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No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
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31-07-2014, 04:50 PM (This post was last modified: 31-07-2014 04:58 PM by Luminon.)
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(31-07-2014 04:42 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Wow, what a load of shit. You are just a horrible person. Do yourself a favor and drop this political cult you are in it really has taken you down a bad road.
Drop this religious cult called atheism and I might consider it Cool
Hint: if anarchism is a political cult, then abstinence is a sex position, off is a TV channel, bald is a hair color, nudity is a costume and outer space is a planet. Rings any bells?
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31-07-2014, 05:00 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  Yep. The problem is, nobody has any principles. Nobody even knows what principles are. Except very few people.
There are the first principles of Aristotle, which are absolutely impossible to deny, because by expressing a denial, you already using them, so you disprove that statement.

Then there is morality and human rights derived from the first principles. The first principles are undeniable, and so are these human rights.
For example, the right of ownership. Try arguing against ownership and you will fail, because you own your words. Your words are attributed to you, that is universally accepted knowledge and you use these words to disprove ownership. That does not compute.
Nobody has any principles...eh?
"Right" of ownership doesn't exist unless there is an order in place to grant that right.
Mislabeling what is (such as speech) as personal ownership is silly. Under that is the water vapor that I exhale also owned by me? I don't think ownership really applies to anything that is not physically possible to give away.

Off topic, Do you by any chance believe humans are not animals?

off topic again, I don't know why, but you sort of seem like the villain in a story who thinks the world is crap and resorts to drastic measures (starting a war, world domination, serial killing) to show that your brand of justice/thinking/principles are in fact the true and only ones.

I prefer fantasy, but I have to live in reality.
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31-07-2014, 05:08 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(31-07-2014 04:50 PM)Luminon Wrote:  
(31-07-2014 04:42 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Wow, what a load of shit. You are just a horrible person. Do yourself a favor and drop this political cult you are in it really has taken you down a bad road.
Drop this religious cult called atheism and I might consider it Cool
Hint: if anarchism is a political cult, then abstinence is a sex position, off is a TV channel, bald is a hair color, nudity is a costume and outer space is a planet. Rings any bells?

The fact that you think your deranged political theory is the null hypothesis (protip it isn't) just shows how far down this road you have gone. But really man you are advocating murdering people who disagree with you.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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31-07-2014, 05:09 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(31-07-2014 03:39 PM)cjlr Wrote:  ...
a polite, cogent criticism.

Oh yeah. Sorry! I was forgetting the first principles of atheism:
Rudeness, Vagueness, Sycophancy.

I humbly apologise.

Blush

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31-07-2014, 05:19 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  As for guns...meh. That is not necessary. America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense - and all the cops went fully paramilitary anyway.

Shoot people who disagree with you.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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31-07-2014, 05:33 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(31-07-2014 05:00 PM)Adrianime Wrote:  Nobody has any principles...eh?
"Right" of ownership doesn't exist unless there is an order in place to grant that right.
Mislabeling what is (such as speech) as personal ownership is silly. Under that is the water vapor that I exhale also owned by me? I don't think ownership really applies to anything that is not physically possible to give away.
This kind of stuff requires training in philosophy. It is like arguing against Christianity for the first time, you just can't get it right. I'm sorry this will sound dismissive to you.
You are still speaking and I still know it is you speaking. I accept your ownership of your words. So does this forum system. Water vapor is not speech, but you can make an empirical effort to claim it, with speech it is automatic. "Silly" is not an argument. I don't understand the last sentence though, it has too many negatives in it. But it contains no argument, so it's all right. What you or I think is not an argument.

(31-07-2014 05:00 PM)Adrianime Wrote:  Off topic, Do you by any chance believe humans are not animals?
This is a taxonomical question. Humans are taxonomically animals. However, humans are not morally animals, our moral responsibility is much greater. Humans have an enormous amount of brain capacity and it is our moral duty to guard and fill this capacity with philosophy, rationality, logic and empiricism, which are the basis of morality, virtue and happiness.
In practice, it means the painful effort to get rid of mental viruses of culture, politics, religion, false virtue, and a great deal of pain and denial that almost all of us suffer as a result of living in an irrational society. Consequently, it is much easier to rear children. Society can't be reformed from above. People are not stupid, but they are full of pain and they are geniuses at avoiding pain. All it takes is misinterpreting one guy's internet arguments and they avoid lots of pain.

(31-07-2014 05:00 PM)Adrianime Wrote:  off topic again, I don't know why, but you sort of seem like the villain in a story who thinks the world is crap and results to drastic measures (starting a war, world domination, serial killing) to show that your brand of justice/thinking/principles are in fact the true and only ones.
You mean Heath Ledger's Joker? Consider A great many people are unsettled and threatened by anything that is outside of culture, regardless if villainous our virtuous. People brought Socrates in front of a kangaroo court and condemned him to death. Socrates was definitely a troublemaker, a gadfly of Athens. He challenged the moral standards and justifications that rulers used to exercise their power. So they had him killed. Today I am lucky that philosophers are no longer killed. They get a few frowns from arses like Cjlr or Rev.

There is no "my principles", there are THE first principles which are derived from universal properties of observable matter. Killing can not be moral by any standard, because it is absolutely impossible to objectively justify who should be proactively killed and why. However, "not killing" is universal, we can all not kill simultaneously, defense is all right too, it's reactive, not proactive.

I am an advocate of non-aggression, defense allowed. My argument stands on the fact, that the state is the greatest source of aggression in history and not necessary to deter criminality.
We will not remove violence by overthrowing the state, because the state is in our minds, in a sense, most of us need it, like crippled people need wheelchair. We have to raise children peacefully without spanking and yelling and other forms of coercion and neglect. This is my advocated method of social revolution. Even if that takes not putting the child into government schools, which are very abusive too. Nobody has the power to overthrow the state violently and nobody should try. Instead, let's learn the philosophy and first principles, let's talk and learn and let's be devoted to children. The government does not care about children, if it did, there would be no national debts.
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31-07-2014, 05:36 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(31-07-2014 05:19 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  As for guns...meh. That is not necessary. America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense - and all the cops went fully paramilitary anyway.

Shoot people who disagree with you.

Yes, but they aren't Enlightened Supermen™, so they're clearly no loss.

It's a regular gag train when someone has that little self-awareness, all right.

... this is my signature!
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31-07-2014, 05:39 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
(31-07-2014 05:36 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(31-07-2014 05:19 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Shoot people who disagree with you.

Yes, but they aren't Enlightened Supermen™, so they're clearly no loss.

It's a regular gag train when someone has that little self-awareness, all right.

Boy takes intro to philosophy 101 and thinks he knows the secrets to the universe and is that mind numbingly unself-aware.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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31-07-2014, 05:41 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
Not even 12hours and it's up to page 8.
Anyone care to give me a brief summary or should I just bitch to Lummy that he's an idiot because I'm assuming that that is the general tone of the thread.
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31-07-2014, 05:42 PM
RE: No wing: political equivalent to atheism?
*sigh*

All I can really gather is that you are incredibly full of yourself. I hope that doesn't backfire for you. Some people can make it work. Good luck.

I prefer fantasy, but I have to live in reality.
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