North Korea fires intermediate range ballistic missile
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13-02-2017, 11:27 PM
RE: North Korea fires intermediate range ballistic missile
(13-02-2017 10:31 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Cone of Silence be damned. I'll talk national security in front of whoever I damn well please. My authority in such matters cannot be questioned.

After the news spread about North Korea’s actions, Mr. Trump and Abe delivered a brief on-camera statement in which Abe called the missile launch “absolutely intolerable” and Mr. Trump said, “I just want everybody to understand and fully know that the United States of America stands behind Japan, its great ally, 100 percent.”

That is until someone in Japan gets into a Twitter fight with him at 3AM. Dodgy

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14-02-2017, 07:53 AM
RE: North Korea fires intermediate range ballistic missile
(13-02-2017 10:12 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  
(13-02-2017 05:44 PM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  I disagree about the danger of Iran going pro-Soviet. The Tudehs were potent, but still in the minority, and were only found useful by the mullahs in the mid-70s. The repression of the SAVAK had done deep structural damage to the leftist movement in Iran after we Americans had reinstalled the Shah in 1953, and supported his repression thereafter.

Sentiment in Iran was never, so far as I saw, in favor of of a command economy with a centralized decision-making process. The streets and bazaars were rife with carts and stands selling everything from individual condoms to Sony ghetto-blasters -- all businesses which would have suffered under the Tudehs.

Quite so. By "very real danger", I meant without the US-backed interventions against it. Should have been more specific.

Had the geographically adjacent Soviets been more free to lean on the overall Iranian culture (with overt threat of what was happening in the Warsaw Pact nations the Sovs invaded/conquered, if they would not cooperate on their own) and not just the border territories, without the US intervention there, they quite possibly could have gone that route, bazaars not withstanding.

Unfortunately, the USA's "intervention" translated to a repressive dictatorship that favored US corporate/economic interests over those of the people... not that the Sovs would have been any better... and so what we got in '79 was a Theocracy and seething hatred of all things 'Murka that continues (partly) to this day.

Edit to Add: On second thought, I maybe am not giving the Iranians enough credit in their desire to resist the Soviets, given what the Afghanistan "freedom fighters" did against the might of the adjacent Soviet empire. Apples and oranges, of course, since Iran was an industrialized, oil-producing nation, but my point still remains that it required the SAVAK brutality to shut down the leftist movement... and that sort of brutality leads to counter-aggression, under enough pressure.

Fair enough, I should perhaps have inferred your clarification anyway, as it seems so obvious now in hindsight.

I agree with your point about Iranian resistance to any hypothetical Soviet incursion. There is a deep animosity in Iran against the Russians, who have consistently over the last century or two attempted to foment unrest and/or separatism in northern Iran in order to expand Russian control, mainly in northwestern Iran but also in the northeast. I personally think that the meddling of outside powers, no matter their ideology, worked to strengthen the hand of the mullahs, and Russian chicanery would have probably resulted in the ascendancy of theocracy just as our own did -- not because the Iranians are religiously fundamentalist (they aren't), but because the clerical class is politically astute to a degree most Westerners don't understand. And they would certainly, as you suggest, have used religion to fuel resistance to any Russian incursion too.
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