict ourselves in the way we look at the world and at religions because the planet has been gripped by religious thinking even up to the present time?

What you have done is to limit what you can post here to short, as you say, "terse", comments. I can't find any posts of yours where you actually express anything interesting. Ok, yees, Chas, we get the point that we don't need book about religion to know what is right or wrong. It's good you figured that one out. You trot it out often enough. Beyond that.... ??? Anything to add? Got anything interesting to discuss?

Hey, at least I get a reaction. I know you don't understand word one of what I am saying but it would be nice to see something of substance from you other than your "trolling" and flaming of me.
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22-10-2016, 04:58 AM
RE: New Testament History revisited
I mean, seriously, this is what is so appalling about debate between people with religion, particularly those who are embedded in it because they see themselves as "ethnically" Jewish or Muslim.

I just made the point that Jews don't accept Jesus as their messiah. Nor do Muslims although they have a different version of him, "returning to slay the false messiah at the gates of Lyda".

Ask yourselves this. Why not? Because Judaism wasn't peaceful, nor is Islam. The NT Jesus is not of their religion or their god.
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22-10-2016, 11:55 AM
RE: New Testament History revisited
(22-10-2016 04:58 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  I mean, seriously, this is what is so appalling about debate between people with religion, particularly those who are embedded in it because they see themselves as "ethnically" Jewish or Muslim.

I just made the point that Jews don't accept Jesus as their messiah. Nor do Muslims although they have a different version of him, "returning to slay the false messiah at the gates of Lyda".

Ask yourselves this. Why not? Because Judaism wasn't peaceful, nor is Islam. The NT Jesus is not of their religion or their god.

Sorry dumbass. Since you actually know no history, that's probably what you might cook up. In fact Judaism changed radically over time. Of course you know nothing about that culture, as you never studied it, AT ALL. Thus you are free, in the absence of ANY knowledge, to cook up ANYTHING you ignorant mind conjures up. Actually the teachings of Jesus, fit in PERFECTLY with Rabbinic Judaism, at a very precise point. What that is, you will never know. You are an ignorant fool, and a sad little maker of fictitious tales.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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23-10-2016, 11:41 AM
RE: New Testament History revisited
(22-10-2016 11:55 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(22-10-2016 04:58 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  I mean, seriously, this is what is so appalling about debate between people with religion, particularly those who are embedded in it because they see themselves as "ethnically" Jewish or Muslim.

I just made the point that Jews don't accept Jesus as their messiah. Nor do Muslims although they have a different version of him, "returning to slay the false messiah at the gates of Lyda".

Ask yourselves this. Why not? Because Judaism wasn't peaceful, nor is Islam. The NT Jesus is not of their religion or their god.

Sorry dumbass. Since you actually know no history, that's probably what you might cook up. In fact Judaism changed radically over time. Of course you know nothing about that culture, as you never studied it, AT ALL. Thus you are free, in the absence of ANY knowledge, to cook up ANYTHING you ignorant mind conjures up. Actually the teachings of Jesus, fit in PERFECTLY with Rabbinic Judaism, at a very precise point. What that is, you will never know. You are an ignorant fool, and a sad little maker of fictitious tales.

Get a life.
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23-10-2016, 11:45 AM
RE: New Testament History revisited
(21-10-2016 10:52 PM)Chas Wrote:  Still no citations. Drinking Beverage

What do you call a blind deer?

No eye deer?

What do you call a blind deer which has been run over by a car:

Still no eye deer?
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