Non-Issues we talk so much about
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14-07-2011, 06:00 PM
Non-Issues we talk so much about

We talk a lot about religion, atheism, sex, abortion, euthanasia, race, gender, etc., etc.

I understand how these topics are real and important to a lot of people.

What I don’t understand is how it is possible to say so many things about these topics.

For a sane species, none of them would be an issue.

For an insane species, such as ours, no amount of talk would make them real.

The answers are so simple, that each topic could be summarized with a very small paragraph.

Religion: We can invent all kinds of stories and myths and fantasies, but nothing will make them real. We know what we know by observation, repeatable experiments, logical deductions, predictions and further experiments. It is true now and it was true in the caveman's time. Everything else is delusion, wishful thinking, metaphor, fantasy. There is no proof that some of it could not be true but there is no physical evidence suggesting reality. God and the wood nymph are of equal validity for an objective, non-delusional mind.

All the other non-issues can be dealt with in a rational, objective way, leaving raw emotions out of it.

Life is so simple that it boggles the mind how people over-complicate it.

We need to produce what we need, we need to distribute it and then we will consume it for healthy physical and mental survival. There is no need to create and invent boogie men and straw men and self-defeating fantasies.

Why can’t we ‘just’ live, instead of tying ourselves into knots and drown in self-created complications? Why can’t we just leave each other alone, as long as nobody gets hurt, why do we care what each of us think and do?

It has always been beyond me.

Maybe someone can explain.

Do I think it will change in my lifetime?

Not a chance.

So what am I doing here?

As my favourite TV character, ALF said: “Nothing, just screaming!”.
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16-07-2011, 05:54 PM
RE: Non-Issues we talk so much about
I completely agree. I have never understood why people make such a big deal out of sex. The way I see it, it's a fun thing to do with people you've known for a while, and as long as you use more than one form of protection you're good. (This is from a young virgin's standpoint, so don't laugh at me).

It all ties in with religion. Sex/abortion/euthanasia- it's all "God says it's wrong." (I'm aware there are non religious people out there who are pro-life/pro-waiting-till-marriage/whatever, but the majority are religious). Gender/race is also loosely tied to the Bible, I think, though some of it is probably basic human nature too.

I would like to just live and not mess with what other people are doing. I will probably have to endure some people disapproving of me or my viewpoints, but I'm not going to get in a big fight with them. I don't really care if people hate me for being an atheist/whore/baby-killer.

What a nice world we would have if these subjects weren't so overrated.
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16-07-2011, 06:53 PM
RE: Non-Issues we talk so much about
Maybe it all boils down to emotions. When we are emotional, sometimes we are unable to make rational decisions or thoughts. We then turn to any means, rational or rational, to restore our emotional equilibrium. Well, there's where religion comes in! COME ON YE HEATHENS, FOR WHOMEVER PRAISETH THY HOLY MEATBALL SHALL BE GRANTED AN ETERNITY OF CHEESE AND MILK. ALSO THE HOLY MEATBALL WILL SAVE YOU FROM ANYTHING! TRUST ME, 100% GUARANTEED. The false hope associated with religion may be the attracting factor, such that people have something to rely on, even though it's just an illusion. But such an illusion is so powerful, people merge it with reality, and that is really dangerous. We have the want to be on the winning side, and for instance, I HAVE ALL MY FRIENDS WHO BELIEVE IN THE WINTER GHOST or I HAVE THE INVISBLE SUPER HYPER ULTRA MEGAHOLYBOT WITH ME, such mentalities, group or individual provides "support", to mold the world to what these people want. This applies to the other subjects you mentioned, and note how arguments for let's say animal rights and abortion usually boil down to appealing to emotions.

Here I live, the government makes protesting illegal, and you have to register to protest at a certain place, so I don't really see any nuts here Big Grin

You know, if people stop debating about such things or forming their own self righteous groups, the world would have flying cars and we would already have powered the world with fission. Also, commercial space travel for all at a low rate! See how such debate hampered research? Dodgy

Welcome to science. You're gonna like it here - Phil Plait

Have you ever tried taking a comfort blanket away from a small child? - DLJ
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16-07-2011, 07:50 PM
RE: Non-Issues we talk so much about
(14-07-2011 06:00 PM)Zatamon Wrote:  Do I think it will change in my lifetime?

Not a chance.

Chin up chap. Look how many enlightened teenagers are here. We are evolving rapidly now. The Times They Are a-Changing.

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17-07-2011, 09:36 AM
RE: Non-Issues we talk so much about
I think I should clarify the OP.

The reason I put the thread into Philosophy is because the topic is completely non-practical, as Philosophy usually is. It was mostly just venting.

I made the statement from the perspective of a very big picture: one species dominating one planet. The way astronauts see it: “You can’t see the borders!” (imagine that).

Even though it is non-practical on one level, yet there is a lesson for intelligent minds: we spend most of our time arguing over non-issues.

There is a danger in that. If you don’t start out of basic principles, you may, unconsciously, accept certain assumptions. Once you accepted them, they have you: as any practicing psychiatrist will tell you: insane people are often very logical, their logical structure based on crazy assumptions.

You may be sucked into arguing the fifteenth decimal point of a crazy system, but that road leads nowhere, except going around in circles.

Coming up with solid, sane basic principles (axioms as we Physicists call them) requires very clear thinking, honesty and courage. Socrates tried and so he had to die.

You will have to step outside the box and imagine: if you were god, how would you organize humanity (that would be ‘intelligent design’ for a change). What would make sense?

Not what “what would be possible?” because that leads you back to the same circle you are trying to escape. You need to know what the best possible world is, in order to find the next best thing possible. And watch out for your assumptions!

For example: does an intelligent species need money? (wee seem to spend 95% of our time and resources fighting over distribution – maybe everybody would be better off is we started to share based on real human needs – but that is a completely different topic).

Concentrate and focus on the basic principles and assumptions – don’t waste your time arguing over non-issues that tacitly accepts all kinds of assumptions you may not agree with at all.

Rant #2 over.
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17-07-2011, 09:38 AM
RE: Non-Issues we talk so much about

"We Humans are capable of greatness." -Carl Sagan
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17-07-2011, 09:46 AM
RE: Non-Issues we talk so much about
Thanks, NotSoVacuous, exactly what I was referring to!

Big Grin
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