Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
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29-04-2010, 06:31 PM
 
RE: Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
(29-04-2010 05:22 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(29-04-2010 04:47 PM)martinb59 Wrote:  As to where the water went, this should be easy for critical thinkers, but let me help. Mean height above sea level is 2250 feet, mean depth of ocean is 12480 feet, "

* abundance of water on Earth’s surface (in ocean (Earth feature))...the elevated land could be hidden under the oceans and the Earth reduced to a smooth sphere that would be completely covered by a continuous layer of seawater 2,686 metres deep.

While this is true, the highest point on earth is over eight thousand meters above sea level. As you are measuring against the mean, this would leave quite a bit of Earth's surface above water, and does nothing to support the evidence of a flood.

Quote:I guess that answers the water question.

Except that the volume you suggest isn't nearly enough to cover the entire Earth.

Quote:The problem is with 2 minutes of searching you could have found the answer yourself. I knew of it before because I heard it, but it took a matter of minutes to find the answer IF YOU ARE TRULY LOOKING! So show me your sources that here is not enough water and we can compare sources.

Okay. Here are my calculations.

Start with the oceans already in place. We have to cover the rest of the Earth in water, so we have to have a body of water with a depth of 8,848 meters (the height of Mount Everest). So to find the volume of water required to cover the Earth in an ocean 8,848m deep, we take 8,848 and multiply it by the surface area of the Earth: 510,072,000 kilometers. 8,848 meters equals 8.848 kilometers, so our final result is 4,513,117,056 cubic kilometers of water.

So now we know how much we need. Now we need to look at how much we have, so here's a list. Here, we have 29,492,000 cubic kilometers from ice, 6,733,000 from groundwater, 74,000 from soil moisture, and 14,000 from wator vapor in the atmosphere. We don't use the amount from the oceans, lakes and rivers because they are already part of the water "bubble".
It all totals up to... 36,313,000 cubic kilometers of water, well short of our target figure of 4,513,117,056. There simply is not enough water on Earth to cover the entire surface.

So now what, martin?

Shows me you can copy and paste from Dawkin's probably, so what? As I am sure you done any research yourself into the depths of the oceans, you are relying on others.

How about I copy and paste from Britannica. Mean height of the land above sea level 2250 ft. mean depths of the oceans 12480 feet. Area of land 55,000,000 sq. m. 28.6% of the surface, area of oceans at 137,200,000 sq. m. 71.4% of the surface. Volume of land above sea level 23,450,00 cub. m. Volume of water below sea level 323,800,000. the elevated land could be hidden under the oceans and the Earth reduced to a smooth sphere that would be completely covered by a continuous layer of seawater 8812 feet deep. This is known as the sphere depth of the oceans and serves to underscore the abundance of water on the Earth’s surface.

So now what Unbeliever?
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29-04-2010, 07:00 PM
RE: Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
(29-04-2010 06:31 PM)martinb59 Wrote:  Shows me you can copy and paste from Dawkin's probably, so what?

No, I didn't. I did the calculations myself, thank you very much. Care to provide the numbers that refute them? If you can find any, that is.

Quote:As I am sure you done any research yourself into the depths of the oceans, you are relying on others.

The depth of the ocean does not enter into it. If you had bothered to actually read my post, you would know that.
Even if either of the things you said were true, it wouldn't make my argument any less valid. It is plain fact that there is not enough water on Earth to cover the entire surface of the world.

Quote:How about I copy and paste from Britannica. Mean height of the land above sea level 2250 ft. mean depths of the oceans 12480 feet. Area of land 55,000,000 sq. m. 28.6% of the surface, area of oceans at 137,200,000 sq. m. 71.4% of the surface. Volume of land above sea level 23,450,00 cub. m. Volume of water below sea level 323,800,000.

None of which matters in the slightest.

Quote:the elevated land could be hidden under the oceans and the Earth reduced to a smooth sphere that would be completely covered by a continuous layer of seawater 8812 feet deep.

So your argument is that every protrusion on the Earth's crust was flattened to the point where it was less than 8,812 feet above sea level? Why, then, is there absolutely no evidence of this, and how is it physically possible?

Quote:This is known as the sphere depth of the oceans and serves to underscore the abundance of water on the Earth’s surface.

I'm assuming that you don't actually have access to Britannica Online, as you simply copy-pasted this from the search page results. If you had actually bothered to do the research instead of attempting to lie your way through the debate, you would know what the sphere depth actually is.
The sphere depth of the ocean is defined as the depth that the ocean would be if the entire crust of the Earth was entirely smooth and of uniform depth around the mantle - in other words, if Earth were a perfect sphere with an outer shell of water with the same total volume of the oceans. Guess how much it has to do with this subject, given that the Earth is not uniformly smooth and dense.
That's right. Zilch.

"Sometimes it is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness."
- Terry Pratchett
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29-04-2010, 07:07 PM
 
RE: Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
(29-04-2010 07:00 PM)Unbeliever Wrote:  
(29-04-2010 06:31 PM)martinb59 Wrote:  Shows me you can copy and paste from Dawkin's probably, so what?

No, I didn't. I did the calculations myself, thank you very much. Care to provide the numbers that refute them? If you can find any, that is.

Quote:As I am sure you done any research yourself into the depths of the oceans, you are relying on others.

The depth of the ocean does not enter into it. If you had bothered to actually read my post, you would know that.
Even if either of the things you said were true, it wouldn't make my argument any less valid. It is plain fact that there is not enough water on Earth to cover the entire surface of the world.

Quote:How about I copy and paste from Britannica. Mean height of the land above sea level 2250 ft. mean depths of the oceans 12480 feet. Area of land 55,000,000 sq. m. 28.6% of the surface, area of oceans at 137,200,000 sq. m. 71.4% of the surface. Volume of land above sea level 23,450,00 cub. m. Volume of water below sea level 323,800,000.

None of which matters in the slightest.

Quote:the elevated land could be hidden under the oceans and the Earth reduced to a smooth sphere that would be completely covered by a continuous layer of seawater 8812 feet deep.

So your argument is that every protrusion on the Earth's crust was flattened to the point where it was less than 8,812 feet above sea level? Why, then, is there absolutely no evidence of this, and how is it physically possible?

Quote:This is known as the sphere depth of the oceans and serves to underscore the abundance of water on the Earth’s surface.

I'm assuming that you don't actually have access to Britannica Online, as you simply copy-pasted this from the search page results. If you had actually bothered to do the research instead of attempting to lie your way through the debate, you would know what the sphere depth actually is.
The sphere depth of the ocean is defined as the depth that the ocean would be if the entire crust of the Earth was entirely smooth and of uniform depth around the mantle - in other words, if Earth were a perfect sphere with an outer shell of water with the same total volume of the oceans. Guess how much it has to do with this subject, given that the Earth is not uniformly smooth and dense.
That's right. Zilch.
I understood that
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29-04-2010, 07:08 PM
RE: Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
...Okay...?

"Sometimes it is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness."
- Terry Pratchett
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29-04-2010, 07:36 PM
 
RE: Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
There's other issues with the flood story as well.

==> http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-noahs-ark.html

Unbeliever already calculated it...it would take 3 times the water that the Earth currently has to evenly deluge the world, covering everything, including Mt. Everest.

==> http://www.epicidiot.com/evo_cre/noahs_f...much_water

One of the things I found interesting in the videos I put in the original post was that, if the surface were completely submerged in water, the atmosphere itself would become so dense with water vapour, a human would, in essence, drown while breathing.

Or, did the bible fail to mention that god 'raised sheilds' around the ark, and Noah had his own self-sufficient life support system on the ship, complete with holodeck, phasers, and 10-forward? Was Guinan part of the crew? Tongue
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29-04-2010, 07:53 PM
 
RE: Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
Holodeck for the win!

Incidentally, I still have absolutely no idea what point Martin is trying to make here. Would anyone mind explaining it to me?

Hey everyone! I found the ark! I'm going to be so famous!

http://www.ascendantjustice.com/files/vo.../ark01.jpg

Oh darn, well, since I can't display the pictures I took, which verify the image itself, I'll just have to show you some drawings of it. And of course I am not making a crude jest at a recent 'discovery'.

http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Installation_00
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29-04-2010, 11:07 PM
 
RE: Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
(29-04-2010 07:36 PM)supermanlives1973 Wrote:  There's other issues with the flood story as well.

==> http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-noahs-ark.html

Unbeliever already calculated it...it would take 3 times the water that the Earth currently has to evenly deluge the world, covering everything, including Mt. Everest.

==> http://www.epicidiot.com/evo_cre/noahs_f...much_water

One of the things I found interesting in the videos I put in the original post was that, if the surface were completely submerged in water, the atmosphere itself would become so dense with water vapour, a human would, in essence, drown while breathing.

Or, did the bible fail to mention that god 'raised sheilds' around the ark, and Noah had his own self-sufficient life support system on the ship, complete with holodeck, phasers, and 10-forward? Was Guinan part of the crew? Tongue

Hello Super...The flood does not need to cover the Mt. Everest!
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30-04-2010, 05:00 AM
 
RE: Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
Genesis 7:19-20

19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. 20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than twenty feet.

Yes, it does.
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30-04-2010, 06:29 AM
 
RE: Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
I'll be honest here while this type of argument is fun, and I do enjoy reading it, it's flawed from inception. On one hand you have a God just deciding to make a flood to cover the whole earth wiping out "everyone"(BTW), and repopulating starting with only Noah's family 5000 years ago. On the other hand you have scientific evidence which at its very core would say this is not possible! However that's the whole point right?! Its NOT POSSIBLE that's why God had to make it happen. It's cyclical, no? If this God is there whether he be God or Alien then he could make it happen and present whatever evidece he would care to. Most of us choose do dimiss that very premise so you can go no further. Sorry if this kind of stuff has trown out before, I'm new here.Wink
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30-04-2010, 06:41 AM
RE: Noah's Ark - The REAL Story
(30-04-2010 06:29 AM)Dregs Wrote:  I'll be honest here while this type of argument is fun, and I do enjoy reading it, it's flawed from inception. On one hand you have a God just deciding to make a flood to cover the whole earth wiping out "everyone"(BTW), and repopulating starting with only Noah's family 5000 years ago. On the other hand you have scientific evidence which at its very core would say this is not possible! However that's the whole point right?! Its NOT POSSIBLE that's why God had to make it happen. It's cyclical, no? If this God is there whether he be God or Alien then he could make it happen and present whatever evidece he would care to. Most of us choose do dimiss that very premise so you can go no further. Sorry if this kind of stuff has trown out before, I'm new here.Wink

That makes sense... but if god wanted to teach humanity a lesson that it'll never forget to obey its creator, why would he leave no evidence of his punitive measure but the writings in a book whose authenticity and veracity has been disputed? It's illogical.

All learning is quite useless if you haven't learned to question what you learn.
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