Non-believing Christians???
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04-06-2015, 07:16 AM
RE: Non-believing Christians???
(04-06-2015 05:29 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  I'm starting to think there's no such thing as faith. The things you mention would be enough to damage and taint faith, would an omniscient, angry, judgmental god respect this type of belief?

The fact that hell is a thing for most believers means that there's an inherent fear wrapped up in their beliefs. How much fear can you have until it stops being faith?

How much fear is tolerable until it's tainted enough for Yhwh to get angry and send you to hell?

How would you ever know if you have enough faith? Or if it hasn't been contaminated with fear, so the faith you do have is no longer useful?

If you consider Yhwh to be "perfect", then why would Yhwh be satisfied with an imperfect faith contaminated by fear?

I have gained enough intellectual integrity over the years to proclaim that, if I truly believed in the God of the Bible (or the Koran), I would become a dedicated Satanist.

If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities.--Voltaire.

"To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." --Thomas Paine.
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04-06-2015, 07:19 AM
RE: Non-believing Christians???
(04-06-2015 06:19 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(03-06-2015 07:53 PM)666wannabe Wrote:  I think, as atheists, we need to acknowledge the existence of those (I think a majority) who profess to believe in the fall and redemption story, not because they genuinely believe it, but because they see some extraneous benefit (real or imagined) to claiming to be a believer, such as politicians seeking votes, those who realize economic or social benefits from claiming to believe, those who fear to proclaim their unbelief because of social or familial pressures, etc.

it is not pleasant to accuse someone of lying or being a fake, but I think we need to begin questioning those who claim to believe. This false belief should be referred to as Christianism rather than Christianity.

Thoughts?

What's the criteria for a non-believing Christian? That they don't actually believe there is a God? Or merely that they don't truly subscribe to certain orthodox beliefs? Are liberal christians your idea of non-believing Christians?

I also have a term I often throw around for certain atheists, "closeted believers", typically the sort that hold to humanistic moral sentiments, believe in good, and bad, and shit like that. They are folks for whom the long shadow of religion still hangs over them. Those prone to express moral outrage, and stuff, and over value love, kindness, unselfishness, etc...

I think the criteria would be 1) Belief that a virgin gave birth to the son of God, 2) Belief that the Bible is more sacrosanct than any other book, 3) that Billy Graham is of high moral character.

If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities.--Voltaire.

"To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." --Thomas Paine.
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04-06-2015, 06:09 PM
RE: Non-believing Christians???
(04-06-2015 07:14 AM)666wannabe Wrote:  
(04-06-2015 03:48 AM)Banjo Wrote:  These people owe me nothing and I wont make demands of them. Let them do as they will.

As I've said before, "If religion were just a harmless eccentricity, it would not be a problem." People have a right to believe what they believe, but when they try to push their beliefs onto others and try to force others onto others, it is not just a harmless eccentricity.

The problem is that is exactly what many religions teach them to do. A lot of religions, sure, are more passive. The people who are of the "I've got a little shrine in my closet" variety. But for many others, they have there own "Go ye into all the world" doctrines written into their sacred texts, and that's why atheism is so vocal, and it should be. We could only hope there'll be a day when most of those religions just decide to disregard those verses. Don't think that'll be in my lifetime.

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