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No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
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09-08-2014, 02:43 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(09-08-2014 02:22 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  You can be jailed for selling heroin to someone who wants it.
Ain't freedom grand?

So we should tear down the system of law and order and replace it with no law and no order and we will be freeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

You do realise that under the current system if you find a law to be unjust you can actually challenge *that specific law*? It might be a long, costly process, but it's a hell of a lot cheaper than deconstructing society, which if you've been following the thread, is apparently the cure-all pill.

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If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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09-08-2014, 03:26 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
Just like to add that the system you're complaining about, the one that "limits" your freedom, is the very system that protects your freedom.
It's what stops me from stabbing you without consequence, or stealing your property, or shoving a cactus so far up your ass it comes out your mouth.

Just might want to think about things a little more is all I'm sayin'.

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09-08-2014, 03:36 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
Libertarians are like cats, completely dependant on others for survival yet convinced of their own independance.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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09-08-2014, 03:41 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(09-08-2014 03:36 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Libertarians are like cats, completely dependant on others for survival yet convinced of their own independance.

I think your analogy is an insult to cats... Cats can do pretty well for themselves if they have to - they just prefer to have staff...

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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09-08-2014, 04:02 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(08-08-2014 05:47 PM)Cardinal Smurf Wrote:  I see. Well you know yourself better than I do. It sounds like you already know what travel does to you. And you're right, I'm forgetting all the other people I've seen in the world who do not travel well. They bring their baggage with them so to speak.

Maybe it's because when I travel I seem to see the other people around me in a similar way as an anthropologist. When I went to Japan the first time it was like this tremendous influx of new information. I drank it in like I was starving. Maybe my circumstances allowed me to do that. Maybe my upbringing. Who knows.
Well, it seems to me like lots of curiosities. I know Japan has many different customs and social standards - some anime is culturally very educative, you know Yes I love novelty and different cultures and I commend you on your curiosity and tolerance and maybe a lovely case of xenophilia (a compliment coming from an avid sci-fi reader). But I see these as entertainment that doesn't solve my problems.
I am interested in what is the same for all people, both for good and bad. I am interested in what makes us real persons. Which is, suprise surprise, love and all the countless and formidable related phenomena. Love is a mystery, because there is nothing to analyze, nothing to figure out. I respect reason greatly, but I am awed by things that are even greater than that.

(08-08-2014 05:47 PM)Cardinal Smurf Wrote:  Sounds like you may be in a rather dark place in your mind. I've been in places I would also describe as dark when I was much younger. But it sounds like maybe my idea of darkness and yours may not be the same. Who knows?
I don't know, but my darkness seems to be known to therapists for many decades but parents are still oblivious of it. Oblivious, because their conscience is dirty.
There is a such thing as emotional deprivation disorder. It is a society-wide condition that feeds on itself and copies itself across generations. Parents who received little love (grew up near WW1 or WW2) do not give enough love to next generation and what makes it worse, they use some very dirty tactics to cover it up. This puts the success of welfare-warfare state into an interesting perspective.

(08-08-2014 05:47 PM)Cardinal Smurf Wrote:  I guess the best path is to keep learning. Hope I can help in some small way. Feel free to ask me questions if you have any.
I do have questions, but they're better asked via PM.
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09-08-2014, 04:12 PM (This post was last modified: 09-08-2014 04:19 PM by Luminon.)
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(09-08-2014 02:22 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  You can be jailed for selling heroin to someone who wants it.
Ain't freedom grand?
Drugs are not banned because they are dangerous. They are not, to healthy people in a healthy environment. Drugs aren't a magic silver bullet that gets you addicted at a first hit. Your life has to be significantly shitty and empty and your brain chemistry significantly damaged for drugs to take root. (if Christianity doesn't get you first, it'll get you second)
http://sub.garrytan.com/its-not-the-morp...-addiction

The government knows very well that war on drugs is the same thing as alcohol prohibition - a gold mine for anyone who is brave and strong enough to take it, that is, drug mafia. Drug mafia gets its fairy tale profits and government gets to stuff prisons, increase police ranks and tax and print heaps of money to pay for both. It's a win/win for both, but war against people.
Government isn't THAT stupid, to do the same thing for decades yet see the drug trade ever rising. The only answer is, government wants drugs, wants war on drugs and wants poor people to take drugs. The drug addiction must be seen and treated as an illness, it is not an immoral thing.
I have read a book by Hans Adam II von Liechtenstein and he literally proposed that the state provides drugs to addicts for free, in centers with clean needles and offers of therapy. He claimed a lot of benefits for this policy. (see his book The State in the Third Millenium)



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09-08-2014, 07:11 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(09-08-2014 04:12 PM)Luminon Wrote:  
(09-08-2014 02:22 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  You can be jailed for selling heroin to someone who wants it.
Ain't freedom grand?
Drugs are not banned because they are dangerous. They are not, to healthy people in a healthy environment. Drugs aren't a magic silver bullet that gets you addicted at a first hit. Your life has to be significantly shitty and empty and your brain chemistry significantly damaged for drugs to take root. (if Christianity doesn't get you first, it'll get you second)
http://sub.garrytan.com/its-not-the-morp...-addiction

Sorry, not true. Opiate addiction is very real and happens to healthy people. This has been well-studied in medical settings.
Prolonged use of opiates for pain management will often result in addiction.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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09-08-2014, 09:19 PM (This post was last modified: 09-08-2014 09:59 PM by Drunkin Druid.)
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(09-08-2014 02:43 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(09-08-2014 02:22 PM)Drunkin Druid Wrote:  You can be jailed for selling heroin to someone who wants it.
Ain't freedom grand?

So we should tear down the system of law and order and replace it with no law and no order and we will be freeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

You do realise that under the current system if you find a law to be unjust you can actually challenge *that specific law*? It might be a long, costly process, but it's a hell of a lot cheaper than deconstructing society, which if you've been following the thread, is apparently the cure-all pill.

Hmmm. Is that what I said? It doesn't look like that's what I said. I'm not sure what you are reading but I don't think you read anything I said.
I can't help but wonder how my advocacy for drug legalization translates into me supporting lawlessness. Perhaps you can explain it to me?
You see the choices are not 'keep drugs illegal' or 'completely destroy law and order.' The world isn't so black and white or simplistic.
I fully realize what it might take to change laws and I personally said nothing about deconstructing society. So I will simply ask; wtf are you talking about?
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09-08-2014, 09:40 PM (This post was last modified: 09-08-2014 09:44 PM by Drunkin Druid.)
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(09-08-2014 07:11 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(09-08-2014 04:12 PM)Luminon Wrote:  Drugs are not banned because they are dangerous. They are not, to healthy people in a healthy environment. Drugs aren't a magic silver bullet that gets you addicted at a first hit. Your life has to be significantly shitty and empty and your brain chemistry significantly damaged for drugs to take root. (if Christianity doesn't get you first, it'll get you second)
http://sub.garrytan.com/its-not-the-morp...-addiction

Sorry, not true. Opiate addiction is very real and happens to healthy people. This has been well-studied in medical settings.
Prolonged use of opiates for pain management will often result in addiction.

Both irrelevant. Why does it matter how addictive shit is. If someone is dumb enough to continue to do the heavy shit that's their problem.
If I want to shoot myself shouldn't that be my right? If I want to kill myself slowly shouldn't that also be my right. My life. My body. My choice.
As I said I don't support all(perhaps not eve most, I dunno) libertarian ideas but this is one where I have made up my mind and it's doubtful I will change it.
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09-08-2014, 10:34 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
I'm just glad the group in this thread wasn't the group writing the U.S. Constitution...or any constitutions for that matter. Imagine if the conversations over that were anything like this....haha...ohh anyways, don't mind me.

I prefer fantasy, but I have to live in reality.
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